Back to vaping after long break, some questions about TC mode

[k3lt]

My current setup is vaporesso Armour Pro 100W + Kylin Mini, i'm in process of buying all the stuff but for now i have only 1 wire to work with which is GeekVape SS 316L (26GA).

First of all i'm mostly confused why my coil doesn't change resistance when vaping, i heard it should happen and is normal with SS wire in TC mode, the coil i'm using currently is simple round spaced one with 4.5 wraps & 3mm diameter which is 0.34Ω, wick made with organic cotton - Bocoton, but i picked up Muji just today so will try that later.

The rest of the settings i'm currently using is 92 TCR, temp. at 180-200C (356-392F) and power at 20W. And btw. i'm also confused what Power value i'm supposed to use, how can i calculate it? Higher wattage is just used to obtain the correct temperature faster?

The vape i'm getting is mediocre with decent clouds but the flavor is on the low side, also i feel it hits the throat too much even i'm using such low settings, there is also very slight cotton after taste (but it's definitely not dry hit) actually i'm not sure if this could be hot spot, bad wicking or i'm just using liquid with too much nicotine which i'm not used to. I can see the coil/wick through the drip tip and it looks pretty wet.
Literally started vaping yesterday and that's my first coil and first time with TC mode, any tips? Mostly i'm interested in what coils i should be working with in TC (what resistance to use with which temp/wattage)

Cheers.

Edit: actually managed to take photo of my current coil, maybe it will be helpful:

 

[PapawBrett]

I am by no means an expert. Trust me on that ...
Are your coils touching ? They should be spaced. When I use a TC mod, I usually use 20 Watts and around 400*F, so that sounds about right. And SS 316 is the same wire that I (and several others) use. Sounds ridiculous, but next time the tank is empty check the coil set screw for tightness ?
Patient, someone who knows more will come along ....

 

[bombastinator]

I personally got fairly mediocre results from TC mode in general till I started using replay. My suspicion is turn your max temp up a bit. It’s only a suspicion though. Everything else sounds and looks right.

 

[Letitia]

Welcome to ECF k3lt.
Have you tried just using wattage/power mode? SS is safe to use in wattage as well. Better to first use on that setting so you know what you're looking for in tc settings. It's more helpful to post a picture of your build from the side so we can better see your coil placement and wick.

 

[PapawBrett]

I will add this much - The vapor I get from a TC mod does not match the vapor I get from a strait mech.
The power fluctuations of TC will effect your vapor production.

 

[k3lt]

I personally got fairly mediocre results from TC mode in general till I started using replay. My suspicion is turn your max temp up a bit. It’s only a suspicion though. Everything else sounds and looks right.

Increasing max temp gives me unpleasant harsh throat hit, but again i just started vaping so maybe i'm just not used to it, i'll give it a shot.
I'd really love if you guys could give me rough idea of temp / wattage to use with different resistances in TC, i will probably try 1 wrap more on my next coil which should end up with resistance around 0.45Ω - to compensate higher resistance i will have to increase Power (wattage), i'm thinking right?

Btw. i'm not really a cloud chaser, flavor is definitely my priority.

 

[Opinionated]

Okay, so Temperature control JUST controls temperature - it does not control watts.

You still have to adjust the wattage for the coil your using. I don't use coils as low as you, but for a 26 gauge stainless, if I remember correctly, I set a 1.4 ohm 316L SS coil at 14 or so watts. (I don't often use TC mode, it's not my personal preference, but I've use it before)

you, on the other hand, have your coil which is a full ohm lower than I build at only 6 watts more..

You need to start increasing your watts.

For now, keep your temperature at your default setting or about 400 degrees F. and increase the watts until your getting a nice flavorful vape that's that the correct power level for your coil, for that low a coil I don't know, just start going up.

Then after your watts are set, adjust your temperature up or down to your liking. If you like a warmer vape increase temp, or a cooler one then lower it (some people vape around 440, others 380 so there's a range in there you may prefer to explore), and then the mod will keep it at that exact vape for you every time you take a drag.

For TC vaping you’ll use wires that have a known resistance-increase as its temperature rises. The mod checks the resistance of the coil at room temperature, then it continues to monitor it as you vape. The resistance change is converted into a temperature increase and the mod adjusts its power to maintain the selected temperature. Think of it like a car traveling in cruise control. To maintain a speed, more power is needed to go up a hill than down a hill… but the speed would stay the same.

