DNA 200 317l stainless steel/haywire

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ThinkCloudyThoughts

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I'm about to build a 24g as coil for temp control. To space or not to space, to twist or not to twist?

I know nickel is a different beast, and I've gotten pretty good with it, but I rather like ss in non temp mode, and wanna give it a go in temp mode. Plus, I use ss for comps, so I'd like to be able to use those same builds for temp control if possible, just don't know if ss is like nickel and works better evenly spaced...any help would be great. Still can only post here, same angiemcskruf, new name.

Also, on steam engine, if not necessary to space the coils, should I enter the space between coils as "0mm" or like .01?

Thanks in advance, come see me on instance, giveaway coming soon!: instagram.com/think.cloudy.thoughts
 

suprtrkr

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I build contact coils in SS all the time, and use them in both wattage and TC modes. I have heard some people like spaced coils better for TC, but I haven't ever tried it. Twists work just fine, but 24ga is pretty big wire. You're going to have some pretty large coils, especially if you're building duals (or triples or...) and/or spacing them, to get some resistance going. Regarding the SE entry, I am not certain what you're asking. If you mean "Wrap Spacing" on the Wire Wizard page, mine pops up at .05mm, which is finer than a human hair, so I just leave it there for contact coils. I can't measure it any closer than that anyway. For spaced coils, I usually use the thread pitch of the machine screw I wind it on, but an alternative would be to measure the length of a specific number of wraps, then divide the measurement by the number.
 

ThinkCloudyThoughts

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Feb 18, 2016
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I build contact coils in SS all the time, and use them in both wattage and TC modes. I have heard some people like spaced coils better for TC, but I haven't ever tried it. Twists work just fine, but 24ga is pretty big wire. You're going to have some pretty large coils, especially if you're building duals (or triples or...) and/or spacing them, to get some resistance going. Regarding the SE entry, I am not certain what you're asking. If you mean "Wrap Spacing" on the Wire Wizard page, mine pops up at .05mm, which is finer than a human hair, so I just leave it there for contact coils. I can't measure it any closer than that anyway. For spaced coils, I usually use the thread pitch of the machine screw I wind it on, but an alternative would be to measure the length of a specific number of wraps, then divide the measurement by the number.
Thanks so much, I'll get wrapping, I'll stick to regular duals! Gonna get the laptop out now
 
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ThinkCloudyThoughts

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Feb 18, 2016
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I build contact coils in SS all the time, and use them in both wattage and TC modes. I have heard some people like spaced coils better for TC, but I haven't ever tried it. Twists work just fine, but 24ga is pretty big wire. You're going to have some pretty large coils, especially if you're building duals (or triples or...) and/or spacing them, to get some resistance going. Regarding the SE entry, I am not certain what you're asking. If you mean "Wrap Spacing" on the Wire Wizard page, mine pops up at .05mm, which is finer than a human hair, so I just leave it there for contact coils. I can't measure it any closer than that anyway. For spaced coils, I usually use the thread pitch of the machine screw I wind it on, but an alternative would be to measure the length of a specific number of wraps, then divide the measurement by the number.
Just wanted to let you know that I succeeded that same night as well as dialing in my perfect vape in escribe, not to mention got my screens looking pretty cool ;)
 
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suprtrkr

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Just wanted to let you know that I succeeded that same night as well as dialing in my perfect vape in escribe, not to mention got my screens looking pretty cool ;)
BTW, next time you rebuild... I had great luck with my very first stainless build ever, which was parallel 28 316s for .11Ω. It rocked in both TC and wattage on the RX200s and the Koopor Plus. I have built in in both the Indulgence MT and the Advken Ωega (I set 'em up for a side-by-side test). In fact, the Ωega is still wearing that very first build, a month or three later. I think I've wicked it 3 or 4 times, but stainless burns so clean when you fire it to get the gunk off, and it's such a powerful coil set, I have never seen any reason to change it.
 

muth

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BTW, next time you rebuild... I had great luck with my very first stainless build ever, which was parallel 28 316s for .11Ω. It rocked in both TC and wattage on the RX200s and the Koopor Plus. I have built in in both the Indulgence MT and the Advken Ωega (I set 'em up for a side-by-side test). In fact, the Ωega is still wearing that very first build, a month or three later. I think I've wicked it 3 or 4 times, but stainless burns so clean when you fire it to get the gunk off, and it's such a powerful coil set, I have never seen any reason to change it.
Thx, suprtrkr, for the info. I'm fairly new to ss and the first coil I cleaned arced on me. Too much heat. To be honest, I've yet to find a TC setting that is much better than wattage mode. Right now, I'm using a Cuboid in ss316 mode with a TCR setting of 0108. Too me, it pretty much matches the vape I get from it in power mode. I'm using a tank, so I'm not concerned about cotton burn so much. What say ye, suprtrkr, about these things? It almost seems like TC is an "unnecessary evil" in this case. Some reviewers and vapers say it can and should be used in regular power mode. I'm liking the clean, crisp taste I get, so should I stop spending my dough on more TC devices?:p
 

