DIY juice questions...

[k-town]

So I'm thinking about getting into making my own juice to save money, and I have a few questions.

1.) will it save a significant amount of money? I'm not really in it for the thrill of doing it or anything, you can create your own flavors on sites like Mt. Baker Vapor which is fun and easy, so I really just want to do it if it will make a big monetary difference. Lately it seems like all my money is going to juices because I get so excited about trying different flavors!
1.a) what is a good website for cheap supplies for this?

2.) If a nicotine juice has a PG or VG base, do I still also need to buy PG/VG? or can I just use it as is? I'm looking for a fairly low level of nicotine. I usually smoke 12mg or sometimes 6mg. I don't want/need much more than that.
2.a) is there a website where I can buy the nicotine juice (in a fairly low level) and PG/VG premixed for ease of use?

3.) Is there a website that just simplifies this by selling a kit w/ everything you need? well, it wouldn't need to be *everything*, I can buy the flavors separately since that's simple enough, but the equipment and the initial unflavored juices and stuff?

thanks!


EDIT: new thought...I've been thinking about trying something w/out nicotine to see if I can cut down on my nicotine take a bit (I've been getting more nicotine now than when I was an actual smoker!). so I could just do a PG/VG mix and add flavors, right? and it'd be cheaper...thoughts?

 

[Snowman293]

Ecigexpress is where I shop....don't do a kit....you end up stuff you don't need and others that you stol ned to shop for......36 or 48 mg base is enough if you vape a low dose. I use 50/50 nic base, cut with pg, and add flavor.......1,3,5,10ml syringes are my measuring tools after trying pipettes with messy inaccurate results.... Money savings depends alot on how many flavors you NEED to make.....i figure I'm making juice for about $5 for 30ml......good luck

 

[Dj tank]

Rts vapes has 48 mg nic base (pg or vg)...I think I paid 70 for a liter. Then you'd get a bottle of pg (tractor supply has these for about 20 a gallon. I believe rts also sells vg. Using a ejuice calc you plug in what your base strength nic liquid is (48mg)...what you want your end strength to be (example 18mg)... How many ml of juice you wanna make (30ml)... And the calculator spits back the ratios... 10mls base nic liquid and to it add 7ml of pg and 13 ml of vg plus you flavoring to make a final vape.

I think it's cheaper than $5 to make your own 30 ml ... But I didn't start making my own to save $$$. I did it so in case juice becomes unavailable because of regs I'd know how. I've stocked up on a few liters of 48mg nic base. Enough to last me a long time at my current vape pace.

yep no nic eliquid making is pretty cheap to do. Just need a gallon or whatever of pg...some vg...de IDE you pg to vg ratio you want and add flavors.

48 MG Flavorless Nicotine Liquid by RTS Vapes.

Mos def get syringes, a few graduated glass mixing tubes, and a bulk of 15, 30 and 50 ml plastic bottles to store. Amazon is good for this stuff.

To note...yes you can get flavorless premixed to your pg/vg and nic needs and just mix in flavoring to it. It's slightly more expensive...but not much. Example some sites sell 70/30 pg to vg @ 18mg...already mixed so you'd just add how ever much to a 50 ml bottle and your flavoring and voila

 

[RSAnthony]

I'm concerned about my flavors stopped for production as well. Any tips on how to.copy popular flavors? I don't search for new flavors and I'm more interested in consistency

 

[Dj tank]

Depending on where what you order the DIY section on this forum has a lot of recipes. You can even review threads on just the flavor concentrates you order...for example I like tfa's concentrate...so I usually review the tfa thread and look for recipes I think I'll like...then use what someone else has created. Simple flavors like blueberry ejuice is easy to make...complicated ones with multiple favors can be difficult.

http://www.onestopdiyshop.com/products/The-Flavor-Apprentice-Professional-Flavors.html

 

[kabonk]

if you use Rts vapes use the coupon code FIRSTORDER and save 20% if you buy in bulk DIY can be very inexpensive it cost me around $1.60 per 60 ml bottle

 

[JeremyR]

Just starting out I cut my Costs by half in the first purchase. Basically spent same amount to get started but got more
Than twice as much. and the flavorings Will last a long time.. So my costs will go down as i go. Takes more time for sure but I Can make whatever I want. I get my DIY from liberty flights, 36 mg base easy to cut to 12mg.

 

[klynnn]

I tend to shop at wizard labs. They have 8ml flavors from lorann or tpa. That is a big enough size to get started and see if you like them and the prices are reasonable. I buy my nic in pg but it is also good to have both plain pg and vg on hand.Wizard Labs

 

[nev99]

Having just recently done this... i.e. put a DIY set up together here are a few thoughts..

first off as mentioned by others there is a DIY sub-forum under the General E-Liquid Discussion section. Great info and tons of it... on flavors, mixing, testing..

