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E-Cigs to be banned in Uruguay.

Discussion in 'Legislation News' started by xybe, Nov 22, 2009.

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  1. xybe

    xybe Full Member ECF Veteran

    Nov 5, 2009
    Montevideo, Uruguay.
    Following the lead of neighboring country Brazil, the Uruguayan Ministry of Health is planning a ban on electronic cigarettes. (text is in spanish)

    The reasons cited by the Minister of Health show lack of information on personal vaporizers: she stated that however small the amount, there is still nicotine present [in the e-liquids, i guess]; she also mentioned the presence of toxic ethylglycol gas in the vapor and the lack of proof that personal vaporizers work as an effective treatment for the cessation of tobacco consumption.

    Following links are in Spanish.

    MSP se opone al cigarrillo electrónico - Diario EL PAIS - Montevideo - Uruguay

    Prohibirán en Uruguay la venta del cigarrillo electrónico - Tiempos Del Mundo - TDM.com


    I find myself at a loss for words to express my frustration and disappointment at a supposedly forward-thinking government that would so easily restrict our freedoms. I don't think they know what they want to ban, much less why they are banning it.

    There is no need to further explain the absurdity of the situation to the readers of this forum but I wonder if our authorities will listen to reason.

    Note: English is not my first language so please excuse any readability problems this post may have.
     
  2. cliff5550

    cliff5550 Ultra Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Your understandable frustration came through very well.
     
  3. oldlady

    oldlady Senior Member ECF Veteran

    Nov 7, 2009
    Charleston, SC
    Do we have a list of countries that have "approved" the use of e-cigs? For example, I believe Ireland, New Zealand and the United Kingdom have said okay to the use of e-cigs.

    Also a very compelling report in favor of e-cigs has been published by a doctor in Canada. Are e-cigs legal there?

    It would be great to have a list, we could point to when writing to policy makers.
     
  4. Vocalek

    Vocalek CASAA Activist ECF Veteran

    Supporting member
    Apr 7, 2009
    Springfield, VA
    Quien sabe? (Who knows) whether your officials will listen to logic and reason any more than ours. It looks to me as if your government officials and ours have the same challenges when it comes to saying what they mean. When you say "cessation of tobacco consumption" that is exactly what you mean. Whey they say "cessation of tobacco consumption" what they really mean is "cessation of nicotine consumption."

    So of course you are confused when you have found something that allowed you to stop smoking, and they want to ban it because it contains nicotine.

    Duh! The reason you smoked was to get nicotine. The most effective way to get anyone who is nicotine-dependent to stop smoking is to provide an acceptable alternative source of nicotine that does not involve inhaling smoke. It is because the product contains adequate amounts of nicotine that it has an 80% success rate as a substitute for smoking. http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/quitting/6470-e-cig-success-rate.html

    But you see, that isn't "good enough" in their minds. Unless the product has some magical property makes you not need nicotine any more, it isn't a "smoking cessation treatment" at all as far as they are concerned.

    Switching to this product reduces your risk of smoking-related disease and death by 99%. They want to hold out for a 100% reduction by hoping that you will give up all nicotine products whatsoever. But the odds of your doing that are, at best, 1 in 10. The result is that they maintain an extra 1% of safety for 10% of the people, while 90% of the people continue to suffer terrible diseases and an early death. They have gained nothing at all and the 90% have lost everything.
     
  5. spradling

    spradling Unregistered Supplier ECF Veteran

    Mar 4, 2009
    Montevideo, Uruguay
    This SUCKS!!!! I'm a supplier in this country!!! I'll keep you guys updated on the news.

    We'll do our best to represent the e-cig community and fight this!! Class-action lawsuit against the government is imminent!
     
  6. PTJD

    PTJD Vaping At FL370 Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Oct 20, 2008
    Malaga, Spain
    Sorry to hear this, Good Luck Spradling!
     
  7. yvilla

    yvilla Ultra Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Nov 18, 2008
    Rochester, NY
    ¡Lo siento mucho xybe y spradling!

    Suerte en su lucha.
     
  8. oldtechno

    oldtechno Super Member ECF Veteran

    Uruguary? Never heard of it.

    Nonetheless, I ain't gonna hold it against them. They're probably poor and don't got the ten million dollars it'd take to test this product completely.

    Just the same...I think all of us should rumor to the 'women taking action' types in the good old United States "E-cigs are the fountain of youth". They'll show up on the FDA's door steps (zillions of them--everyone of them a long legged cutie) with huge white picket signs.......in bold black letters 'THE FDA SUCKS!!!'

    Then, they'll burn the building down and we'll be rid of this problem.
     
  9. xybe

    xybe Full Member ECF Veteran

    Nov 5, 2009
    Montevideo, Uruguay.
    You have read my mind and put my thoughts into words.

    I think vaping will persist in Uruguay in spite of the ban. And I fear there is little to be done. Smoking is being progressively banned here, first at enclosed spaces in government buildings or private business; later any place in any government owned facility, whether enclosed or not. For some reason the tobacco business did not stop that and they are rather big compared to a small business like spradling has (and as far as I know he is one of the three main players in the market).

    A new iolite is on its way to me, and for now it is not illegal to vaporize tobacco (oh, the irony).
     
  10. rocketvapor

    rocketvapor Super Member ECF Veteran

    Jul 19, 2009
    Rockledge, FL
  11. Vocalek

    Vocalek CASAA Activist ECF Veteran

    Supporting member
    Apr 7, 2009
    Springfield, VA
  12. BriDog67

    BriDog67 Senior Member ECF Veteran

    Oct 12, 2009
    Wisconsin USA
    Just curious xybe, how much does your government stand to lose in tax revenue due to reduced tobacco sales?
     
