You already live in a nanny state and it's getting worse by the day. Demonrats want the US to be Venezuela or worse.
Article about vaping and 18650 in a mainstream media
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I agree, and I find it frustrating that people think the demopublicans and the republicrats are two separate political parties, when they are, in fact, a two headed monoparty working for the multinational corporate ruling body.
You have come out for what you are, a seller of regulations in this forum. No thanks. I noted that you are in Switzerland because there, and throughout the EU, government does work on behalf of an alert, informed citizenry, and things that are banned there, to the detriment of multinational corporations, are allowed here in the US, to benefit multinational corporations. My government does not work to protect me. My government works to protect companies that make things, or genetically modify things, or have nuclear accidents. FDA in charge of vaping, no thanks.
Now, if you want to go after makers of 18650 batteries, of which some are better made and safer than others, go after those manufacturers. Take pictures of your poster children and make posters. Picket the factories. Whatever you want. I would even participate in that, but don't try selling me some alarmist news article about vaping and try to make me think people are not already thinking intelligently about the future of vaping, or that FDA will do anything good for vapers.
Oh please, really? Why must everything be black or white?
You can’t see or admit that there’s a lot of areas where government regulations and oversight is good or even necessary, while still being critical of it? Again, I appreciate that the government makes car manufacturers recall and repair their cars if there’s something wrong safety-wise, but I’m also against vaping regulations.
And if you think that in Europe it’s better in that regard, I don’t think so. The USA is probably the country where its citizens enjoy the most liberties in the world, except some rich, very small countries maybe.
I’ve just spotted that now..: What is your problem? I have merely posted a link to an article about vaping and batteries in a mainstream medium, because I think it’s interesting to see what kind of information people outside of our ‘bubble’ get served. I didn’t sell you anything, you don’t have to read it if you don’t think it’s interesting....
Take it easy, it’s just a discussion.
Right. GB for example isn't even governed at all! And to call their citizens "informed", would be a very bold statement as well.Governments within the EU work on behalf of an alert, informed citizenry?
Okay already, but I follow food more than anything, and I know you can buy pure dairy foods in the EU, where animals are not injected with genetically modified hormones to increase their production, so you get to have milk without pus in it from the irritated udders of the "boosted" cows. Not only no pus, but Swiss, French and Spanish cheese and butter taste so much better. I also found a brand of butter called Devonshire, I think, from the UK, and I'd take it any day over an American brand. Big ag controls the conversation here in the US, so very few people look skeptically at the robbing of nature's bank of time and evolution with the casual genetic modification of basic food crops, of which the pollen drift cannot be contained, and mostly clumsily shot with the dna of a bacteria. I could get even more controversial about government's role in pushing pharmaceutical products here, but I'll leave it with food in order to avoid an off topic sh*t storm. I really don't know what the outcome of vaping regulation will be, but I expect it to favor big tobacco or big pharma (medicalization of vaping). Vaping, for politicians and regulators, is a delicious sin for taxing, to make the zombie hoards think government is working for them. Vaping, for pharma, is a delicious smoking cessation product to replace all of pharma's stop-smoking schemes that never worked. Vaping, for big tobacco, is a serious threat, and I don't think big tobacco even knows where to start, when it comes to the open systems we enjoy so much. Think "cigalike".Governments within the EU work on behalf of an alert, informed citizenry?
TL;DR'ed a lot of this. Had to. 
I just don't follow all of this mainstream media @#$% drama. I do not buy newspapers, I never watch TV or radio news. Politics? No thanks. You are constantly bombarded with all those frequencies which seep into your subconscious. Unless you are an enoughly developed human being, with the ability to clearly discern the good from the bad and true ability to reject bad beliefs thanks to screening mind programs, you may be serving as cannon fodder. May be.
I was an smoker and many sorts of drugs addict. All of it is gone for good and forever. Had to get informed, empowered and even request special healing services for that to happen. It's been a tough ride, a mind reprogramming one.
I particularly do not allow any external powers to run on me any more than it already is, and actively walk the path to re-empower myself and continue reprogramming my mind. Fellows please believe right, believe in the co-creator which is you.
I will continue exerting my right to buy li-ion cells at affordable/industrial pricing no matter what. Really.
To governments and other powers that be: I COMMAND YOU to stop messing with me, my cells and/or batteries. Period!
I just don't follow all of this mainstream media @#$% drama. I do not buy newspapers, I never watch TV or radio news. Politics? No thanks. You are constantly bombarded with all those frequencies which seep into your subconscious. Unless you are an enoughly developed human being, with the ability to clearly discern the good from the bad and true ability to reject bad beliefs thanks to screening mind programs, you may be serving as cannon fodder. May be.
I was an smoker and many sorts of drugs addict. All of it is gone for good and forever. Had to get informed, empowered and even request special healing services for that to happen. It's been a tough ride, a mind reprogramming one.
I particularly do not allow any external powers to run on me any more than it already is, and actively walk the path to re-empower myself and continue reprogramming my mind. Fellows please believe right, believe in the co-creator which is you.
I will continue exerting my right to buy li-ion cells at affordable/industrial pricing no matter what. Really.
To governments and other powers that be: I COMMAND YOU to stop messing with me, my cells and/or batteries. Period!
I don't pay attention either but I am surrounded by folks that do, so like, I get to hear about and say, "You dumb liberal/conservative/progressive."
My impression from all the information I am getting so far is like, we need to BURN the white house down, and definitely congress and probably the supreme court too.
Some police departments need to be investigated too. Not to mention stating to certain states that they need to behave better (CA I am TALKING TO YOU) or be seceded from the Union and they can fend for themselves.
