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Did Mitch Zeller Just Show His True Colors?

Discussion in 'Media and General News' started by Ardo, May 11, 2016.

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  1. Ardo

    Ardo Senior Member ECF Veteran

    Nov 17, 2009
    Tallinn, Estonia
    • Like Like x 6
  2. zoiDman

    zoiDman My -0^10 = Nothing at All* ECF Veteran

    Supporting member
    Apr 16, 2010
    So-Cal
    I'm not going to defend Mr. Zeller.

    But I Hope that people Do Consider that whereas Mr. Zeller is the public face in all this, name like Burwell, Califf and the Recently famous Hamburg should be considered when it comes to Decision Making.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  3. nicnik

    nicnik Ultra Member ECF Veteran

    Apr 20, 2015
    Illinois, USA
    And Obama, who could put a stop to them all.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  4. puffon

    puffon Vaping Master Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Sep 18, 2014
    The Villages, FL
    I thought Obama recently appointed Zeller to the FDA, who came from the pharmaceutical industry.
    I wouldn't expect any actions from "lame duck" Obama.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  5. nicnik

    nicnik Ultra Member ECF Veteran

    Apr 20, 2015
    Illinois, USA
    Of course he won't do anything. He is/was in charge of all of them. It's his FDA. And his CDC, HHS, and his war on vaping.
     
    • Like Like x 4
  6. zoiDman

    zoiDman My -0^10 = Nothing at All* ECF Veteran

    Supporting member
    Apr 16, 2010
    So-Cal
    Mitch [Zeller] has over thirty years of FDA-related experience, including a six-year stint as a public interest attorney working on food issues, five years as a congressional counsel working on food and drug issues, and seven years as a senior FDA official. While at FDA, he oversaw the agency’s original assertion of jurisdiction over tobacco products in the 1990’s and was the founding director of FDA’s Office of Tobacco Programs. Mitch has spent the last nineteen years working on tobacco issues, including his time at the agency, the American Legacy Foundation, and as a consultant to federal agencies, non-profits, researchers, and the pharmaceutical industry.

    More Personnel Changes at FDA
     
    • Like Like x 2
  7. zoiDman

    zoiDman My -0^10 = Nothing at All* ECF Veteran

    Supporting member
    Apr 16, 2010
    So-Cal
    BTW - I know I'll get Flamed for this.

    But I believe that if it was Mr. Zeller's Decision , and His Alone, that we would have gotten a more Balanced Deeming and Less Stringent PMTA for ENDS.

    But it Wasn't his decision alone, And Many "Desks" had input in all this. And all of those "Desks" were Larger than Mr. Zeller's.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  8. nicnik

    nicnik Ultra Member ECF Veteran

    Apr 20, 2015
    Illinois, USA
    Likely true, and if so, he had the option of resigning, and speaking out - the only ethical option.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  9. zoiDman

    zoiDman My -0^10 = Nothing at All* ECF Veteran

    Supporting member
    Apr 16, 2010
    So-Cal
    Perhaps He felt more good could come out of this If he Stayed? I dunno?

    I just know that the Entire Concept of e-Cigarettes has been Way To Politicized. And the Influences of Profits, Taxes, and Grandstand for Personal Gain has diverted the conversation from what it Should Be...

    e-Cigarette Provide Harm Reduction to Smokers.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  10. nicnik

    nicnik Ultra Member ECF Veteran

    Apr 20, 2015
    Illinois, USA
    Well, if that was the case, he should have quit when he realized such a plan was gonna fail miserably.

    Nice concise summary.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  11. Kent C

    Kent C ECF Guru Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Jun 12, 2009
    NW Ohio US
    Zeller is smart enough to know who he's talking to. You see that when he spoke to the republicans Senator Burr and Alexander in the HELP hearings vs. how McAfee (CDC at the time) did. And how Zeller agreed with the Dem Senators in the same hearing. You can pick some comments that appear 'pro-vaping' until you put it in the full context of his statements - basically, they're only words whereas his true purpose is 'net population' or 'public health' - the 'greater good' for the whole population vs. what might appear to be good for the smaller group of hard core smokers.

    Once you get that, then you won't be doubting what he stands for. Until then, you'll just think he's a 'reasonable guy'. But he isn't.
     
