Arkansas ACT 1235 (SB978) Shuts Down Online Sales

[Painter_]

http://www.cyclopsvapor.com/blog/arkansas-act-1235-sb978-shuts-down-online-sales/[plain]

I came across this today, but I do not recall seeing any other news about it. Is there any truth in this?

 

[Smokin' Iron]

Arkansas politicians probably do not want to ban online sales. They are paving the way to tax vaping the same way they tax tobacco products.

Politicians and prostitutes both love other peoples money. The only difference is prostitutes have higher morals and integrity.

 

[Tomorrow AR]

There continues to be confusion on the subject here in Arkansas. Yesterday Provape wouldn't even let me order a replacement spring for the P3 because I am in Arkansas. I quickly fired off some angry emails to my state representatives and to the Arkansas Tobacco Control board. The law, at least the way it is being interpreted by the Arkansas Tobacco Control board, does NOT ban online ordering of hardware in general. Here is an excerpt from the email I received from them: "Hardware, absent material to actually produce vapor (e.g. a filled tank, an impregnated wick, etc.…) is not regulated at all and can be purchased by anyone from anyone, anywhere". The attorney who responded to me actually invited vendors to contact him personally for the correct interpretation. His complete email response is below. I, for one, will continue to hound my representatives here in Arkansas to change the law to allow online ordering of e-juice. Restricting me to juice from a local vape shop is ludicrous.

T. Morrow
Bentonville, Arkansas

 

[skoony]

I don't know what B&Ms you're talking to that said there was any tax increase. Every manufacture I've spoken with hasn't said "sucks to be you" They all ask what they need to do if anything in order to comply.

Maybe I'm an ... for thinking this way, but honestly the licensing and all needed to be done. Why? Because it stops or slows people down trying to open a shop to mix juice on the cheap for fast profit, among other things. Not everyone is good people, not everyone cares about you. This is forcing basic structuring.
Is it setting up for future taxes? Well of course. They had to put the business type somewhere.. Did you want pharma? Does that mean it's getting taxed? No. Will it? That's up to the 13 people that will probably show up to the Capitol like last time.


Sent from my SM-G920P using Tapatalk

there are no taxes now.
regulations are precursors to taxation.
the administrative costs of the new requirements
have to be paid for. inspections and enforcement.
a cut for the states general fund etc..,etc... .
i for one see no need other than the sanitary
regulation concerning handling food.
those are already on the books.
if you understand that the ingredients in e-juice
are recognized as GRAS and are FDA food grade or
better it means they are already made to strict
government regulations and standards.
the actual process of making juice is inherently
easy,simple and,safe.
as long as a little care is taken in making sure
the nicotine levels are accurate the worst possible
thing that could happen would be a batch of bad
tasting juice. i realize no one wants bad tasting
juice but,its not going to kill you.
i have no fear of those so-called people that are
going to whip up a batch of poison to make a profit.
that's fear mongering. to adulterate e-juice one would
have to do so deliberately with malice and aforethought
or be negligent beyond belief. no laws or regulations
will stop that.
basically making e-juice is measuring and mixing 4 or
5 ingredients with hopefully clean mixing containers and
utensils. its not extracting plutonium.
the only thing these regulations do is prevent people
from starting a business on their own and obtaining the
American Dream.

regards
mike

 

[Max0819]

Well well. I do believe that Coke and Pepsi are next. See they contain caffeine, caffeine is a dangerous drug and a stimulant, very near to nicotine. As such, from now on all soft drinks, that may or may not contain caffeine, that may or may not contain flavorings, that may or may not contain high fructose corn syrup, sugars, or other sweetening products, that may or may not contain water (naturally occurring, filtered, recycled, or otherwise, henceforth called 'fluids'), this includes any 'dry' packets that the consumer may blend with sweeteners or fluids, as well as their liquid 'drip' alternatives, shall from this date forward, be considered a tobacco like product.

