Flavor bans pave the way for IQOS

[greenmachine17]

Heres the thing.
I smoked menthol 40+yrs.
When I started vaping, I added menthol to the flavor.great. a breakfast Newport !
But I occasionally stole a smoke from somebody.
I was then educated to that fact, and slowly eliminated the menthol..
Last year I bummed a smoke(4got mod in car) wow. I h8ed it. Seriously, 1 puff and threw it away.
Dont like the taste, smell of tobacco.
Last fact.
This is sooo messed up,that KILLER cigarettes are still on the shelves, but THEY wanna take our alternative..big tobacco must have been hurting$$$

 

[AttyPops]

This is sooo messed up,that KILLER cigarettes are still on the shelves, but THEY wanna take our alternative..big tobacco must have been hurting$$$

I don't think they will be, at least not with the same level of access, for very long. But the politicians can't SAY that. So we get fed B.S. while they turn the market over to BT and a smoke free future.

 

[mgordon1100]

I just learned of this through Google. I opened up a new tab, and they fed me this article from CNN. So CNN is feeding the schmucks ads now, and pretending they're articles.

On topic, this device seems to be a personal version of the Volcano. I don't want to get in trouble here, but let's face it, the Volcano and vaping leaf was the start of what we all enjoy. So vaping isn't the issue, is it. Obviously BT is running scared, so kids are being used as pawns, literally so it would seem over the past month. What did we say 10 years ago? Not for kids. It's not a cessation device, never call it that. Don't make any false claims because BG will be all over it. Here we are, we were just fine until it got the corporate attention.

 

[zoiDman]

Actually, the tobacco settlement money is supposed to go towards tobacco illnesses, research, tobacco related medical healthcare, cessations, etc.. etc.. ...

That's Funny.

There are Rumblings that Connecticut might Fall.

And then there is this per kristin's Heads Up thread...

"As a state senator, I believe that legislative action can impact societal behavior, but I also know that when it comes to issues such as these, we need more than laws. We need to raise awareness and educate families and educators, equipping them with information and resources they need to discuss the dangers and health risks of vaping. Unfortunately, this is an area where Connecticut has fallen behind. While we are first in terms of cigarette taxes (at $4.35 per pack, we are tied with New York for the highest in the United States), we are last in tobacco control and prevention funding.

Tobacco companies have paid billions of dollars to state governments as part of the largest civil litigation settlement in U.S. history. Sadly, in Connecticut over the past 19 years, just more than 1 percent of those annual payments deposited into the Tobacco Settlement Fund have actually been spent in support of smoking cessation and education services. Instead, funding intended for tobacco control has been raided, cut, swept or redirected 79 times. Only $29.2 million has been spent on tobacco control since the fund was established in 2000, while $277 million has been redirected to non-tobacco-related programs."

Sen. Tony Hwang (opinion): A call to action on vaping

 

[bombastinator]

That's Funny.

Some sort of quote confusion here. You seem to be quoting yourself without a reply. Not sure what is going on

 

[Tabac man]

...equipping them with information and resources they need to discuss the dangers and health risks of vaping.

Just spat me coffee out and leaked a bit of pee.

 

[zoiDman]

Some sort of quote confusion here. You seem to be quoting yourself without a reply. Not sure what is going on

Read what enspaceman said.

Then Read the Self Quote and I think it will make sense.

 

[zoiDman]

Just spat me coffee out and leaked a bit of pee.

Hey... The good senator Didn't say it had to be Truthful Information or Resources.

So Technically, Tony wasn't Lying.

 

[stols001]

You know, I could see getting on for the husband vaping is not working for him, that's for sure.

I wonder how much prices will rise on the few vape options left, once all is said and done. I am guessing a LOT as monopolies tend to do. I don't want to get him going on it and then the cost, etc.. We used loose tobacco and an injector machine and a Native Reservation, I'm probably on of the few folks not saving money hand over fist.

I don't begrudge this device at all really but I am not convinced how harm reduction it is yet. I very MUCH begrudge everything ELSE that is going on, however.

Anna

 

[bombastinator]

You know, I could see getting on for the husband vaping is not working for him, that's for sure.

I wonder how much prices will rise on the few vape options left, once all is said and done. I am guessing a LOT as monopolies tend to do. I don't want to get him going on it and then the cost, etc.. We used loose tobacco and an injector machine and a Native Reservation, I'm probably on of the few folks not saving money hand over fist.

I don't begrudge this device at all really but I am not convinced how harm reduction it is yet. I very MUCH begrudge everything ELSE that is going on, however.

Anna

Like all things proprietary there is very little actual data. Looking at the construction and materials, it seems to be somewhere between a cigarette and an e-cigarette health wise. It’s also almost as easy to adulterate as vape juice. {Not quite} AS easy, but not that much less so.
{One of the big problems is that because it is “tobacco” even though it’s actually paper made from tobacco plants they can put basically anything they want in it and duck the deeming entirely}

 

[Rossum]

Like all things proprietary there is very little actual data. Looking at the construction and materials, it seems to be somewhere between a cigarette and an e-cigarette health wise.

Yes, but probably closer to an e-cig than a combustible.