A Beginner's Guide to Vaping with Temperature Control [2018]

Your setting it to the EXACT vape you want, then setting cruise control. There is a natural rise and fall that you get in wattage mode, that disappears in TC mode. It's the most consistent (and in my opinion boring) vape possible. lol..

 

[Skunk!]

I use TC with high wattage and low temperature. I think it was 70W and 410°. I usually vape at 35-40W on a single coil
With it set up that way, it wil fire fast but not burn the wick. I don't pay too much attention to resistance on regulated mods. I build for the surface area I like. Mine usually end up in the .35 to .4 range.
I use only SS wire. I notice I get a lot of fluctuation with my resistance when I am glowing the coils. With juicy wicks not so much. If the resistance was an issue then I would think you would be getting dry/burnt hits. I would put an extra wrap or 2 on your next build and see how you like that. More resistance will give you the results you are looking for with lower power.
What worked for me with spaced coils was to make a contact coil and stretch it out a bit on the jig, then pull the legs tight when you install the coil. I get perfectly spaced coils by doing it this way.

 

[Eskie]

Hi, a few things. First, when the coil is at room temperature, like for real, not after a test fire or whatever, mount the tank and lock the resistance. Sone/most mods do TC better that way. Don't worry about not seeing a change in resistance, some mods don't display real time dynamic resistance but still do it internally for TC.

The wattage to select is the one that gets the coil to heat quickly, but also reach the temperature you set. For example, if you set 20W but the coil only heats to 150C with that wattage, well, you're not going to ever get a 200C vape.

Try 30W. If it heats quickly, and even better flashes temp protect you're in the right area. That temp protect is not a warning or error, just the mod telling you it's at 200C and keeping it there for you. So adjust your wattage accordingly.

Some mods do not do TC well. Just because it has the feature it's pretty useless if poorly executed, and it's sorta hard to execute well. Hopefully with a bit of the above you'll have a better vape.

 

[bombastinator]

Increasing max temp gives me unpleasant harsh throat hit, but again i just started vaping so maybe i'm just not used to it, i'll give it a shot.
I'd really love if you guys could give me rough idea of temp / wattage to use with different resistances in TC, i will probably try 1 wrap more on my next coil which should end up with resistance around 0.45Ω - to compensate higher resistance i will have to increase Power (wattage), i'm thinking right?

Btw. i'm not really a cloud chaser, flavor is definitely my priority.

Nope. more resistance means lower wattage. I use 10w for a 1ohm coil in a MTL berserker mini I use of that helps any.

 

[k3lt]

I've read a bunch of reviews about this mod before buying it's actually performing exceptionally well in TC i'm fairly sure that's not the issue, anyway i'll try with more wraps and Muji instead of Bocoton this time hopefully i'll get better results, thanks for the response guys.

 

[k3lt]

So after making new coil it seems to be so much better, harsh throat hit is completely gone (i'm using 6mg liquid instead of 12mg so it could be that) and the cotton after taste is non existant even at 250C , i'm getting better flavor and insane clouds even i didn't really aim for them..
I have 6 wraps now but by a mistake i made 2mm inner diameter so the resistance didn't increase that much (0.36Ω now) i will fix that after emptying the tank, so my current settings are TCR 92, 230C temp and power at 35W.
Again thanks, now i have much better understanding of the "basics" and what to play with.. vape on.

I'm just slightly confused about the cotton after taste on previous setup, because after removing the coil cotton was in perfect condition without any yellow/brown spots, oh well.

 

[ranjen617]

I'm at 55w, 320°F on a 0.24 build myself. You would be maybe a tad less on the watts, try 35-40 range.
I use TC on many mods vs wattage. ...Hope this helps!

 

[Katya]

I'm just slightly confused about the cotton after taste on previous setup, because after removing the coil cotton was in perfect condition without any yellow/brown spots, oh well.

Sometimes new cotton will taste a bit, well, cottony. It needs a little time before it breaks in. But it should go away quickly as the juice completely saturates the wick. Make sure you prime your cotton well before applying heat to the atomizer. Priming means just wetting the coil and the cotton--it's an important step, though.