1.) will it save a significant amount of money? I'm not really in it for the thrill of doing it or anything, you can create your own flavors on sites like Mt. Baker Vapor which is fun and easy, so I really just want to do it if it will make a big monetary difference. Lately it seems like all my money is going to juices because I get so excited about trying different flavors!
1.a) what is a good website for cheap supplies for this?

at 12mg a mix with about 15% of flavor overall (doesn't matter how many) is about 5$ per 30ml
so now see how this compares to the prices of liquid you buy
you can check out the prices of the ingredients you want/need and there is a great calculator i use for mix calculation that includes the cost calculation as well at ecigvape.com

but that is not whole answer.. yes it will save you money in the overall.. there is a bit of an investment to start.. some things you need.
overall i put mine together for about 200-300$ but i went a bit overboard on the flavors.. i'm a dabbler and i wanted to play so i just got various ones, i could have put it together for about 150$ with a decent supply of flavors and everything else i needed.

I think this was worth it for me. However based on "I'm not really in it for the thrill of doing it or anything" the answer will depend on your commitment. But be aware it's a learning process.. Yes there are some recipes posted in the forum that you can use and hopefully you will like. but even with the listings of the % of flavor strengths charts for many of the flavors by most manufacturers, blending them together and getting a vapable juice off the bat are well -slim.

This is in no way meant to discourage but to inject a dose of realism to it.

2.) If a nicotine juice has a PG or VG base, do I still also need to buy PG/VG? or can I just use it as is? I'm looking for a fairly low level of nicotine. I usually smoke 12mg or sometimes 6mg. I don't want/need much more than that.
2.a) is there a website where I can buy the nicotine juice (in a fairly low level) and PG/VG premixed for ease of use?

the short answer is Yes you need it. its not expensive and you can get it for 14$/Quart
long answer. since flavor % in the mix can vary from 1%-25% (or even higher) depending on flavor and desired strength it is by this percentage you will be diluting your premixed nic PG/VG juice.. so if you start with 12mg you will finish up with anything between 9mg and 11.9mg
that said mtbakervapor.com sells premixed PG/VG unflavored nic at various mixes and nicotine strengths

3.) Is there a website that just simplifies this by selling a kit w/ everything you need? well, it wouldn't need to be *everything*, I can buy the flavors separately since that's simple enough, but the equipment and the initial unflavored juices and stuff?

yes there are a few, but i agree with

...don't do a kit....you end up stuff you don't need and others that you still need to shop for......

I got one but i find i'm not using part of it and using stuff i got separately more.
however the above mentioned onestopdiyshop.com has them
DIY Kit

EDIT: new thought...I've been thinking about trying something w/out nicotine to see if I can cut down on my nicotine take a bit (I've been getting more nicotine now than when I was an actual smoker!). so I could just do a PG/VG mix and add flavors, right? and it'd be cheaper...thoughts?

yes, nic is generally the more expensive part of the mix. But at 6mg or 12mg use not too bad.

you can also do the reverse PG/VG nic mix no flavor. i think everyone should have supplies at home to make some of that. for diluting too strong flavors, vaping flavors out of carts, or just vaping (VG adds a bit of a taste)..

and definitely definitely follow what kabonk said. Coupons.. coupons just about everyone has them .. 5-10-15-20% off ..

and since i agree with Snowman293 on the use of pipettes and measuring in drops i second the syringes.


If you want to start small to see how it works for you:

Base Kit

48mg nic 60ml Rtsvapes $7.95
1 Qt PG by Essential Depot on Amazon $13.97
1Qt VG Essential Depot on Amazon $13.97 (buy together free shipping over 25$)
Syringe 1ml Luer Slip Tip Sterile (Pack of 10) Amazon $4.03 (free shipping)
Syringes 3 ml with Blunt Tip Fill Needles, 10 pack Amazon $6.00 (free shipping)
Syringes 5 ml with Blunt Tip Fill Needles, 10 pack Amazon $8.99 (free shipping)
Dispensing Needle, Blunt Tip 14 ga x 1-1/2" 50 pcs (for VG) Amazon $13.01 (shipping included)
box of surgical gloves, paper towels and any other possible odds and ends $20
i got some extra 5ml, plus 10 ml and .5ml diabetic syringes for free just by asking at the pharmacy (you can always tell them its for filling your printer cartridge)

