four months into e cigs.. nicotine tolerance levels.. ??

[trog100]

okay take two half ounce per day roll up smokers.. me and my eldest son.. we discover e cigs.. we are lucky.. we pick a good one to start with.. the generic 901.. course we dont know this at the time cos we have nothing to compare.. we do now..

the cigs arrive.. we believed the one cart equals twenty real cigs stuff.. why not we knew no better back then..

off we go.. three of us to be honest my youngest son should be part of the tale.. miracles of miracles the things actually seem to work.. our desire for real fags is eased massively.. the first day down from fifty skinny roll ups to only ten.. all with no will power or effort.. we are over joyed..

we soon realized atomizers aint the most l reliable devices and order ten more spare ones..

now for the part thats bothering me at the moment.. nicotine tolerance.. when we first started with these things we actually made a single mini cart last nearly all day.. partly because we though one should last all day having taken in the twenty real cigs nonsense..

for one whole month we simply smoked the things.. the cart consumption sneaked up to 1.5 cart a day for me and my eldest son.. my youngest son who we assumed was the lightest smoker.. seemed to be using carts quicker than me and the eldest.. noticably quicker.. a puzzle.. why should he be..

also he said his atomizers were not lasting very long.. i said mine has been working for a months and its okay.. he said its rubbish try one of the new ones.. he was correct compared to a new one my atomizer was rubbish.. so was my eldest sons..

the interesting thing is i had not noticed but when compared with a new one it was more than obvious.. the power of human subjectivity at work..

so what i was happy with i am no longer happy with.. two atomizers go in the bin..he he

okay.. now four months down the line and much experimenting with different types of e cigs where are we.. we are at a major problem point.. i am binning atomizers at an alarming rate.. three or four days from new they are no longer good enough for me.. my e cig running costs are going up dramatically..

so why.. human subjectivity or is my bodies nicotine tolerance built up to the point where anything less than a brand new e cig cant satisfy me...they seemed to be able to three months ago so what is happening.. ???

these things all drop off quickly given heavy use.. my eldest son is in the same position.. he has a mental handicap so i need to buy for two and keep his cigs running..

i strongly suspects its the bodies nicotine tolerance levels.. we both need more nicotine than we used to do.. perhaps twice as much..

dont get me wrong here a brand new e cig is still up to the job but a few days old one isnt.. basically i am binning these things before i used to bin these things.. my cart consumption has gone up five fold and i cant believe i used to make one mini cart last nearly all day or one atomizer last a whole month..

the whole experience is getting very frustrating.. i am sick of spending half my time keeping the devices going at the levels i need them to be going at.. in short the first joy has gone and i am heartily sick of the whole thing.. i wont quit e cigs but i am getting p-ssed off with them.. and i can see why others faced with the same situation might well go back to the real thing..

its got harder after four months not easier.. its all to easy when sat at a computer or in doors to puff away at these things.. has my bodies tolerance levels gone up that much.. i dont know..

trog

 

[KatyS]

I was sorry to hear your experience for past few months. Maybe its the make of your cigarette, they have made vast improvements in last 4 months 4th generation cigs are much better. I too have been on E-cig for 4 months and have not had a regular cigarette. I had problems with my first penstyle and had to replace the atomizers and batteries. I have since moved on to new distributors, I have 4 all different sizes and battery life. I have yet to replace an atomizer, maybe it is the make of your cig. Maybe since I use all 4 of my cigs at different times, none get heavy use and therefore don't wear out. I also Juice which extends the life of my cartridges and gives me a large smoke when I want one. Anyways don't give up. I have gotten rid of my cough, my wheeze and chronic broncitis thanks to this new invention but my husband is estatic that there is no more smoke in our house.

KatyS

 

[TheEmperorOfIceCream]

Hi Trog

I seem to spend all day either puffing an e-cig, or preparing one for puffing. My concerns aren't quite the same as yours, but they're similar.

I keep wondering if my intake of nicotine has gone up, rather than my tolerance of it, because of how much I do this. Device performance (ie nicotine delivery) isn't really the major factor with me, it's mainly vapour production. I seem to be addicted far more to the hand to mouth and visual elements of smoking than to nicotine. Having said that, I mainly use high nic carts, and when the JC juice gets here I'll be ordering the 24mg strength.