Cotton will not burn below 420°F (or so, I don't remember the exact number) even if you vape your atty dry--that's the beauty of TC vaping.

Don't worry too much about the resistance with TC vaping; I usually just set my temp. at 320° to ~360°F, my watts at 25 or so and take it from there. If the vape feels sluggish, I increase the wattage until I find my sweet spot.

Good luck and happy vaping!

 

[Katya]

A Beginner's Guide to Vaping with Temperature Control [2018]

Your setting it to the EXACT vape you want, then setting cruise control. There is a natural rise and fall that you get in wattage mode, that disappears in TC mode. It's the most consistent (and in my opinion boring) vape possible. lol..

Nice guide, however, @mikepetro doesn't recommend vaping above 420° F. Somewhat controversial topic, but I've decided to follow his advice. Just in case. If anybody wants to know why, there's a thread for that.

New studies find carcinogens in vg and pg at high temps, even in tootle puffers

 

[Mordacai]

Hello k3lt, try playing around with your TCR value. SS316L is reported to be around the 88 to 92 range, but depending on supplier / manufacturer it can be outside this range.

Your Watts should be somewhere between 20 to 30, depending on your preference. And temperature somewhere around 250°C.

If you're wondering about the wattage setting, it's what is initially sent to the coil before it reaches temperature and then throttles down. So a lower setting gives you a softer vape experience.

And TCR is hard to explain, your initial coil reading in ohms doesn't change. But as the temperature of the coil changes, so does the resistance. This is how your mod works out the coil temperature.

 

[k3lt]

Ok but how can you tell the TCR is set incorrectly? Also to change TCR i have to "unlock" first, change the value and lock it when the coil is at room temperature is that correct? Or can i just change it freely after resistance has been locked and coil temp doesn't matter?

 

[Opinionated]

Nice guide, however, @mikepetro doesn't recommend vaping above 420° F. Somewhat controversial topic, but I've decided to follow his advice. Just in case. If anybody wants to know why, there's a thread for that.

New studies find carcinogens in vg and pg at high temps, even in tootle puffers

It's controversial and I'm on the other side of the discussion.

There are too many variables for these "conclusions" of his, and I don't go for fear mongering so evolve can sell more boards. Junk science is just junk, and the TC "debate" is based on it.

 

[Mordacai]

k3lt, initial coil resistance reading should be set at room temperature.

Then you should have a DIY setting in your menu I think, I have a Luxe so I think settings should be similar.

Select VT, select settings and set M1 TCR at 88 to 92. And try using each setting for a while to see what you like best. You can also set the wattage there as well, set to your preference.

There's also a lock setting, which locks the initial resistance as well. I use it myself, as GT CCell coils keep on giving me varying readings on a .5 ohm coil. You just have to know the reading of your coil first before using this though, and keep on attaching and removing your atomiser until the mod gives you the right reading and then you can lock it.

 

[Katya]

It's controversial and I'm on the other side of the discussion.

There are too many variables for these "conclusions" of his, and I don't go for fear mongering so evolve can sell more boards. Junk science is just junk, and the TC "debate" is based on it.

Ahem. Have you even read the thread? Dr. Kurt Kistler, Dr. Konstantin Farsalinos, John Bellinger, Brandon Wolfe are not junk scientists. There's plenty of good science in that thread.

You do realize that everything we're using today (vaping-related) has been invented by guys in basements, right? Every vaping innovation has started here, on ECF and similar e-cig forums in Germany, Greece, Russia and other countries. First mods, Trogg's Screwdriver, Little Brother and Little Sister, the Silver Bullet, first fillerless tankomizers, clearomizers, RBAs (Raidy's Genisis), RTAs (SvoeMesto's Kayfun), first vv mods (ProVari), first vw mods, kick, and TC (Evolv's Darwin and DNA), best wicks (everything has been tested from hemp to rayon and beyond), best batteries (tirelessly tested by @Mooch), wires, not to mention eliquids, flavorings, and all the rest. Too many to mention. And I'm getting tired.

Do you know what a syringe mod was? A juice bottle tank? An Altoid tin mod? A flashlight mod?

Above: one of the fist fillerless clearomizers--a modified syringe.

Below: A modified Altoid tin. BTW, that's why we still call them mods. Because they used to be everyday objects modified for use in vaping.

Off my soapbox.

Good luck and happy vaping!