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TropicalBob

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Customs stopped my E-Cig shipment today. This is a first for me.

I'm told I now must fill out a bunch of forms and my order might be delayed another week. I ordered e-liquid but E-Cig stamped "pipe" on the box, so now customs wants to know all about the pipe inside.

I've been leaning toward this, but I am definitely going to learn how to make my own liquid.
 

TropicalBob

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Just got the forms. This is going to be interesting.

I don't lie. I don't deceive. It comes back to haunt. So ...

I'm going with full disclosure of contents and intended use. The order contains five cores for cigar, a 25-pack of all flavors and a 50ml bottle of e-liquid. For me, it cost a lot of money. I have to declare the contents and fill out a form on Toxic Substances being imported or exported. I cannot find nicotine among them. Nor propylene glycol. I believe my shipment is legal.

We're going to find out before long.
 

Meltrex

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TropicalBob said:
Just got the forms. This is going to be interesting.

I don't lie. I don't deceive. It comes back to haunt. So ...

I'm going with full disclosure of contents and intended use. The order contains five cores for cigar, a 25-pack of all flavors and a 50ml bottle of e-liquid. For me, it cost a lot of money. I have to declare the contents and fill out a form on Toxic Substances being imported or exported. I cannot find nicotine among them. Nor propylene glycol. I believe my shipment is legal.

We're going to find out before long.


Hey TB, I'm just curious to how this is going? Is there a custom fee involved to release your shipment or anything to that nature? I just put in a several thousand dollar order and dealing with customs is something I'm investigating just in case I run into a problems. Thanks in advance.
 

TropicalBob

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Update on Customs problem: On April 14, as requested, I provided Customs a copy of the invoice of contents, the true address of the company the product was ordered from, and other stuff on forms they sent. Within hours, my shipmenet was "released."

Got a call this morning. For the first time in FedX's memory, the shipment was "unreleased."

Here's what Customs wants:

Per our conversation, US Customs and the FDA want a revised commercial invoice that shows a complete breakdown of all goods in the shipment. I am attaching a blank commercial invoice for you to complete, along with the package contents, and the manufacturers info, and the original invoice (for shipper's info) for reference.

On the revised invoice, you must write in the shippers name and foreign address and the consignee's (recipient) name and address as well. You must itemize everything that is in the shipment. Give specific description (end use, material compostion) of both items. You must also provide a $ value for both items as well. Then list the manufacturer's name and address. They also want the invoice to state that this is a "smoking cessation device". Finally, specify the currency type of the invoice. If you run out of room, feel free to make a copy of the invoice to continue.


This began with a lie by a Chinese company. And this is where lying leads. E-Cig has become aware of the "pipe PVC" fraud done by its exporter and is changing that practice after numerous posts about problems with Customs. Too late for me. My "express" order has now taken longer than delivery by turtleback from China. Here's the part we can all relate to: The ingredients in E-Liquid might stand the FDA's hair on end, and it might even be confiscated, but I can get in my car and drive two minutes to a store where I can purchase any pack of cigarettes.
 

EricD

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I just ordered about 100ml of liquid from e-cig, but china air post. Hopefully it will go through just as easily as my e-cigar. I told myself when ordering, "remember to tell them NOT to mark it as a plastic pipe" in the additional shipping instructions box. Of course, I forgot. Oh dear, i will be mad if it gets stopped. TB, if you can, don't say its a smoking cessation device. Say its a smoking alternative or something. Seems like they're trying to force a label on these things. Its actually t-ing me off. Man, what is going on that a person cant get a bottle of liquid nicotine from china? Sad story... well, there's always ebay. :cry:
 

TropicalBob

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I already have worked out what I'll say about that. The words you read in my post came from FedX as they were told by Customs. I will say that I use the liquid to substitute for smoking real cigarettes, as a cigarette alternative. I do plan to tell them that the company does NOT advertise these products as smoking cessation devices.

I should note that a month ago I ordered liquid and cores, and had them shipped the $9 land route. The U.S. Post Office delivered that without question. It had "Sample" stamped on the outside. Geeez. A second order with $26 "express" shipment is hung up in Alaska.
 

TropicalBob

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This simply gets worse and worse. I submitted 8 forms, detailing everything about the shipment of one bottle of E-Liquid and the sample cartridges. I had been emailed a truly complex "invoice" that the shipper was supposed to fill out. Now how do I get E-Cig's shipper to do that? They now say I can fill out the invoice that E-Cig should have filled out. Here's the latest exchange:

US Customs is requesting that the information all be submitted on an invoice. The importer (recipient) is authorized to revise the invoice in order to make entry with Customs. Please see below.

User ID . . . . . SARO Keyword . . . . .
fda referral fda hold need to provide revised invoice with better desc
c/o, mfg info name and address and also need to know end use, it is
for stop smoking device or not....saro/ftn

Please place all the information onto 1 revised invoice so that we can present it to US Customs.


IMO, the most important question here is "it is for stop smoking device or not?" I wrote that quitting smoking is not its advertised use. Frankly, I don't know what they want to hear, since I told the truth.

I'll add here two of the paragraphs I wrote Customs explaining the liquid and how it's used. I don't know how I could be clearer, or more truthful. I feel like this is "The Eve Incident" for e-smoking in the U.S.

These liquids are used for what has become known as e-smoking. It's a healthier way to "smoke." Basically, the liquid contains nicotine. That liquid is dripped into a cartridge. An e-smoking device resembling a cigarette, cigar or pipe contains the cartridge, a battery, and an atomizer. When air is drawn through the device, the atomizer heats up, creating a vapor that is then inhaled, as smoke is from a tobacco product. But here, there is no tobacco; there is no combustion. The liquid is the source of vapor, which is the source of nicotine.

