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My recommendation would be to educate yourself a little so you have a better understanding from the start. Battery drain | Steam Engine | free vaping calculators
There are steam engine tutorials on youtube as well.
You'll need one of these : 2-in-1 Ohm & Voltage Meter
There are steam engine tutorials on youtube as well.
You'll need one of these : 2-in-1 Ohm & Voltage Meter
Cheers sparky but that's kinda useless for me. I just wondered if you don't sub ohm is a protected cell a necessity? Don't worry though I found a nice piece by baditude. Thanks neway
+1 on Baditude's blogs. They have all the info you need. Mooch has some great info as well. Study up before you start building, ad always check your builds with an ohm meter before you put them on a mech mod. It could save your life. 
As far as a battery, I would suggest the VTC4 from Sony. It's gonna be the best bet. The higher the CDR the better on a mech and there are only 2 batteries out there that can handle 30A. If you are gonna build below .5 ohms, you really should use a 30A battery. The other 30A battery is the LH HB6, but the mAh rating (how long it will last between charges) is pitifully low. The VTC4 has about the best balance of CDR and mAh available. Make sure you get them from a reliable source because they are commonly counterfeited.
This is the cheapest I have seen them lately, but they are never over $8/ea.
18650 Sony US18650VTC4 2100mAh High Discharge Flat Top
As far as a battery, I would suggest the VTC4 from Sony. It's gonna be the best bet. The higher the CDR the better on a mech and there are only 2 batteries out there that can handle 30A. If you are gonna build below .5 ohms, you really should use a 30A battery. The other 30A battery is the LH HB6, but the mAh rating (how long it will last between charges) is pitifully low. The VTC4 has about the best balance of CDR and mAh available. Make sure you get them from a reliable source because they are commonly counterfeited. This is the cheapest I have seen them lately, but they are never over $8/ea.
18650 Sony US18650VTC4 2100mAh High Discharge Flat Top
Thank you @Hans Wermhat I build already but I use all my rba's on regulated devices I always check the ohms and I am fine in that department. I currently always use 25r and so don't build real low anyway. That's great, was thinking bout the vtc4 but there always sold out. I'll check out mooch' bits shortly but in your opinion only building 1 ohm at the start, protected or inprotected?
1 ohm is fine on any mod. That's only like 4 amps on a mech with a fully charged battery. What wire are you using?
I know. I gotta settle down anyway because I started to get so outta breath after vaping like 15-20 ml a day. So 1 ohm and a lemo to cut down. Boo. At the mo I use like 26g but it's far too thin so I'm gonna get some 22. I still wanna be safe with those dangerous (lol) mechs. Even at an ohm should I get protected cells?
You are going to want a "safe-chemistry", "high-drain", "unprotected" battery with a high CDR. How high? I'll quote @tj99959 as this is the practice I follow with regards to amps & headroom.
When considering how low you can build you need to give yourself some headroom. I try to never exceed 50% of the CDR (continuous discharge rating) of a fully charged battery (4.2v). So with a 20A battery (like the Samsung 25r), that would be 10A. This Ohm's Law Calculator tells me that a 0.4Ω build is as low as I would want to use.
The reason that I place a 50% limit is because as a battery ages the mAh of the battery degrades, as the mAh degrades so does the batteries c rating (amp limit). So down the road, a 20A battery may only be a 10A battery."
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I highly recommend you spend some time with @Baditude & @Mooch (two of our resident battery/safety experts) and visit their blogs. You are now 100% in control of your own safety (and others around you). Make sure you purchase an ohm reader and a voltmeter or DMM so you can measure your builds, check for shorts and measure the remaining charge on your batteries.
Here are links to some of Mooch's blogs:
* No matter what is printed on the battery wrapper: There are no 18650 batteries with a genuine rating over 30A!
* Links to all his battery tests to date: List of My Battery Tests | Mooch's Blog
* Picking a Safe Battery to Vape With: Table of 18650 Battery Safety Grades | Mooch's Blog
Baditude's Blog - Table of Contents: The blogs that address battery safety, Ohm's Law, CDR (continuous discharge rating/Amps) and how they all work together are detailed below:
BATTERIES
Battery Basics for Mods - The Ultimate Battery Guide
* Another essential read to understand which batteries are safe to use in mechanical and regulated mods. Includes a frequently updated list of recommended safe-chemistry, high-drain batteries with their specifications.
Purple Efest Batteries not as Advertised
* A cautionary blog that reveals that the purple Efest batteries may not have the specifications advertised. Also includes a commentary on "continuous discharge ratings" vs "pulse discharge ratings" of battery specs.
OHM'S LAW
Ohm's Law Explained for Vapers
* My attempt at explaining Ohm's Law in layman terms and how it relates to vaping.
Explain it to the Dumb Noob: Ohm's Law Calculations
* As simple as it is to use, some people have a tough time grasping the concept. Warning: Includes graphic photos of mod explosions.