Dearest Nanny may I have a cookie?
Heavens no child they are bad for you.
Oh please Dearest Nanny, may I have some oatmeal in the shape of a cookie?
Heavens no child, someone might see you and think you are eating a cookie.
Oh please dearest sweet Nanny, I promise to hide by the garbage in the alley and not be seen.
Child unfortunately eating fake cookies might lead to you wanting real cookies, so no.

---- time passes ------

Child come to your Nanny please.
Yes dear Nanny, what can I do for you?
Child after considering it for some time, and studying the issues at great length, while considering all of the potential pitfalls and spending great sums of money on private testing, as well as talking with industry executives and their advisers, I, that is We, have determined that you may indeed have an oatmeal cookie. Please understand that it may not look like a cookie, nor taste like one, and in point of fact, will not actually contain oatmeal, but some substance that the advisers have assured me will be okay and uniquely designed for fit and purpose, carefully controlled by a few select companies. Given all this effort and time, you will of course have top pay ten times as much for this 'Cookie' and I will have to get another 70+% on top of that, for, as previously mentioned the potential harmful effects, and you may only purchase them at stores that have properly paid me for a license and agreed to restrict availability, all you need to do is show them the Identification that I will provide to you for a fee. Okay?

Oh yes dearest Nanny. Thank you thank you thank you. Thank you for looking out for my welfare, monitoring my whereabouts and product usage, and of course for caring enough to collect additional funding for my future potential health care of this unknown product.

Oh Nanny may I please.......


Max

 

[Utsuru]

The real reason I believe this went into effect is because Arkansas is likely one of the leading states when it comes to tobacco consumption. For the most part it is rural and uneducated so I assume a high percentage of the population either uses dipping tobacco or smokes cigarettes. With vaping becoming more mainstream and vaping B&M's popping up all over the state, the millionaires and billionaires that profit from Big Tobacco are simply protecting their bottom line. If they're going to lose money from people quitting tobacco and switching to vaping, you can guarantee they're going to find a way to get as much, if not more money from the vaping side of things. This sets it up so that people can only buy supplies from B&M stores and also classifies vaporizer products and e-liquid as tobacco products which we all know is complete BS. There is no tobacco in any of my juices besides the ones that are tobacco flavored. This is all about money, it's not about "the children" or safety, it's money money money.

To buy from online vendors you need to check a box saying you're 18, usually agree to a terms of service and if you're like me, using a credit card that should verify age. If they really wanted to make sure the person ordering was who they said they were, then have them sign for the package like another poster suggested in this thread.

The tobacco companies and pharmaceutical companies, oncology industry, etc. see themselves losing money and they're not going to let that happen, not when they control so much of the government due to their money and power.

America needs a revolution.

 

[DC2]

The face of the enemy.
Okay, well, one of many of their faces.

It seems that ANR wants to take the title...
"leading national lobbying organization (501 (c) 4), dedicated to nonsmokers' rights"

But let's not forget Campaign for Tobacco Free Kids (CTFK) created entirely by Big Pharma...
FORCES International - News Portal

Or the American Lung Association for that matter.

And now Big Government is jumping into the fray with full force.
Gotta keep that tax money flowing now that electronic cigarettes are making a sizable dent.

And Big Tobacco, who stood on the sidelines for so long...
Now they are sponsoring legislation across the country to keep them on top of the game...

The entire scenario lends itself very well to understanding how the world works.
And the world doesn't work in the way it should.

 

[Kent C]

Please understand that it may not look like a cookie, nor taste like one, and in point of fact, will not actually contain oatmeal, but some substance that the advisers have assured me will be okay

 

[AndriaD]

Just talked to someone on another forum from Arkansas that had their package stopped/refunded. This is so messed up.

I won an Innokin Disrupter here on ECF that's coming from China and 150ml from a contest on here from within the US. I hope they make it to me, especially the Disrupter. I only have two working mods.

If this was happening in, say, Texas, California, Colorado, Florida, etc. this thread would have 10x more pages and would likely be at the top of General Discussion.