suprtrkr

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Thx, suprtrkr, for the info. I'm fairly new to ss and the first coil I cleaned arced on me. Too much heat. To be honest, I've yet to find a TC setting that is much better than wattage mode. Right now, I'm using a Cuboid in ss316 mode with a TCR setting of 0108. Too me, it pretty much matches the vape I get from it in power mode. I'm using a tank, so I'm not concerned about cotton burn so much. What say ye, suprtrkr, about these things? It almost seems like TC is an "unnecessary evil" in this case. Some reviewers and vapers say it can and should be used in regular power mode. I'm liking the clean, crisp taste I get, so should I stop spending my dough on more TC devices?:p
I jumped on the TC bandwagon early, but Ni wire was so bad I never even tried Ti when it became available. I got into stainless when I bought my first RX200. It is, in fact, very clean, and works beautifully in a TC mod where you can input the TCR code to match your stainless grade. That said, I generally prefer power mode myself. That's not a knock on TC by any stretch; a lot of people love it. I just don't happen to be one of them. Good luck finding a VW mod without TC these days, though. Regulated mods are handy and useful, but you don't have to use TC mode if you don't want. You still get the safety and ease of use of a regulated in power mode. Stainless also works just fine in a mech mod, if you've got small enough wire and room for enough wraps. I put a dual 28ga SS316 build, 11/10 wraps, 2.5mm mandrel, .67 ohms, in the FX22/Troy2 combo last night. She's horseshoe wicked rayon-- the Troy has a Genny style deck, with low outers and a tall center post for vertical coils-- and she vapes like a dream.
 
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muth

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Haha, sounds nice. I always thought gennies were a great idea. Don't see em much these days. I think vertical coils inherently have better flavor anyway. Don't you?

I had better luck with my first try at Ti than I did at Ni. But the tempered Ni is way better, almost like working with kanthal. I just like to keep things simple if I can.
I've heard that the ipv5 works well with ss, too. So you think your RX gives you a better ss vape in TC mode than in power mode?
 

suprtrkr

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Haha, sounds nice. I always thought gennies were a great idea. Don't see em much these days. I think vertical coils inherently have better flavor anyway. Don't you?

I had better luck with my first try at Ti than I did at Ni. But the tempered Ni is way better, almost like working with kanthal. I just like to keep things simple if I can.
I've heard that the ipv5 works well with ss, too. So you think your RX gives you a better ss vape in TC mode than in power mode?
Personally, I have never understood the attraction of the Gennys. Why on Earth would I want an tank that's guaranteed to leak if I knock it over? Why a top coil tank, where the wick must work against gravity, when bottom coil tanks are available? Now, the die-hard Genny fans will consider this heresy, doubtless, and maybe they're right. I haven't ever tried one, so that's all a guess. The true purists insist on SS mesh wicks as well. I recently bought a Fakir's Mods FX22/Troy2 combo, and the topper has a Genny-style deck, with two lower outer screws and a tall center post, and is obviously designed for vertical coils. And I thought, what the heck, so I put a set of mesh wicks in it. It was the first set I ever built, and I was very careful with them. Wonder of wonders, I accidentally got it right the first time, and didn't get the nasty metallic taste you have to work through if you fail to oxidize properly. I will say the mesh wicks are very clean tasting. I am told complex flavor profile juices, like the bakery flavors, are at their best on mesh wicks. It may be true, but you couldn't prove it by me as I prefer bright, simple flavors in my juice, like fruits and spices. I was doing DIY for over a year before I ever tried a juice with more than one flavor. The conclusion I have drawn is, while mesh wicks are ver clean tasting, they are no more so than rayon after the break-in period. If you oxidize them right, there's no break-in, but the extra effort required to build them, versus just vaping a piece of rayon for a while and waiting for the taste to go away, is not worth the effort. That's me, though, and others may have a different opinion.

I can't say I actually like the TC mode on the RX better than wattage. I generally don't use TC much at all. I have done enough of it on the RXs to say they have a really good TC system (with the V3.0 firmware), but my preferred mode is still wattage. I'm too Old Skool, I guess. I'm a mekkie from way back, and I just build the coil I want for the vape I'm looking for, at whatever wattage I intend to use. I do it without thinking. Regulated mods are a godsend for people who don't want to take the time to suffer the learning curve I have, and they're safer for everybody, but it's fair to say I don't use them to their full potential as far as adjusting the vape because I don't need to.

