Confused about ohms and voltages for dual coil cartos.

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firewalker

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I've seen and used charts/programs that will show you what your amps are if you enter your volts and ohms, but have never seen one that will do conversions for dual coils.
Can someone point me to an explanation, or explain about the resistances or volatages needed for dual coil cartos, as opposed to single coil ones. And why are they different?

Thanks
 

Trackjunkie

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Here's a post by sailorman that I just read, which partly answers your question:

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/new-members-forum/301071-about-order-my-first-pv-2.html

DCTs? I had one. I threw it away. But that was before I found out that dual coil cartos aren't worth a darn on anything less then 4.5V. They're a cheap tank. They hold juice. It's the carto that's inside that matters. If you use them with low voltage, you'll get crappy vapor. Granted, you'll get twice as much of it. But 2 x crappy still equals crappy.

So, you need to find a 1.7 to 2ohm punched carto to put inside it. Then hold onto it because it's a bit slippery. You really need the flanged cartomizers. I saw some 1.7ohm flanged and punched Smoketech "Ressurector" cartos somewhere, but I can't remember where. Maybe CrystalClearVaping? If you use those, you should get a good vape.

Whatever you do DON'T use dual coil cartos. They are NOT 1.5ohm. They are two 3ohm cartos inside the same tube. Only the total resistance is 1.5ohms. It's like trying to boil one pot of water on two stoves, each set at half the boiling temperature of water You'll use the same amount of electricity, but you won't get boiling water.

The Vision Clearomizers are a far better vape than any carto based tank though. And at $5 each, they're a better value than buying $2 replacement cartos for the DCT. They last far longer than any cartomizer. If you punched your own carto's you could make it cheaper to use the DCT than the Vision Clearo, but the vapor and flavor still wouldn't be as good.

Like I said before, the battery itself on the Riva is not bad if it's the 1000mah one. But it's all that other useless junk, like the tank and atomizer, that you're paying for and that most people jettison in favor of something that actually works.


 

sailorman

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A dual coil carto consists of two coils of the same resistance. They are wired in parallel so the total resistance is half the resistane of either coil. For example:
The total resistance of a 1.5ohm dual coil carto is 1.5ohms, but the resistance of either coil it contains is 3ohms.

When you calculate the amp draw, you use the total resistance, 1.5ohms
When you calculate how many watts each coil is using, you divide by 2.

So a 1.5ohm carto at 3.7V would be drawing 3.7/1.5=2.47 amps. But the single coil is burning at 3.7^2 / 1.5 = 9.13 Watts, while each coil of a dual coil 1.5ohm carto is burning at (3.7^2/1.5) / 2 = 4.57 watts.

Both the single and dual coil are presenting the same current draw to the battery and they are consuming the same power or watts. But the dual coil is splitting the power between 2 coils because each of them have a higher resistance, equal to twice the resistance of the whole carto.
 

tj99959

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    Basically where the rub comes in with dual coil is that each coil is twice the resistance of the stated resistance.
    So just using a strate conversion, if you wanted 7-8 watts of power to a coil you would be asking the battery to provide 14-16 watts.
    Thankfully most cant handle that kind of power with a DCC, and run them at about 6.5-6.75 watts/coil. That still is about 4.5v at 3 amps, which is a pretty heavy load for a PV.
    The best a eGo/Kgo type battery can muster is only about 4.5 watts to each coil (9 watts total), which works out to about 2.5amps from that little battery for pretty lame vape. You can get a better vape from a 1.7-2ohm single coil carto at 2amps or less.

    Personal opinion of course, but for the little that is gained by using a dual coil, it just isnt worth the abuse they place on your equipment.
     
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    tj99959

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    If you have a good PV with a strong 5 volt or VW battery that is 1300+ mAh, you will have no issues using dual coils and they will provide a very good vape. Many use them all the time. I would follow sailorman's guidence.

    I agree with that, but the key is "a good PV with a strong 5 volt or VW battery that is 1300+ mAh".
    But, even devices like the Kick can't get there. (Maxes at 3.7v with a 1.5ohm DCC)
    P1000577.jpg


    edit:
    OOPS, my bad, I didn't have it turned all the way up.
    It maxes at 3.96v
     
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    sailorman

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    I agree with that, but the key is "a good PV with a strong 5 volt or VW battery that is 1300+ mAh".
    But, even devices like the Kick can't get there.

    Right. If I understand correctly, a kick tops out at 10W. That's 5 watts per coil, about what a 3.9V battery would provide for a 3ohm single coil carto. Lame. It's still better though, than what you'd get with a typical 3.7V battery much of the time and definitely beats the 3.85 watts you'd get with something like an eGo. You really need at least 4.5 and preferably 5V in a 1000+mah battery for a dual coil to make sense.