I'm trying not to be angry about it but I'm not a Buddhist monk.

I understand you're angry, and I don't blame you; I'm angry about it, and I don't even live there. But it wasn't all those other states who did this to Arkansas... your own lawmakers did this. A much better venting of your wrath would be directly TO THEM. Let them know that their days are numbered -- VERY LOUDLY and often. Griping about it on a forum isn't going to change anything, and they aren't going to listen to people who don't live there -- I've tried in the past to contact lawmakers from other states, and most of them won't even take the email.

Andria

 

[Rossum]

Dearest Nanny may I have a cookie?
Heavens no child they are bad for you.
Oh please Dearest Nanny, may I have some oatmeal in the shape of a cookie?
Heavens no child, someone might see you and think you are eating a cookie.
Oh please dearest sweet Nanny, I promise to hide by the garbage in the alley and not be seen.
Child unfortunately eating fake cookies might lead to you wanting real cookies, so no.

Quoted for posterity.

"Freedom begins when you tell Mrs. Grundy to go fly a kite."

 

[Max0819]

Yeah, it's truly pathetic; all these gov't people: "we're so stupid, we can't even balance a budget without the help of all those filthy addicts; so keep smoking, filthy addicts, out there by the dumpster where we've exiled you, you're propping up the budget that we can't manage without you killing yourselves for the "public weal."

Andria

Heck fire, in my state they have ostracized, criminalized, and well, just made us (smokers) so unwelcome and over taxed, that many have gone, and many have quit, and the budget dropped like a stone. What to do? Well, of course, lets forget about all the HUGE HUGE expense over the last couple decades, the HUGE expensive built up infrastructure, and of course the crazily immense population of inmates in our jails and prisons, some on 3rd strike 25 year sentences, not too mention all those who got filthy rich within that system.
Forget all the rhetoric you've been spewing about how bad it is for the public, etc etc etc. Gosh Darnit, make the Mary Jane legal by crakety.

Not decriminalized (can't tax or charge for licensing etc and fees etc), L-E-G-A-L an Ounce in your pocket used to get you 5-10 years for being a drug pusher, now it gets you thanks from the Treasurer.

Its all, I mean all, about the Benjamins................

I guarantee you, our forefathers would have been dumping tea in the sound at just the illegal taxation of tobacco, let alone all the rights stripped by DEA, TSA, Patriot Act, and on. Wait until the TSA starts asking for ID as you traverse state to state. lol

Max

 

[Kent C]

Just pointing out that this is no longer a "partisan" party thing

It's never been a partisan party thing at the state level - mainly at the federal level. It's a 'we know what's best for you' thing, and that comes from most democrats and some republicans. The lead sponsor of this is Republican Eddie Joe Williams who is also the Majority Leader - where when someone is in long enough to get that position, you have someone who doesn't represent conservative/libertarian views - I give you Boehner and McConnell - although Boehner - perhaps seeing the train coming, requested a new grandfather date. Eddie Joe, has sponsored the "Ten Commandments' Bill in Ark. as well as other 'we know what's best for you' stuff' including some on abortion, school safety and others.

That said, and in accordance with other posts by Andria about how the longer they're in, the worse they get (an earlier Cato study came to the same conclusion as to the rather reticent attitude of the newer members on spending (and taxes) vs. the elaborate spending of their 'elder statesmen' )...

An Antidote to Federal Red Ink: Term Limits

"We examine recent key votes on budget and tax issues and compare the voting behavior of the members of Congress with 6 years or less in the House and 12 years or less in the Senate (junior members) with that of the members with more than 6 and 12 years experience (veterans). We find that if only the junior members of Congress had been voting in recent years--as would be the case if all members were term limited--many popular fiscal reforms would have been approved, including a balanced-budget amendment, a line-item veto for the president, and the Penny-Kasich spending cuts. We also find that both President Bush's [GHW] and President Clinton's record tax increases would have been defeated. Because members of Congress become more pro-tax-and-spend the longer they serve in Washington, term limits would probably lead to more fiscal restraint on Capitol Hill."