Also those states should be treated more harshly than other illegal immigrants because they're the ones who RUINED our government a LOT.
Actually perhaps I just want to move to Texas and have IT secede from the Union, that might be the easiest way.
I sound like Madonna. That sucks. If there's someone you never want to sound like, it's probably Madonna. To be fair, she just hates Trump and I HATE EVERYONE. So, I'm not a bigot.
Anna
My impression from all the information I am getting so far is like, we need to BURN the white house down, and definitely congress and probably the supreme court too.
Some police departments need to be investigated too. Not to mention stating to certain states that they need to behave better (CA I am TALKING TO YOU) or be seceded from the Union and they can fend for themselves.
Also those states should be treated more harshly than other illegal immigrants because they're the ones who RUINED our government a LOT.
Actually perhaps I just want to move to Texas and have IT secede from the Union, that might be the easiest way.
I sound like Madonna. That sucks. If there's someone you never want to sound like, it's probably Madonna. To be fair, she just hates Trump and I HATE EVERYONE. So, I'm not a bigot.
Anna
Anna, you just put yourself on every national security "watch list" in just one post. Good job.
When I have my tinfoil hat on I start thinking the sole purpose that Juul was created was to cause a problem that would allow Big Brother to stick it’s nose into the vaping scene. I think I even read somewhere that a big chunk of it is owned by Altria.
Essentially stick it in gas stations, scream “the babies” and boom, the other madness all over again. Chess, not checkers.
It’s easy to see your opponents intentions when they don’t necessarily stick to reality..
These sorts of things are common when tokens trump logic, reason, truth etc etc.
Essentially stick it in gas stations, scream “the babies” and boom, the other madness all over again. Chess, not checkers.
It’s easy to see your opponents intentions when they don’t necessarily stick to reality..
These sorts of things are common when tokens trump logic, reason, truth etc etc.
I don't think so. The Deeming Reg was proposed in the spring of 2014, a solid year before Juul entered the market. The Deeming was finalized, without a whole lot of changes, two years later. Juul was on available then, but hadn't yet taken off in a big way.
What Juul did is to displace Njoy, Mark Ten, and Vuse in the gas station and c-store market because it was a product that was actually effective. Hardly anyone bought the former three products because open systems were so much better.
By conquering the mass market (and especially the under-age market), Juul has actually been a foil for us open-system vapers. They've distracted the ANTZ and the FDA's attention away from us. Notice that the FDA simply hasn't bothered trying to enforce against open system gear that entered the market after the 8/8/16 cut-off date? Nothing new was supposed to be introduced after that date without going through the PMTA process first.
Now imagine how different things would be if the kiddies were still into cloud chasing with open systems, like they were for a while before Juul took over that market.
Yes, Altria owns a 35% stake in Juul. They bought in (to the tune of ~$13 billion) late last year. Juul was independent before that.
I agree with you @Rossum . I can't blame JUUL for inventing a "cigalike" that actually performs well and works for most smokers to quit smoking. I give them credit for that. I can't really blame them for "selling out" to Altria (Big Tobacco). That was a decision that made the most sense for them from a business and political perspective. Before their merger with Altria, no independent e-cig maker had the marketing or financial power to advertise about vaping on an international scale. Now we see advertisements on television and radio promoting vaping as an option to quit smoking. Before that, the only widespread marketing for vaping was products like Blu and Vuse (also Big Tobacco) whose products primarily sucked (IMHO).
I'm not convinced that JUUL should be blamed for their popularity among teens, either. The very reason that the JUUL is popular among teens is the same reason its popular with adults. It's popularity is it's discreet form factor, it has enjoyable flavors, and it WORKS.
Is it JUUL's fault that it was sold where teens were most likely to get their hands on them? Specifically gas stations and convenience stores where photo ID's are not often asked for? IMHO its these businesses who are most to blame for the "teen vaping epidemic", not vape shops who have more to lose if they sell to underage customers.
I'm not convinced that JUUL should be blamed for their popularity among teens, either. The very reason that the JUUL is popular among teens is the same reason its popular with adults. It's popularity is it's discreet form factor, it has enjoyable flavors, and it WORKS.
Is it JUUL's fault that it was sold where teens were most likely to get their hands on them? Specifically gas stations and convenience stores where photo ID's are not often asked for? IMHO its these businesses who are most to blame for the "teen vaping epidemic", not vape shops who have more to lose if they sell to underage customers.
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IIRC, Altria is even putting Juul coupons in packs of Marlboro.
But there another reason why that move made sense: Altria's experience at dealing with the FDA and submitting PMTA paperwork. At the time of the transaction late last year, the PMTA for IQOS had not yet been approved, but it had been submitted a year and a half earlier, and I'm confident there were revisions and considerable back-and-forth between the FDA and Altria's team.
Keep in mind that only two PMTAs have ever been approved: The one for Swedish Match snus, and more recently, Altria's for IQOS.
Since the Deeming was proposed before Juul ever entered the market, Juul knew they would have to file a PMTA sooner or later. Getting a partner with proven expertise at this made all kinds of sense.
If you think I haven't already been there, and been there for a long time, I think you'd be wrong. The husband and I have been "checked'" but the FBI a few times, the last being when my sis needed a super high clearance for her 9th circuit job which she can't even say what it is. She's a lawyer. I was worried that she might not get through because of Me, but it turned out fine.
Seriously I almost went contracting for a DOCA position and from what the guy asked me, I would have passed the background check.
Sigh, I like to think the watch list has a sense of humor, but probably not "HIIII!!!:
Anna
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