Above total 88$ (plus shipping for Rtsvapes)

remember this will bring you 480ml of juice at 12mg and 960ml of juice at 6mg

the two things left are bottles and flavors.. and that depends what you like...

i like glass so i get the Glass Vials, 1 Dram, Pack of 12 at amazon for $5 (including shipping) that is 0.41$ per bottle less then at any of the e-cig suppliers i found..

but this is for base flavor test mixing.. 1 dram is about 4ml
if you need larger bottles for final mixing you will have to source those out for cost

but about
10ml 0.45$ (so 10 bottles) $4.50
30ml 0.69$ -ll- $6.90

Bottles total: <$20

flavor - where and what price depends on how many.. a got quite a few so it was worth it for me to pay 0.50$ less per 10ml at different suppliers, i was either over the free shipping limit or the shipping was worth it .. if you are buying just a few then a one spot shop like ecigexpress is definitely more economical

prices vary from $2.5 to 5$ for 10ml so you can get about 10-15 flavors and still be under the 150$ budget i mentioned

you will have leftovers of just about everything except nic liquid when you mix that 480ml/960ml of juice ...

sorry it's long but i hope it helps
and good luck

 

[k-town]

thank you for your long, thought out message, it's very helpful and exactly what I was looking for!

 

[Demiurgous]

Sorry to jump in...

Any shelf life worries with any supplies, namely the nic?

 

[nev99]

Sorry to jump in...

Any shelf life worries with any supplies, namely the nic?

For all supplies keep in dry, dark place to extend use.

the PG and VG i just got is marked till March 2015 so 2 years.

Remember, Glycerin and Propylene glycol are also highly "hygroscopic" which means that it absorbs water from the air. Example: if you left a bottle of pure glycerin exposed to air in your kitchen, it would take moisture from the air and eventually, it would become 80 per glycerin and 20 percent water.

example of flavor expiration from one of the sites:

Lorann's flavoring "oils" and essential oils do not have a vegetable oil base. You need not worry about spoilage or rancidity of our flavorings and essential oils, even over a period of years. LorAnn Oils guarantees the flavor strength and character of all our flavors and essential oils for a minimum of one year. It should be noted that as flavorings age for extended periods of time (i.e. 1 - 3 years) the flavor strength and or character may experience minor changes.

Since the flavors used for e-cig are generally PG or VG based, unless you notice a major change - in liquid separation, cloudiness, it should be good for the same period as VG or PG. - so about 2 years.
I have not been vaping long enough to test this- but my expectation is that at the 2 year mark, except if i run into the above mentioned problem- the max change i would notice is a slightly diminished flavor strength.

Nicotine is a slightly different issue. generally it's considered 1 year.. then you might see changes is color - it might yellow and a gradual reduction in strength.

Nicotine is sensitive to light and oxygen. So an airtight, dark glass bottle and a cool dark place are especially important here. Do not store long term in plastic. nicotine can affect plastic composition and some of it can leech in to the liquid.


Since it usually ships in plastic containers any i received got transferred to smaller 30-60ml dark (amber/blue) glass bottles. the lids are supposed to be tight .. but i put saran-wrap over the top with an elastic band. the reason for the smaller bottles is that this way while mixing you expose the smaller amount to air and not the whole one each time.

i have no idea if anyone actually tested it.. but because of possible regulations many are storing it in the freezer. it wont freeze, but it should prolong the nic concentration longer. some information says 2-5 yrs. I packed mine as above, then in ziploc bags - i know it seems like overkill but remember pg and vg is hygroscopic and nic is diluted in one or the other so i don't want it in to absorb moisture from the freezer, (just in case the bottle is not as airtight as it's suppose to be ) plus food is in there and bottles can break. and then last in a cardboard box (to separate from the rest of the freezer & breakage/light protection).

DO NOT forget to label the nicotine solution bottles. each bottle not just the ziploc bag or box.
I know someone who took a swig of photo developer (they had a mini home setup) because it was in a unlabeled green wine bottle. (they also had home made wine)

 

[JUDGMENT AFFIRMED]

if you use Rts vapes use the coupon code FIRSTORDER and save 20% if you buy in bulk DIY can be very inexpensive it cost me around $1.60 per 60 ml bottle

Save 20% with Coupon Code: SAVE20
All customers can save 20% on liquid nicotine, PG, VG, concentrated flavors and laboratory glassware plus pretty much everything else. Free shipping on all USA orders over $75.00. Sale starts on April 19 and ends midnight April 22. One time use coupon. $25.00 minimum order.
DIY E-Cig Supplies & E-Cigarette Liquid | Make Your Own E-Liquid | RTS Vapes

If it was me, I would use the SAVE20 code - its a sale - and save the FIRSTORDER code for later....I believe you would be able to still use it, but someone correct me if im wrong. Good luck to everyone, DIY is cheap, easy and fun.