    • Like Like x 11
  12. mcclintock

    mcclintock Ultra Member ECF Veteran

    Oct 28, 2014
    I think that not only is he concerned with potential harm, he's just as scared the product is TOO GOOD. The root of "appealing to children" is "appealing to" people. Being concerned a product is too good is a clue your reasoning doesn't make sense. (This aspect doesn't make it into the regs, but then neither does Zeller's early moderate statements.)

    Tobacco Control types think about a "tobacco endgame" and actually believe tobacco use may come to an end fairly soon. I'd like to see less or no abusive smoking but fact is it's a tradition, and has been an creative, rich and prolific art when not pumping out boring cigarettes by the billions. They seem to believe that the number of tobacco users will decrease until they can make it illegal without creating a huge black market or worrying about the few voices of dissension left. It's both immoral and a fantasy.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  13. CarolT

    CarolT Super Member ECF Veteran

    Feb 22, 2011
    Madison WI
    You hit the nail right on the head.
     
  14. DC2

    DC2 Tootie Puffer Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Jun 21, 2009
    San Diego
    He was certainly well suited for his job, having had extensive experience...
    --Working with the ANTZ
    --Working with Big Pharma
    --Consulting with federal agencies

    Who better than him to help finalize the details of the perfect screw job.
    And he's really good at pretending he's at least offering us a bit of vasoline.
    Quite possibly, but he knows where his bread is buttered.
    So yeah, add immoral sell-out willing to do his masters bidding to his list of qualifications
     
    • Like Like x 6
  15. zoiDman

    zoiDman My -0^10 = Nothing at All* ECF Veteran

    Supporting member
    Apr 16, 2010
    So-Cal
    One thing that is Certain. Everyone needs a Face to Throw Darts at. And I guess Mr. Zeller's is as Good as Any.

    Any that is, if you are Willing to Exclude names like Hamburg, Califf and Burwell.

    BTW - Here's an old say'n... "If you are Not Happy with something that happens at the Circus, Don't Yell at the Clowns, Yell at the Ringleader."
     
    • Like Like x 4
  16. DC2

    DC2 Tootie Puffer Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Jun 21, 2009
    San Diego
    It's not so much the ringleader that's the problem.
    It's the circus tent.

    Term limits is a start.
    But only a start.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  17. zoiDman

    zoiDman My -0^10 = Nothing at All* ECF Veteran

    Supporting member
    Apr 16, 2010
    So-Cal
    So who is the Ringleader here? And the One who is Truly Deserving of those Darts.

    Zeller?
    Califf (Hamburg)?
    Burwell?
    Higher?
     
  18. DC2

    DC2 Tootie Puffer Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Jun 21, 2009
    San Diego
    The ringleader is whomever is chosen by the establishment.
    Also known as the circus tent.

    The public is complicit because they haven't got a clue what's going on.
    And they do a good portion of the electing and such.
    But it's not entirely their fault.

    For a long time now I have been blaming Big Media for what is happening to us.
    My opinion on that has not changed one bit.

    Who is the ringleader?
    My point is that it doesn't really matter until we change the system.

    Right now, though, the current target for darts should be Obama.
    He is the one that appointed those that are currently oppressing us in the FDA.

    But that's just for now.

    The dartboard does have replaceable targets...
    Targets 4 Less - Handgun

    Yeah, I know, those are handgun targets.
    But you get the "picture" I'm sure.
    ;)
     
    • Like Like x 1
  19. Kent C

    Kent C ECF Guru Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Jun 12, 2009
    NW Ohio US
    They're all clowns. Even the Ringleader.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  20. zoiDman

    zoiDman My -0^10 = Nothing at All* ECF Veteran

    Supporting member
    Apr 16, 2010
    So-Cal
    NO. The Ringleader is the One who makes the Final Decision on what Does and what Does Not Happen.

    Don't get me Wrong DC, Mr. Zeller Isn't getting a Christmas Card this year. But consider what you said about the Public Not Having a Clue.

    When the Angry Mod storms the FDA and Demands Zeller's Head on a Post, that's Great. But if they had a Clue, then wouldn't they be Demanding Califf's Head. Or Better Yet? Burwell's.

    Not say'n that Mr. Zeller is without Sin in all this. But if People want Snit Like this to EVER Stop, then they are going to have to Start Aiming a Little Higher when they get out their Darts.
     
    • Like Like x 1
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