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Arkansas ACT 1235 (SB978) Shuts Down Online Sales

Discussion in 'Legislation News' started by Painter_, Jul 21, 2015.

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  1. Painter_

    Painter_ Super Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Dec 21, 2013
    In my happy place
    http://www.cyclopsvapor.com/blog/arkansas-act-1235-sb978-shuts-down-online-sales/[plain]

    I came across this today, but I do not recall seeing any other news about it. Is there any truth in this?
     
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  2. Lessifer

    Lessifer Vaping Master Verified Member ECF Veteran

    according to this Bill Information the bill was passed, and it did define vapor products as tobacco products. I'm still reading but haven't seen anything specifically banning online sales, though that my be a product of the rules for tobacco sales, or a permit thing.

    So far these are some gems in the law:
    (13) “E-liquid” and "e-liquid product" means a liquid product,
    13 which may or may not contain nicotine, that is vaporized and inhaled when
    14 using a vapor product, and that may or may not include without limitation
    15 propylene glycol, vegetable glycerin, nicotine from any source, and
    16 flavorings;

    (C) “Manufacturer” specifically includes a person that
    14 mixes, compounds, repackages, or resizes e-liquids or vapor products;


    13 (38) "Vapor product" means an electronic oral device of any size
    14 or shape that contains a vapor of nicotine, e-liquid, or any another
    15 substance that when used or inhaled simulates smoking, regardless of whether
    16 a visible vapor is produced, including without limitation a device that:
    17 (A) Is composed of a heating element, battery, electronic
    18 circuit, chemical process, mechanical device or a combination of heating
    19 element, battery, electronic circuit, chemical process or mechanical device;
    20 (B) Works in combination with a cartridge, other container
    21 or liquid delivery device containing nicotine or any other substance and
    22 manufactured for use with vapor products;
    23 (C) Is manufactured, distributed, marketed, or sold as any
    24 type or derivation of a vapor product, e-cigarette, e-cigar, e-pipe, or any
    25 other product name or descriptor; and
    26 (D) Does not include a product regulated as a drug or
    27 device by the Federal Food, Drug, and Cosmetic Act, 21 U.S.C. § 301 et seq.,
    28 as it existed on January 1, 2015;
     
    • Like Like x 3
  3. Utsuru

    Utsuru Ultra Member ECF Veteran

    Jun 20, 2013
    Arkansas, USA
    I just heard about this minutes ago and I am so angry I feel sick. I'm going to go punch a tree.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  4. Painter_

    Painter_ Super Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Dec 21, 2013
    In my happy place
    I do not remember seeing a call to action on this or any other news posting. I must of had my head in the clouds to of missed it.
     
  5. Lessifer

    Lessifer Vaping Master Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Okay, I just finished reading the whole thing. I don't see anything specifically prohibiting online sales. Is there another Arkansas law that prohibits online sales of tobacco products into Arkansas, which would now apply to vapor products?
     
    • Like Like x 1
  6. Robino1

    Robino1 Resting in Peace ECF Veteran

    Moved to Legislation as it would be a better fit here :)

    I've seen this going by on the CASAA facebook page. Ugh!
     
  7. Lessifer

    Lessifer Vaping Master Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Okay, I think I found it:
    "In December 2004, Arkansas similarly banned Internet cigarette retailers when the Supreme Court of Arkansas upheld the Arkansas Tobacco Control Board's ruling that tobacco retailers must have a physical space in the state in order to obtain a license to sell cigarettes directly to consumers in Arkansas."

    From Selling cigarettes online - WORLD Law Direct
    So if the company has no physical presence in the state, they cannot sell online in the state directly to consumers. Although I'm not positive that this was amended to include vapor products, e-liquid.
     
    • Like Like x 4
  8. Utsuru

    Utsuru Ultra Member ECF Veteran

    Jun 20, 2013
    Arkansas, USA
    Looks like I'll never get to try all of the famed legendary juices like Placid, Looper, etc.

    My blood is boiling right now. Words cannot describe how I'm feeling.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  9. Utsuru

    Utsuru Ultra Member ECF Veteran

    Jun 20, 2013
    Arkansas, USA
    Disregard.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  10. Painter_

    Painter_ Super Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Dec 21, 2013
    In my happy place
    Thanks Lessifer for researching this. So since they had a law on the books banning internet cigarette sales as soon as they classified vapor products (including non-nicotine) as tobacco they equate them to cigarettes thus causing a defacto ban on internet sales. So very slick of the them. I almost transferred to Arkansas a few years ago, I am glad that I turned it down.
     
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  11. Utsuru

    Utsuru Ultra Member ECF Veteran

    Jun 20, 2013
    Arkansas, USA
    I hate this state's politics.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  12. stevegmu

    stevegmu Moved On ECF Veteran

    Only cigarettes can't be sold online. They didn't classify e-nic as cigarettes, just as a tobacco product. Loose tobacco can still be sold online...
     