 

[flintlock62]

If you buy nic base at the level you're going to vape, say 24 mg, then no. Note though that the amount of flavoring you add diminishes the nic level. If you add 10% flavoring to 24 mg nic, you will have 21.6 mg nic content.

So I'm thinking about getting into making my own juice to save money, and I have a few questions.

1.) will it save a significant amount of money? I'm not really in it for the thrill of doing it or anything, you can create your own flavors on sites like Mt. Baker Vapor which is fun and easy, so I really just want to do it if it will make a big monetary difference. Lately it seems like all my money is going to juices because I get so excited about trying different flavors!
1.a) what is a good website for cheap supplies for this?

2.) If a nicotine juice has a PG or VG base, do I still also need to buy PG/VG? or can I just use it as is? I'm looking for a fairly low level of nicotine. I usually smoke 12mg or sometimes 6mg. I don't want/need much more than that.
2.a) is there a website where I can buy the nicotine juice (in a fairly low level) and PG/VG premixed for ease of use?

3.) Is there a website that just simplifies this by selling a kit w/ everything you need? well, it wouldn't need to be *everything*, I can buy the flavors separately since that's simple enough, but the equipment and the initial unflavored juices and stuff?

thanks!


EDIT: new thought...I've been thinking about trying something w/out nicotine to see if I can cut down on my nicotine take a bit (I've been getting more nicotine now than when I was an actual smoker!). so I could just do a PG/VG mix and add flavors, right? and it'd be cheaper...thoughts?

 

[JUDGMENT AFFIRMED]

Sorry to jump in...

Any shelf life worries with any supplies, namely the nic?

HI Demiurgous,
Nic stores well for years in the freezer. I 'll get you a link on ECF.

 

[flintlock62]

Nic will last about 2 years on the shelf when kept away from light. Nic will last much longer stored in the freezer, but you MUST store it in glass bottles, preferably amber, or cobalt blue with poly cone caps. Oxidation does not harm the nic, as some stated it will.

Sorry to jump in...

Any shelf life worries with any supplies, namely the nic?

 

[JUDGMENT AFFIRMED]

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/diy-e-liquid/84321-long-term-storage-concentrated-nic.html

im still looking for the one i really want

 

[Huntsmanlance]

Yes thank you Nev99 i had all of the same questions and you helped allot!!!

 

[JUDGMENT AFFIRMED]

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...ttle-help-freezing-nic-juice.html#post2126610

 

[nev99]

Oxidation does not harm the nic, as some stated it will.

if you are referring to this :

Nicotine is a slightly different issue. generally it's considered 1 year.. then you might see changes in color - it might yellow and a gradual reduction in strength.

i never meant to imply that it will harm it. just that it will affect it. and i never meant to imply that just because it's a little (or more) yellowish and a 58mg concentration and not a 60mg i can not be used. quite the opposite.

so to clarify, the previous statement should have read like this:

It probably won't change in the first year if properly stored (cool/dark) after that you might see changes in color - it might yellow and a gradual reduction in strength might occur, but this should not adversely affect it in any way.​

while this is not a laboratory study the Nicotine Concentration Over Time experiment does show that the of the 2 bottles of nic concentration left in the light the one that was opened had a lower nicotine concentration after 4 months then the one that was just left in the light. and that in both the nicotine strength diminished. so after 4 months a 35mg liquid tested at 32mg exposed to light and at 31mg exposed to light and oxygen.

The resident chemists (in the DIY section) also seem to concur that oxygen does affect it. and that to minimize this the bottles should be topped off and as little air space left between the liquid and lid.

some more information on this can be found at
Smoke Juice Storage Tips

and one more tip: i would definitely recommend getting a nic test kit. a lot of the DIY supply stores sell them, this is just one Nicotine Testing Kit, and test your liquid on arrival. You want to make sure that your base liquid is what you think it is, so that the target strength is achieved and not over or under shot and that you are 100% sure you know what concentration of liquid you are handling.

Remember nicotine poisoning can be deadly, so treat the ingredients you are using with the respect and care they deserve. And observe proper safety.

If you are planing to store nic for long term i would test each batch before use. It should not change at all or at least not significantly (specially from the freezer) but its a 5 min test and 1ml of liquid used, and it's the responsible way for dealing with a substance like nicotine.

Yes thank you Nev99 i had all of the same questions and you helped allot!!!

yw, and glad it helps