It’s also almost as easy to adulterate as vape juice. {Not quite} AS easy, but not that much less so.
{One of the big problems is that because it is “tobacco” even though it’s actually paper made from tobacco plants they can put basically anything they want in it and duck the deeming entirely}

Huh? That's not how any of this works. IQOS is in no way grandfathered. Altria filed a PMTA and the FDA approved it. That means Altria had to disclose every ingredient in the product, including amounts, as well as details regarding the manufacturing process. It also means the can't change anything at all without filing at least an SE application disclosing what they propose to change.

Sorry, but I don't see how IQOS is any easier to "adulterate" than a traditional cigarette is.

 

[AttyPops]

Sorry, but I don't see how IQOS is any easier to "adulterate" than a traditional cigarette is.

Which never stopped them before. But that's a different point.

 

[Rossum]

Which never stopped them before. But that's a different point.

True, but somehow they managed to convince the FDA that this product was "appropriate for the public health", and that's a pretty high bar.

Also, I have some (less than a pack and half) of personal experience with it, and it's certainly my perception that it's substantially less harmful than combustible cigarettes.

 

[AttyPops]

True, but somehow they managed to convince the FDA that this product was "appropriate for the public health", and that's a pretty high bar.

Also, I have some (less than a pack and half) of personal experience with it, and it's certainly my perception that it's substantially less harmful than combustible cigarettes.

The graphs of "chemical intensities" I've seen put it at about 30% of cig-harm, whereas e-cigs are about 5%. All "ish" of course.

Besides, IDK if even 5% of the chemical exposure is that much safer, it all depends I guess. I mean, is playing Russian Roulette with 1 bullet vs 3 that much safer as compared to not doing it at all?

But I digress. We're exposed to all sorts of stuff all the time, VOCs, exhaust, smog, etc.

Still, I take the low 5% odds over smoking again.

 

[zoiDman]

True, but somehow they managed to convince the FDA that this product was "appropriate for the public health", and that's a pretty high bar.

...

Yeah... somehow.

 

[stols001]

Do not cigarette makers have to disclose all the other billion things they add to someone, health wise? Perhaps this question is very naïve but I have like, never wondered about that.

It's all very well and good to disclose one's proprietary ingredients to a government agency-- I'm sort of not trusting BT OR the FEDs right now frankly.

I would like to know what is in it. Just like McDonald's Special Sauce which I believe to be pretty close to uh, what is that dang salad dressing called, right thousand island..

IDK I'll just show it to him first.. He can decide. I can't GIVE someone motivation if they don't have it. OH how I have wished for that magic super secret power SO BADLY at times. And yet all I can do is lead the damn horse and those who have owned horses (including myself) know that horses are lovable and wonderful but also flighty, not very smart, herd animals and they can get RATHER stubborn especially if cornered. Yeah, horses can really SUCK.

I might buy one and a donkey to keep it company like if we buy land! LOL. Maybe.

Anna

 

[zoiDman]

Do not cigarette makers have to disclose all the other billion things they add to someone, health wise? Perhaps this question is very naïve but I have like, never wondered about that.

Sure...

Just scroll down and Check Out what PMI puts in a "HEETS".

Making Heated Tobacco Products

And like I said in another thread... "A Day without POLYVINYL ACETATE is like a Day without Smoking."

 

[bombastinator]

Yes, but probably closer to an e-cig than a combustible.


Huh? That's not how any of this works. IQOS is in no way grandfathered. Altria filed a PMTA and the FDA approved it. That means Altria had to disclose every ingredient in the product, including amounts, as well as details regarding the manufacturing process. It also means the can't change anything at all without filing at least an SE application disclosing what they propose to change.

this may be true. I was working off the protections for tobacco products. The issue is the iQOS is a two part device. There is the heater, and then there are the “cigarettes” that aren’t, really, which you Insert into it that take the place of vape juice. The cigarettes are technically cogarettes though and as far as I can tell are both where literally everything comes from, and are more or less immune from any sort of legislation. I could be wrong about that though.

Sorry, but I don't see how IQOS is any easier to "adulterate" than a traditional cigarette is.

. Traditional cigarettes are not all that hard to mod. It’s not often done in the USA because BT doesn’t like it, but outside of North America it’s not uncommon.

Various ways I know of off the top of my head right this second without any research:
use something other than an approved insert is the easiest one. They’re basically shredded paper soaked in juice. The paper is made from tobacco leaves which makes them technically cigarettes but just about anything could be used. There’s other stuff too. Dipping is one. That’s a traditional way to treat cigarettes and would work just as well. Another traditional cigarette method is spikes which are pushed into the end of the cigarette. Then there’s machine hand rolls. @stolls seems to know about those. There’s also whatever the cigarette smugglers come up with. Sky’s the limit there.

 

[bombastinator]

Actually, the tobacco settlement money is supposed to go towards tobacco illnesses, research, tobacco related medical healthcare, cessations, etc.. etc.. This would actually mean that Vaping is entitled to some of that tobacco settlement money, because vaping is an effective treatment.

“Supposed to” being the key phrase. In practice it doesn’t.

 

[ENAUD]

I used to roll my cigs between my fingers and un pack about a 1/4 of them, then mix some weed with the tobacco and re pack them, wonder if this would also work with the IQUOS HEETS...