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  13. Smokin' Iron

    Smokin' Iron Senior Member ECF Veteran

    Mar 2, 2014
    Cincinnati, Ohio, USA
    Arkansas politicians probably do not want to ban online sales. They are paving the way to tax vaping the same way they tax tobacco products.

    Politicians and prostitutes both love other peoples money. The only difference is prostitutes have higher morals and integrity.
     
    • Like Like x 11
  14. Utsuru

    Utsuru Ultra Member ECF Veteran

    Jun 20, 2013
    Arkansas, USA
    I fear they're trying to do it in a way as to make Arkansans to buy their products at local retailers where they will be heavily marked up and taxed. I sure hope not. I'm trying to remain positive but I'm finding it really difficult right now.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  15. YoursTruli

    YoursTruli Vaping Master Verified Member ECF Veteran

    May 27, 2012
    Ohio
    http://www.atc.ar.gov/Documents/LCM.pdf
    If you have an existing Retail Cigarette & Tobacco Permit, Wholesale Tobacco Permit or Manufacturer Tobacco Permit, those permits automatically include vapor products and alternative nicotine products effective July 21, 2015.
    Effective July 21, 2015, retailers MUST purchase ALL vapor products, e-liquids and alternative nicotine products from Arkansas licensed wholesalers, Arkansas licensed manufacturers, or fellow Arkansas licensed retailers.
    Also effective July 21, 2015, vapor product, e-liquid and alternative nicotine product invoices must be maintained just like cigarette and tobacco product invoices.
    Retailers should notify their clerks that ATC will begin including vapor products, e-liquids and alternative nicotine products during sale-to-minor compliance checks performed after July 21, 2015.

    In reading over the bill and from a few out of state vendors on reddit it looks like out of state eliquid manufactures have to obtain a permit in order to sell to Arkansas licensed retailers/wholesalers and it is unlawful for them to sell directly to end consumers. So basically it is unlawful for anyone to ship from out of state to consumers in Arkansas. Retail permits in Arkansas require a B&M and only allow over the counter sales, so no online sales for Arkansas shops either.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  16. Utsuru

    Utsuru Ultra Member ECF Veteran

    Jun 20, 2013
    Arkansas, USA
    Well it was fun while it lasted. Looks like I'll be having to pay $175.00 for an IPV4 and $23.00 for 30mL of juice, can't wait, thanks America!
     
  17. rhm3769

    rhm3769 Super Member ECF Veteran

    Aug 15, 2013
    Huntersville, NC
    Not from Arkansas.... But here's a thought from just skimming the postings.... No online sales to consumers and out of state stuff can only be brought in for sale by local businesses, did I read that right? Does it restrict online sales from out of state companies to local B&Ms? See where I'm going? Offer a "special order" service.... It'll be more of a hassle, with fees to use the service but it could be a way to get around, I think....
    Again, I didn't read everything here....
     
  18. stevegmu

    stevegmu Moved On ECF Veteran

    The law would never hold up in a court. A state can't restrict interstate commerce in this manner...
     
    • Like Like x 3
  19. YoursTruli

    YoursTruli Vaping Master Verified Member ECF Veteran

    May 27, 2012
    Ohio
    The bill classifies vapor products as tobacco products thereby inherently prohibits any online retail or direct online B2C sales of any "vapor product, alternative nicotine product or e-liquid product" to occur within the Arkansas state line.
    I hope someone challenges it but I feel it's going to take everyone nationwide coming together and funding it.

    Commerce Clause Limitations on State Regulation
    The Commerce Clause is a grant of power to Congress, not an express limitation on the power of the states to regulate the economy. At least four possible interpretations of the Commerce Clause have been proposed. First, it has been suggested that the Clause gives Congress the exclusive power to regulate commerce. Under this interpretation, states are divested of all power to regulate interstate commerce. Second, it has been suggested that the Clause gives Congress and the states concurrent power to regulate commerce. Under this view, state regulation of commerce is invalid only when it is preempted by federal law. Third, it has been suggested that the Clause assumes that Congress and the states each have their own mutually exclusive zones of regulatory power. Under this interpretation, it becomes the job of the courts to determine whether one sovereign has invaded the exclusive regulatory zone of the other. Finally, it has been suggested that the Clause by its own force divests states of the power to regulate commerce in certain ways, but the states and Congress retain concurrent power to regulate commerce in many other ways. This fourth interpretation, a complicated hybrid of two others, turns out to be the approach taken by the Court in its decisions interpreting the Commerce Clause.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  20. stevegmu

    stevegmu Moved On ECF Veteran

    There is no federal law, as of yet, so state law can not restrict the sale of a product which is not regulated by the federal government, just within the state.
     
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