Charging internal battery

[vaper1960]

Anyone remember the old Ni Cad rechargable batteries? I hated them... tempermental and didn't last long enough. Also, you were supposed to avoid charging them at the same level (like every time they are down to 50%) and god help you if you ran them completely down! Anyway, what about the internal battery in a mod? Do any of these issues apply? I assume no battery should be ran completely dead, but should I let it run down to around 25% or is it OK to keep charging even if it's still at 75%?

 

[bombastinator]

Almost all internal batteries are LiPo bag battery chemistry.

Every battery chemistry has its own recommendations for how to get its best from it. LiPo batteries are also use in cell phones and by model airplane and drone fliers. There is extensive info about them there.

 

[Rossum]

It's fine to charge it at any level. Li-ion batteries don't suffer from memory effect like ni-cads.

Now Li-ion batteries do not like to be discharged too far, but a regulated mod with an internal battery prevent that.

 

[HigherStateD]

Iirc, the consensus about lipo is, as long as your not constantly topping off, you're good. It's not a memory effect so much as going up to fill charge stresses it more than a slightly less than full charge. There are even people here buying chargers for their 18650/2x700s that specifically allow less than "full" charges.

 

[vaper1960]

HSD, as usual, you are a great help! Good, don't keep going to full charge... got it.

 

[GOMuniEsq]

I assume no battery should be ran completely dead

Moreover, assuming you've got a regulated mod, "dead" never happens as they refuse to discharge a cell below a certain cutoff voltage which is still well above the cell's danger zone. So if you feel guilty whenever you let your mod die, as I used to, let your conscience be clear.

 

[vaper1960]

Yes, regulated mod. Also good to know. So would an unregulated "mech" mod allow a battery to completely drain?

 

[bombastinator]

Yes, regulated mod. Also good to know. So would an unregulated "mech" mod allow a battery to completely drain?

Yes. In theory. Sort of. Mech mods don’t have voltage support so the batteries act a bit like balloons. They get a bit weaker and more flaccid with every vape. With a mech the coil is what regulates the device. Depending on how a mech is wired it could conceivably be done. In practice though one would attempt to make a coil that would cease to deliver vapor before it kills the battery. If one decided to mash the button even after the the thing stopped producing vapor it could be done though. most commonly the problem is the reverse. A mech deviceoften will only produce a good vape with a fresh battery. The result is the batteries get changed out long before they reach even half full.

This is one of several reasons many people like regulated mods better than mechs. It’s hard to get a consistent vape out of them and they’re quite inefficient in battery use. People talk about “hard hitting” mechs. It’s garbage. The “hard hit” is just high wattage. Which doesn’t last.

 

[GOMuniEsq]

An unregulated device would be like one of those old RC cars that ran on NiCads. It just keeps getting slow and slower as the battery weakens. A regulated device is like a cell phone or laptop, where it works at 100% until it suddenly doesn't work at all.

Regulated means it's got a chip sitting between you and the battery, and the chip has logic that protects the battery from under-voltage/over-discharge and over-voltage/over-charge, so you don't need to think about it. The only thing the chip can't tell is whether the battery is rated to handle the current discharge you demand of it, so that's the main aspect to concern yourself with. With an internal-battery mod even that responsibility is lifted from your shoulders, so you can treat it with as much care as you do your cell phone.

 

[HigherStateD]

I didn't mean for you to interpret what I said to mean don't top it off, but if you never let it get below 80% because you're afraid to be without your vape, that's stressful on the cell. The balloon analogy is apt. They much prefer to be between 65-85%, than at the ends. The over inflated few tenths of a volt at the top only delivers a few hundred maH at best, but it's not nothing. Conversely, at the low end, more amps will be needed for a given wattage, because of the near minimal voltage. Also, not that I think you'll be effected, but near peak wattage will cause sag, meaning the voltage drops with the load, and cut-off happens quicker.

 

[Rossum]

Yes, regulated mod. Also good to know. So would an unregulated "mech" mod allow a battery to completely drain?

In theory it's possible. In practice, this doesn't happen. Wattage to a coil of fixed resistance is equal to the square of the voltage. This means you'll only have about half the wattage once the cell drops below 3.0V that you did when it was fully charged at 4.2V. People generally find that unsatisfactory and change the battery well before it gets that low.

 

[Tabac man]

I've always charged internal Lipo battery mods frequently and to the max. Never had a battery die on me and never had one lose much capacity. Keep em topped up I say and I say it based on my own experience. I did occasionally let em run down to the cut off if I was camping etc, but as a rule they were charged every day even if half full or above.

 

[r77r7r]

I've charged my lipos every which way, whenever. Never an issue with loss of mah or any problems.

 

[stols001]

I was kind of shocked at how low a Dicodes mod will let you drain your battery. I mean, I usually don't let it drain as far as Dicodes seems to think is fine, although I have done it accidently from time to time with no ill effects to the battery.

Just throwing that out there. I'm not saying it's good/bad or anything else. But it IS.

Anna

 

[Baditude]

It's perfectly fine to "top off" your Lipo battery by charging it before it has discharged dead, if that is the worry.

Battery guides may say that a rechargeable battery has a lifetime of 300 charge cycles, or something along that line. Partial charges (topping off) don't count as a charge cycle, so there's no penalty of charging early and often. In fact, doing so will probably extend the overall life of the battery's life.

 

[Rossum]

It's perfectly fine to "top off" your Lipo battery by charging it before it has discharged dead, if that is the worry.

Battery guides may say that a rechargeable battery has a lifetime of 300 charge cycles, or something along that line. Partial charges (topping off) don't count as a charge cycle, so there's no penalty of charging early and often. In fact, doing so will probably extend the overall life of the battery's life.

Yep, although not completely correct, you can visualize it this way: If you have a 3000 mAh battery that's rated to have 70% capacity left after 300 full cycles, if you only pull 1500 mAh from it before charging it you should be able to get ~600 cycles, and if you only pull 1000 mAh from it, you should be able to get ~900 cycles.

The penalty supposedly comes from have a battery spending a lot of time fully charged at (or real close to) 4.2V.

 

[r77r7r]

I generally ran my eGo's down to shut-off and then charged til full. Got 2+ years out of 2 units with daily use. The unregulated Joye Upgrade units.

 

[bobwho77]

The major issue people have with internal battery mods is that lipo batteries start to get less capable of holding a charge after a while.
Once you've gotten to a certain point, the device is rendered unusable, and it has to be replaced.
(unless you have the tools/patience/skills to disassemble what is (essentially) a sealed device, and unsolder/resolder battery connections)
Devices with removable/replaceable batteries avoid the problem, and typically last longer.

 

[Rossum]

(unless you have the tools/patience/skills to disassemble what is (essentially) a sealed device, and unsolder/resolder battery connections)

... and can find a suitable replacement battery.