Some are trying to quit smoking with this product. I myself have not smoked cigarettes since acquiring my e-cigarette, e-cigar and e-pipe. But that's not its purpose. It is an alternative to cigarettes, a way to satisfy a smoker's cravings without subjecting the smoker to all the carcinogens in smoke. The manufacturer does not call this a smoking cessation device. It's an alternative to tobacco smoking, a much healthier alternative.
 

EricD

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Nicely put tropicalbob. Could not have said it better myself. Either the fda is trying to corner you into admitting it is a quit smoking device, or they already know what its for and are trying to make sure you're not trying to poison your neighbors' drinking water. BTW, you are not allowed to make lawyer jokes anymore; you're license has been revoked. That is the greatest bit of lawyering i've read in a while. Good luck with the shipment. I think you'll be getting it released soon. My liquid just left china yesterday. Hopefully it will be smooth sailing. Used the regular post. Crossing my fingers.
 

TropicalBob

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I found two posts elsewhere on the Web today that are most troubling. The first came from the a U.S. forum on e-smoking, but was posted by a user in the Netherlands. It concerned Customs problems with e-liquid:

In europe we have the same problem.

E-cig near Shanghai, ships all there goods as "piece of plastic pipe" and in an illegal way they can ship Liquid out of China.
All other factory's ship from another part of China (Shenzhen near HongKong) with more custom checks and cannot ship Liquid in bottles.

It is even illigal for them to ship a bottle of water.


Is this true? Anyone know. China can't ship liquids legally?

Then there's this, from a company that wholesales e-items. Ever wonder where the nicotine comes from? Next to a photo of E-Cig's cartridge box is this:

Product Name: Cigarette Case
Listing Date:
Origin of Product : Cuba
Delivery Time: 3-10 days

Product Description(Specifications) :
The e-cig cartridge is composed of inhaler and e-smoking liquid container. E-smoking liquid is the diluted nicotine fluid ready for atomizing in the inhaler container. The cartridge contains about 1ml e-smoking liquid and 15mg nicotine.

When the smoking liquid in the container of the cartridge is less so that there is less smoke coming out, you can either change the cartridge or just add two or three drops of the smoking liquid on the container, and then you will enjoy the same feeling as a tobacco smoking again.

Model/Article No.: E-CIG
Supply Ability / Month: 100,000pcs/month
Minimum Order: 100pcs
Payment Terms: T/T


Note the country of origin. Ouch. If an American agency learns of this, it's taboo. I use Swedish snus much of the time, but Swedish companies cannot sell me Montecristo or Romeo y Julieta snus. Why? Each contains Cuban tobacco. The U.S. has an embargo on Cuban tobacco, so it's not legal to import any product containing Cuban tobacco.

I'm a bit worried about future orders.
 

TropicalBob

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My shipment was released by Customs in Alaska and sent to New York, where it promptly had an indefinite hold placed on it. No word yet what they expect from me as a next move.

Maybe this is The Eve Incident, the one event that changes things. Will Customs ever look favorably on an E-Cig shipment again? They now know The Big Lie of "pipe" and "sample". And I now know where the tobacco comes from! And why The Big Lie was used in the first place.

I ordered more liquids two days ago -- to be sent by land post.
 

TropicalBob

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BULLETIN: My shipment was just delivered by FedX. Or, I should say, part of my shipment. I had ordered the sample pack of all flavors and a 50ml bottle of chocolate e-liquid. There was no bottle. Just flavor cartridges rolling around to show that Customs had opened my package.

Now I must begin to track down my missing 50ml bottle. That costs too much money for me to just let it slide.
 

TropicalBob

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Dusty, this particular one was marked "plastic pipe" and was actually delivered to me with those words on the invoice despite my having to fill out a new invoice detailing what was really in the package. The word "sample" seems to be used for land post deliveries; "pipe" is for express delivery. Both are fraudulent. This was an "express" delivery that took a month to get to me - for $26 in shipping.
 

EricD

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TB, are you seriously trying to tell me customs gaffled your 50ml bottle of liquid and let you have cartridges? That's messed up. So, I guess liquid in a cartridge is ok, but not liquid that goes in a cartridge. I'll have to think really hard on the distinction. They're probably puffing on the liquid as we speak. :x Well, at least we know that cartridges are ok. I'm really glad you got some of it through customs ok. We were all getting worried here. Keep us updated on the liquid. I"m watching this post like a hawk, checking a few times a day to see where you're at with this ordeal. Still waiting on my 50, 30, and 2 8 ml bottles. Still just left china. Wondering if maybe i should have just ordered 100 cartridges instead of 100 ml. I suppose your explanation was satisfactory; kudos to you for that. You should hop on the chat sessions with us at night. Its 12:00 p.m. right now where i'm at and a few of us are usually chatting at 7 or 8 p.m. Hope to see you there to regail us with your tales of customs horror....... I know... I'm lame. :mrgreen:


"...she just wouldn't shut up enough for me to listen" (meltrex 2008) :D
 

TropicalBob

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FedX answered the "where do I go now?" question by telling me the shipment contained only one item -- the sample cartridges. So ... E-Cig bungled the shipment by not including the 50ml bottle. I sent E-Cig an email but you know how long that might take to be answered -- if ever. And there's some kind of Chinese holiday starting in May that means they'll be shut down for 3 days. I'll post updates here as I learn more. Apparently, the liquid was never shipped, even though I was charged for it and my emailed invoice from E-Cig shows it was ordered.

FYI: I ordered a bunch more small liquid bottles the day before yesterday so I could test the good doctor's recipes. Plus, the DIY nicotine liquid I made from nasal snuff is quite good! I've been adding vanila extract as flavoring.
 
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