Regarding vertical coils and all other things being equal, I do think they offer better flavor in drippers with side air flow, whether this be slots in the top cap, or through a central tube with vents, or top-and-turn designs like the Wotofo Sapor, and provided they are traditionally wicked with the wick pulled through the center of the coil. In bottom air drippers, and tanks so arranged, you're better off with horizontals using traditional wicking. The problem with this is it's beastly difficult to get sufficient juice flow to the coil save in low wattage builds because it's hard to have room to return the top wick tail to the deck to get the other half of the wicking the coil needs. Traditionally, the wick used with center pull wicks and verticals is a horseshoe, where the wick starts at the deck, goes through one coil, then the other, then back to the deck. That can dry out at higher wattages through inability to wick fast enough to keep up, although the juice "stored" in the horseshoe bend can help, especially if the coils are widely spaced. I tend to vape in the.5Ω, 30-50 watts range, and I have had this problem. I usually wick my Troy, which has to be build vertical as I said, with a horseshoe, but this forces me to build in the .65-and-up ohm range, and lower the wattage down into the 17-25 watt range on a mech. It's not a real problem, I know how to build and I can get better cloud out of a 1Ω 32ga coil at 17watts than a lot of people with their .3Ω 26/32 claptons at 50 watts. But it's not what I want to do, usually, and it forces me into smaller gauge wire.

It is possible to get huge flavor and big cloud at higher wattages using verticals in bottom air attys if you arrange the coils above the air towers and wick the outside of the coils, letting the air flow through the middle. I built an Indulgence MT tank like that, and it blew me away with the flavor and cloud. It's coiled at .41 and will keep wicking at least up to 80 watts, which is the highest I have ever taken it. I had to build a special tool for the mandrel as the air holes in the MT are oblong, not round, so the coils are shaped, in cross section, like a rectangle with rounded corners. Here's some pics; the thing under my finger in the second photo is the mandrel tool:
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suprtrkr

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Nice pix, thx. I haven't seen anyone bother to make oval coils to match their AF. Creative! I just got a Griffin with a similar situation, oval AF. I was thinking of putting 2 verticals on it.
The tool is 3 pieces of 1/16" stainless rod I bought from a model shop, originally to fill in the posts below the wire holes in 2mm post attys. I just cut 3 pieces of the shaft about 1.5" long and taped them together at one end. I wanted a tool that would fit down into the air flow holes so I could use the tool to lever the coils into place. On that atty, it works just fine. One other guy in the Indulgence MT thread used a tiny Craftsman wrench handle to make his; he cut the wrench foot off the end and uses the shaft :)
 

FishingBuffalo

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Personally, I have never understood the attraction of the Gennys. Why on Earth would I want an tank that's guaranteed to leak if I knock it over? Why a top coil tank, where the wick must work against gravity, when bottom coil tanks are available?

BTW Nice build pics. We wouldn't be where we are today if folks didn't come up with better ways to build tanks (KF4 or Uwell Crown or well any vape modern tank) that have more logical theories of operation if they didn't get a Genny, being tired of CE's/Carto's/etc, knock it over, cleaned up the mess, and ask "How can we make it so it don't do that". EVOLUTION!
 
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ThinkCloudyThoughts

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stainless is great in wattage, but gets even better in temp control. that being said I agree with whoever said it works better when you have a programmed material for that specific type of stainless steel.
you're much more likely to fall in love with temp control with a DNA.

be warned, when I vape unregulated, I'm less .... about making sure my wick is wet and have gotten some killer dry hits.

a DNA 200 will spoil your wick diligence in much the same way spell check spoiled my spelling skills ( if you don't use it you lose it, ya know)

I love ss because it's versatile, and I much rather have to torch it to make it pliable than have to baby it like nickel. plus, I hate spacing coils
 

sawlight

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Now, you knew this would happen.
On the aspect of gennies, I agree, they are a fiddley leaking mess! BUT, when they work right, they are amazing! Back when, all I would vape was Mad Murdock's 710, you want to talk about complex, that was it! It was sheer heaven in a genny! So many things hitting you at once, trying to sort it all out, it was amazing! I couldn't get that from a dripper, much less a tank of any sort, even a KFL.
Are they a pain in the .... to build? Absolutely!
Do they leak? Absolutely!
Do they travel well? Not so much! I took a ZAP on a Provari to a NASCAR race, it was a long day! Rocked an Ihybrid at Disneyworld in my wheelchair, not so much!
But if you have something you really want to taste the flavors, that's the way to go.
Sorry, had to go there.
 
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