    As for battery size, don't forget, C-ratings are based on continuous discharge. A battery can exceed it's C ratings momentarily without issues, but not tremendously. A 1000mah battery with a C-rating of 3 might be strained with a continuous 2.5-3Amp draw, but it is probably capable of handling 3.5-4 amps of momentary current draw without issue if it's not done every 5 seconds.

    When I flew RC planes, it was common for a battery to have a C rating of 5 but a momentary rating of 7, for example. Better batteries might have a rating of 8/10 momentary.
     
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    sailorman

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    Thanks Guys, and Gals.
    So basically, to run even a 1.5 ohm carto decently, I'd need something powerful like a provari or other VV mod?
    And on my 1000mah Kgo, I'd be better off with a 1.8-2.0ohm single coil?

    I was looking at the Vivi Novas, but I heard they have trouble sitting flush on a Kgo/Ego battery.

    No. A 1.5ohm carto was designed to simulate 5V vaping on a 3.7V PV. A SINGLE coil 1.5ohm works fine on a 3.7V PV.
    It's the DUAL coil 1.5ohm cartos that really need 4.5+V to work really well.

    On your kGo, a 2ohm single coil Boge or a 1.7ohm Smoketech "Resurrector" will give you the best results. Both of these are single coil cartomizers.

    The Vivi Nova's don't have that collar at the bottom to screw onto the cone threads of the kGo. They'll sit as flush as they would on any other 510, but they look kid of strange, hanging out in space because the top of the kgo is so narrow. If you want a good clearomizer for the kGo, I'd look at a Stardust, aka eGo Vision Clearomizer. Those are made specifically for kGos, egos, etc. The Fluxomizers from Gotvapes also work real well. Those are my favorite clearomizer and the only ones I use.
     

    firewalker

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    Thanks sailorman.
    I got a couple of stardusts when I bought my Kgo, but the site I bought them from (sweet-vapes.com) recommended the standard resistance. Being a know nothing newbie, i bought two. May as well turn them into earrings for all the good they're doing with my Kgo. I've seen more vapor coming off my coffee cup!
    Right now all I have is a couple of atomizers with cartridges and those last about 5 minutes. :(
    Because of those stardusts, I've been suffering from analysis paralysis.

    Will look into those fluxomisers, or the other two. Gotta have something besides thse 5 min. carts. Gonna get a provari soon, and then I won't have to worry so much about all this mess.
     

    Warren D. Lockaby

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    Firewalker, I've just begun to learn a bit about these clearo-thingys & various plastic-misers, and so far the main thing I've learned is not to buy any of 'em from anyone except Discount Vapers or GotVapes until I learn otherwise. Also, I love the design of the Vivi Nova; unfortunately the manufacturer has some QC issues which need to be rectified before these little beauties approach their potential. Also, of their three supplied heads only the one of lowest resistance is of much use to those of us with a limited 3.7 volt (or so) PV, assuming we prefer a LR atty. :D
     

    wv2win

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    Right. If I understand correctly, a kick tops out at 10W. That's 5 watts per coil, about what a 3.9V battery would provide for a 3ohm single coil carto. Lame. It's still better though, than what you'd get with a typical 3.7V battery much of the time and definitely beats the 3.85 watts you'd get with something like an eGo. You really need at least 4.5 and preferably 5V in a 1000+mah battery for a dual coil to make sense.

    As for battery size, don't forget, C-ratings are based on continuous discharge. A battery can exceed it's C ratings momentarily without issues, but not tremendously. A 1000mah battery with a C-rating of 3 might be strained with a continuous 2.5-3Amp draw, but it is probably capable of handling 3.5-4 amps of momentary current draw without issue if it's not done every 5 seconds.

    When I flew RC planes, it was common for a battery to have a C rating of 5 but a momentary rating of 7, for example. Better batteries might have a rating of 8/10 momentary.

    I use MadVapes clear EMDCC's or mega dual coil catomizers on my Darwin. They are made to fit the eGo with the lip to make it look seamless. It's ironic that the eGo is the last PV you should be using them on.
     

    XtianApi

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    I am trying my first dual coil. I'm gonna get smoktech dual coils to run on my ss Zmax. Can someone please tell me if I should get 1.5 or 2.5 ohms? Since the 1.5 could come in at 1.4, 1.3, or so, I don't want the Zmax to reject it. 2.5 ohm is two 5 ohm coils!? what mod would use that? Thanks, please help.
     
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