BATTERIES - WHERE TO BUY
Only buy batteries from a reputable supplier (not ebay or Amazon) as there are many counterfeit batteries being sold. Here are several reputable battery suppliers in the US.
* RTD Vapor
* Illumination Supply
* Lighthound
* Orbtronics
When considering how low you can build you need to give yourself some headroom. I try to never exceed 50% of the CDR (continuous discharge rating) of a fully charged battery (4.2v). So with a 20A battery (like the Samsung 25r), that would be 10A. This Ohm's Law Calculator tells me that a 0.4Ω build is as low as I would want to use.
The reason that I place a 50% limit is because as a battery ages the mAh of the battery degrades, as the mAh degrades so does the batteries c rating (amp limit). So down the road, a 20A battery may only be a 10A battery."
======
I highly recommend you spend some time with @Baditude & @Mooch (two of our resident battery/safety experts) and visit their blogs. You are now 100% in control of your own safety (and others around you). Make sure you purchase an ohm reader and a voltmeter or DMM so you can measure your builds, check for shorts and measure the remaining charge on your batteries.
Here are links to some of Mooch's blogs:
* No matter what is printed on the battery wrapper: There are no 18650 batteries with a genuine rating over 30A!
* Links to all his battery tests to date: List of My Battery Tests | Mooch's Blog
* Picking a Safe Battery to Vape With: Table of 18650 Battery Safety Grades | Mooch's Blog
Baditude's Blog - Table of Contents: The blogs that address battery safety, Ohm's Law, CDR (continuous discharge rating/Amps) and how they all work together are detailed below:
BATTERIES
Battery Basics for Mods - The Ultimate Battery Guide
* Another essential read to understand which batteries are safe to use in mechanical and regulated mods. Includes a frequently updated list of recommended safe-chemistry, high-drain batteries with their specifications.
Purple Efest Batteries not as Advertised
* A cautionary blog that reveals that the purple Efest batteries may not have the specifications advertised. Also includes a commentary on "continuous discharge ratings" vs "pulse discharge ratings" of battery specs.
OHM'S LAW
Ohm's Law Explained for Vapers
* My attempt at explaining Ohm's Law in layman terms and how it relates to vaping.
Explain it to the Dumb Noob: Ohm's Law Calculations
* As simple as it is to use, some people have a tough time grasping the concept. Warning: Includes graphic photos of mod explosions.
BATTERIES - WHERE TO BUY
Only buy batteries from a reputable supplier (not ebay or Amazon) as there are many counterfeit batteries being sold. Here are several reputable battery suppliers in the US.
* RTD Vapor
* Illumination Supply
* Lighthound
* Orbtronics
22G wire will have a lower resistance than 26. You won't be able to get enough wire in there to make a 1 ohm coil with 22G. You are looking at 20 - 25 wraps. Try some 28G. The resistance per foot is higher and it will be easier on your batteries. I have a Kayfun built at about 1.8 ohms that is great for tootle puffing. 28G kanthal, 8 wraps at 2mm.
Thanks loads susan s that's great. A lot of stuff to get to grips with. I thought I may be able to get high drain protected safe chemistry cells. Oh well, unprotected I'll be. Damn 28g oh no. it's too thin and weak. Thanks loads for your help guys
I've put a lot of miles on my Chi Yous', their a great mod.
Never .. never use a protected cell in them! Protected cells are low amp ICR batteries, and they are not suited for use in a mechanical.
The only batteries that have ever been in my Chi are AW IMR 18490s, but that's because I use A7s with 2 ohm coils in them. (~2 amp draw)
oh, and I use 30ga wire.
Never .. never use a protected cell in them! Protected cells are low amp ICR batteries, and they are not suited for use in a mechanical.
The only batteries that have ever been in my Chi are AW IMR 18490s, but that's because I use A7s with 2 ohm coils in them. (~2 amp draw)
oh, and I use 30ga wire.
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If you want to vape higher resistance, 26, 27 or 28g wire 
. 22g will put you at very low resistance.
Also,.since you are just getting started with a mech, do a second resistance check with your top cap or chimney on to ensure you don't have a short before firing on your mech.
. 22g will put you at very low resistance.Also,.since you are just getting started with a mech, do a second resistance check with your top cap or chimney on to ensure you don't have a short before firing on your mech.
Always buy reputable batteries from reputable dealers, thats a given. NOT Ebay, NOT Amazon.
In terms of specifically which battery, that depends on the build you are planning on using and how much power you are intending to push through it.
Imagine that the CDR (Continuous Discharge Rate, rated in amps) is one side of a seesaw, and mAh (capacity, how long it lasts for) is on the other.
A battery with a high CDR required for a subohm build that pulls lots of amps will have a corresponding low mAh rating.
A battery with a much lower CDR will have a higher mAh capacity.
Example:
A mech with a 0.2 ohms build will be pulling about 21 amps ~ a suitable battery would be a Sony VT4 which has a 30 amp CDR which allows for some headroom. This battery has a 2100 mAh capacity
A mech with a 0.8 build will be pulling 5.2 amps ~ a suitable battery might be the Purple Efest 3100 which has a 10 amp CDR, and correspondingly higher capacity of (claimed) 3100 mAh.