... I'm all for voting out incumbents of any flavor, who sponsor and vote for regulation on vaping, including my Gov. Kasich, Sen. Sherrod Brown and Rep. Marcy Kaptur.

 

[Racehorse]

... I'm all for voting out incumbents of any flavor, who sponsor and vote for regulation on vaping, including my Gov. Kasich, Sen. Sherrod Brown and Rep. Marcy Kaptur.

I''ve said in the past, BOTH parties want voters to "take the lazy way out" and just do the "vote the party line" thing.......and anyone who doesn't look behind the curtain can be hood winked by voting that way.

It's like people who tell me "buy this brand of chicken, it has no hormones!" which is the marketing on the package, and then I have to point out to them that since hormone use in poultry production is illegal in the United States, that there aren't any brands of chicken that have them.

I am an issues voter, so I vote both Republican and Democrat. I am not registered as either. Since the issues change every year, so does my voting patterns.

Just saying that I think it naive to "just assume" that any one party is going to ensure that your vaping routine won't be affected in any way. To be honest, I know of few states that are going to not go for that tax money.....and if they do, they will figure out another way to get it from their taxpayers.

It's like in low income tax states, sales taxes and personal taxes and even fees to buy licsences and stuff is way higher.

We have to examine things very carefully these days!

 

[Kent C]

On the Left it's about protecting the public. (from themselves )

On the Right it's a moral crusade

No thanks... to both.

 

[DC2]

All I'm going to say about any of this political stuff is...

I took an awesome quiz the other day...
2016 Presidential Election Quiz

I've never had to think so hard in my life.
My head hurt when I was done.

Sparked a lot of very interesting conversation with my wife too.
We mostly agreed on almost everything but one big question.

I won't say which one though.

 

[Max0819]

Classic example of an addict. We should make his addiction so expensive through product cost and taxes, that he will simply quit cold turkey. Well, either that or just become poorer, perhaps destitute, living on the streets, perhaps gettin freaky with the Grouch just to share his sweet garbage can. Committing untold vile acts to pay for his now crazy expensive habit, making dark back alley deals for substance available only via the black market, shunned by the propagandized lemmings....wait we are talking about cookies here...think it can't happen?....Didn't Arkansas say that PG, VG, and the nebulous 'flavorings' whether mixed or not are illegal?.........

Max

 

[nicnik]

Oh yes dearest Nanny. Thank you thank you thank you. Thank you for looking out for my welfare, monitoring my whereabouts and product usage, and of course for caring enough to collect additional funding for my future potential health care of this unknown product.

Oh Nanny may I please.......


Max

I wouldn't trust those Nanny cookies, Max. The people behind them say bad things about you and about your fondness of oatmeal cookies. You're better off breaking Nanny's rules to get the oatmeal cookies you deserve. And make sure to have Nanny replaced when you grow up.

 

[Rossum]

How could a girl ride!?? :- )

Side-saddle?

Either that or do the Lady Godiva thing in protest. Personally, I'd suggest the latter, just as I'd recommend the good folks of AR ignore the fact that it's now illegal to order e-liquids from out-of-state.

 

[YoursTruli]

Seriously I have to think this is why (new laws like this) the federal has been foot dragging, why should they be the bad guys when it all can be taken care of at the state and local levels? If states can classify vapor products as tobacco products does it really matter if they do at the federal level? We have already seen a slew of communities lumping vaping in with smoking when it comes to bans/regulations isn't that the same as classifying it as tobacco products? Everyone has been so worried about things at the federal level they forgot to watch for the knife in the back at the more local levels until they feel the blade.

 

[nicnik]

They're liberal in the sense of knowing what's best for *everyone* and intending to carry that out

Conservatives do that, too, with their own issues. Both liberals and conservatives have many among them who attempt, and sometimes succeed, in taking freedoms away form us. I dislike the intolerance in both camps.