  13. Soon to be E

    Soon to be E Senior Member ECF Veteran

    Paulie, thought about moving to Baires? Your ever cheating ecigsmoker neighbour Susana...:p

    Seriously, Argentina fortunately has taken no position yet... Nicotine products such as patches and gums are sold in pharmacies but over the counter. I hope they stay like that. But they can´t forbid mail orders, and many ecig smokers and sellers will go underground... I hope this reverts somehow, because going on holidays will mean hauling tons of equipment otherwise...
     
  14. xybe

    xybe Full Member ECF Veteran

    Nov 5, 2009
    Montevideo, Uruguay.
    No idea but I don´t think they have that in mind. The president is an oncologist and he truly believes that he is doing this for our own good. IMNSHO he is acting as an well intentioned, ignorant despot. It doesn't help that the Ministry of Health is only providing him with the FDA´s party line on the matter.
     
  15. JohnnyVapor

    JohnnyVapor Super Member ECF Veteran

    Oct 23, 2009
    Chicago, IL
    Isn't there a quote about that? Something along the lines of "The worst sort of despotism is when they're looking out for your best interests"?

    Xybe, I'm sure Uruguay is a beautiful place, but maybe it might be time to move. :)
     
  16. xybe

    xybe Full Member ECF Veteran

    Nov 5, 2009
    Montevideo, Uruguay.
    New Zeland is looking OK right now, maybe the UK or Canada? :p My wife is Brazilian but no point in moving there since there is a ban in place in Brazil as well.
     
  17. spradling

    spradling Unregistered Supplier ECF Veteran

    Mar 4, 2009
    Montevideo, Uruguay
    Exactly!! The phrase she uses "the amounts of nic are low, but it's still there" was taken directly from the FDA's comment on their finding of small amounts of nicotine in carts labeled 0nic. She uses this phrase against ecigs in general, they're supposed to have nicotine! They don't even have a valid argument, that's a bull**** phrase!!

    She then mentions DEG, but DEG is not a component on ALL ecigs, this is not a reason to ban them, it's a reason to regulate the safety of the products being sold. You don't ban all toys because lead was found in some coming from China!

    And then she says it's not proven to be an effective treatment against addiction, it's not meant for that you idiots! Plus you don't ban a product because it's not proven to be effective for cessation, even if it's promoted as such, you disprove it first and then ban it for false advertising, but there's no advertising here.

    And come on!! The patch and gum are less than 5% effective, and Champix, while more effective, has more than 100 cases of suicides and more than 100 cases of suicide intention, and this is allowed!

    And just because it's not proven to be effective doesn't mean it isn't, do the fracking test already! I have a huge client list all ready for you if you want some evidence, people already using it for months, and I have kits available for you to test yourself if you want too!


    Thanks for that, I'll keep it in mind :)


    Gracias! Thank you guys for your support!


    Don't know, cigs are $3 here, not insanely high as in the states and europe but not tax or almost tax-free cigs for $1-1.5, they do actually get a bunch from these taxes I think even though they're not as high as other places. They've been rising higher and higher for a few years, they used to cost $1 a pack, now it's trippled to $3 a pack.
    I think there is a high % of smoker population compared to other countries.


    LOL, hi Susana!! Actually, if I can't revert this law in the short term I'm definitely moving to BsAs! I have to continue the business some how. If I can't get my importations through and/or have problems with the law for selling them I'll just move my "base" to Argentina and have shipping to Uruguay for my customers here LOL, and in the process have less costs, importation taxes are way to high here. And I'll be much closer to my "other" customers :)


    Disagree and agree.
    I disagree he believes he is doing this for our own good, he is not an ignorant person for this issue in particular, he is a Doctor, a cancer doctor nonetheless, if he studied this topic there is no way he couldn't have reached the obvious conclusion that this is less dangerous than tobacco. I think he had pressure from somewhere else.
    I agree the Health Ministry is being a ..... and not providing him with the sufficient information, they don't even know what they're talking about.


    Uruguay truly is beautiful, no reason to move because of this, the use of ecigs is still legal and you can get supplies from international suppliers.
     
  18. spradling

    spradling Unregistered Supplier ECF Veteran

    Mar 4, 2009
    Montevideo, Uruguay
    Well, the damned law has passed, the President and ALL of the Ministers (Industry, Economy, etc) have signed it, seems he didn't want to be alone with this, only his signature is required.

    It's still legal to sell for a few more days until the law is officially published. We'll see what happens after, if I'm able to get my orders through customs and selling with no problem or not.

    I'm speaking with lawyers, we will commence a lawsuit against this law, I will keep you guys updated on the progress.

    Since a lawsuit against a law can take a long time we will be also be commencing a "Amparo" which is a much shorter/faster lawsuit that can only be done in the case the long wait of the regular lawsuit can be dangerous (in this case to eh health of thousands).

    Here's a copy of the law banning ecigs signed by the President yesterday: MSP Decretoe Cigarro Electronico BMH
     
  19. xybe

    xybe Full Member ECF Veteran

    Nov 5, 2009
    Montevideo, Uruguay.
    Paul, glad to see that you are fighting for your rights and your customers'. I believe that the term for "Amparo" in English is safe-haven.
     
  20. xybe

    xybe Full Member ECF Veteran

    Nov 5, 2009
    Montevideo, Uruguay.
    Paul, I know you understand this but I am clarifying this for the non Uruguayans here, the ban was issued by a decree, not a law.

    If I am reading this text correctly e-cigs were banned because they were not proved to help stop smoking which is preposterous and because they might be causing children to smoke (the latter is, of course, utterly unsubstantiated).
     
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