Remember CDR is generally accepted as the value to live by, ECF members agree that the pulse rating is worth ignoring. Manufacturers will often quote the higher pulse value as a selling point. The true CDR value can often only be found by some quick googling ot asking here on ECF. There is no IMR 18650 on the market that has a genuine CDR of over 30 amps, despite what might be claimed.
My builds are almost all around 0.4 to 0.2 ohms so I use the Sony VTC4 (30 amp CDR) and Samsung 25R (20amp CDR)
Regarding all the other safety considerations of building a subohm mech, do lots of research and reading and feel free to ask questions here on ECF. If you are not sure, ask.
In terms of specifically which battery, that depends on the build you are planning on using and how much power you are intending to push through it.
Imagine that the CDR (Continuous Discharge Rate, rated in amps) is one side of a seesaw, and mAh (capacity, how long it lasts for) is on the other.
A battery with a high CDR required for a subohm build that pulls lots of amps will have a corresponding low mAh rating.
A battery with a much lower CDR will have a higher mAh capacity.
Example:
A mech with a 0.2 ohms build will be pulling about 21 amps ~ a suitable battery would be a Sony VT4 which has a 30 amp CDR which allows for some headroom. This battery has a 2100 mAh capacity
A mech with a 0.8 build will be pulling 5.2 amps ~ a suitable battery might be the Purple Efest 3100 which has a 10 amp CDR, and correspondingly higher capacity of (claimed) 3100 mAh.
Remember CDR is generally accepted as the value to live by, ECF members agree that the pulse rating is worth ignoring. Manufacturers will often quote the higher pulse value as a selling point. The true CDR value can often only be found by some quick googling ot asking here on ECF. There is no IMR 18650 on the market that has a genuine CDR of over 30 amps, despite what might be claimed.
My builds are almost all around 0.4 to 0.2 ohms so I use the Sony VTC4 (30 amp CDR) and Samsung 25R (20amp CDR)
Regarding all the other safety considerations of building a subohm mech, do lots of research and reading and feel free to ask questions here on ECF. If you are not sure, ask.
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Thing with sub-ohm versus "regular" on a mech is that the mechs does not know the difference and does not care. Knowing and caring is all up to the user. A short is a short no matter what resistance you aimed for.
What I'm saying is you absolutely need to know if there is a short or not. Noone here can give you a definite answer. Only your own tools can.
My general advice for wire gauges is start thin and work your way to thicker gauges as need be. Way too many start out with ridiculous amounts of heavy gauge wire - never realizing how most of their applied uber-wattage goes more to ambient heating than vaporizing liquids. The more/thicker the wire you use, the more energy is spent on getting that wire hot enough to produce vapor. At one point it stops making sense altogether - unless one merely wants to flaunt ones wattage.
What I'm saying is you absolutely need to know if there is a short or not. Noone here can give you a definite answer. Only your own tools can.
My general advice for wire gauges is start thin and work your way to thicker gauges as need be. Way too many start out with ridiculous amounts of heavy gauge wire - never realizing how most of their applied uber-wattage goes more to ambient heating than vaporizing liquids. The more/thicker the wire you use, the more energy is spent on getting that wire hot enough to produce vapor. At one point it stops making sense altogether - unless one merely wants to flaunt ones wattage.
use IMR batteries.
the 'protected' batteries are unsafe chemistry batteries, that is why they are manufactured with protection circuitry.
the IMR chemistry batteries are the safer chemistry batteries.
there are the Samsung 25r 'INR' chemistry batteries which are also a safer chemistry variation;
don't use the older 'NCR' or 'ICR' protected batteries
IMR is about as safe as or maybe safer than trying Protected Batteries. Protected can fail in several unfavorable ways.
Hi Drain capability is critical to Vaping safety.
28ga. can do a lot more than you may think.
Agreed.
Though the NCR (a marketing designation by Panasonic rather than a battery chemistry) batteries are actually some of tbe safest batteries out there. They're hybrid chemistry batteries, lithium-cobalt-aluminum, so they're a lot safer than ICR. And then they have some of the best internally protection in the industry, shutting down if they get too hot or too much current flows.
For vapors though the big problem is their low current rating, 10A max., so they aren't recommended very often. But, if always using 5A or less (so they don't run so hot) they can be an option.
K. Thanks a lot guys.when I first started vaping I bought a few Samsung 25r's off of ecolux I think a company or bloke from eBay.was recommended from a few people on here and they have been fine for me but since I have been told eBay is a big no no. Anyone know of any reputable sellers in the uk? They seem like a good cell to continue with or maybe aw.
I can vouch for myepack.co.uk
They have Sony VTC4, VTC5 (20amp not 30 amp as listed), Samsung 25R and some dodgy purple re-wraps that are best avoided.
They have Sony VTC4, VTC5 (20amp not 30 amp as listed), Samsung 25R and some dodgy purple re-wraps that are best avoided.
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