I tend to rotate devices, because I have a lot of different cart types, and I'm always mixing and matching atomisers and batteries, so I don't really notice the wimps. They go in the discard when I get to sucking my face inside out, but otherwise I use 'em if they work.

Current opinion says it's about 5 to 1 drags on an e-cig to get what you would from a .... This is in the plus column for me - I can smoke 5 times as much without exceeding my prior nic intake. The minus column is the damn things never expire. I suppose I could consider a flat batt or an empty cart as a natural break but there's always a pack nearby and 3 or 4 batts perking on the stove so I'm never without one.

Basically, cigarettes are no longer a visibly diminishing resource with me - I don't look into a near-empty pack and say 'whoa, better slow down'

I'm at home all day at the moment so I have no idea what my withdrawal level is - I'm able to top up when the mood takes me so I doubt if my nic levels ever fall to the scratchy-nerve point. That said, I don't have morning starvation either.

The only way I could test if I'm using more nicotine these days would be to buy a pack of my old brand and smoke them. Tomorrow I'll have been off hot fags for a calendar month so I won't be doing that, but I kinda suspect if I did I'd be cross-eyed in an hour, because for certain my smoking behaviour has changed and I'd be chain-smoking 'em. These days I ain't used to the carbon monoxide.

Are you still sneaking the odd rollie? If you are, it seems to me that's probably the most reliable indicator of your tolerance. If they don't hit like they used to, maybe you have built up more tolerance/need more nicotine than before.

I'm with you on the amount of arseing about I do with these things. I feel like I'm running a crack house half the time.

Emp

 

[trog100]

a roll up does nothing for me emp.. i smoke the odd one just to see..

i have no way of measuring nicotine delivery except by vapor production.. this is the method i use..

i keep my methods simple to avoid confusion.. one week ago i had three brand new 901 atomizers and batteries.. all tested and working nicely..

i simply start to use one.. if i think its performance is droping off.. think being important here cos its impossible to know for sure.. not knowing is part of the problem..

i run a simple test.. its pretty infallible done properly.. i take my brand new measuring stick and do a side by side comparison for vapour production and throat feel..

if the used one is noticably worse than the new one it goes in the bin.. my last one has gone in the bin after only four days usage..

the rate these thing are going in the bin is increasing... he he

assuming the devices havnt changed the only thing thats changed is me.. its the me factor that has me worried.. he he

i need the nicotine.. i think i now need far more than i did..

trog

ps.. the more of a drug u take emp the more tolerance the body build up to it.. the more it needs to get the desired effect.. the more nicotine u take the more the body needs.. so a local junky tells me.. he he

 

[phylo]

Hey trog, I'm curious have you tried cleaning your atomizers instead of binning them?

It is possible that because of the heavy use that they are getting gummed up and may just need to have a good cleaning to make them work better.. They might not perform like they did when they were new, but it might make it so that you are throwing them away a little bit less often...

As to your usage habits, I am finding that I am starting to go through more carts than when I initially started as well. It used to be that I would go through a pen style cart every couple of days, now it seems like its one a day or sometimes 1.5 if Im lucky...

Phil

 

[karenwest1961]

trog, you pose an interesting dilemma.

I've wondered whether my tolerance of nicotine has gone up, or perhaps our liquid is not really at the advertised level. (who knows anymore).

And like Emp, I find myself vaping more because of the visual effect. I'm not so sure if I'm really getting my body's desired amount of nicotine or what.

When I smoked cigarettes, I smoked maybe a pack a day. When I started e-cigs, I didn't constantly puff on it. NOW, I've got this damned thing in my mouth practically all damn day. Enough so that I've ordered 0 nicotine to alternate just so I can come off of some of that stuff.

Oy. Maybe this is an experiment that several of us should get together and do and compare notes. But how do you do that? I'd have to have another person follow me all day and take notes because I know I now do it without even thinking about it. Sometimes I vape and don't even realize how long I've been puffing on it til the battery dies or the cart runs almost dry. I don't know...

And you don't even wanna know how many spare atomizers I have.

 

[trog100]

yes phill i have tried every possible method of cleaning i can think of to extend the useful life of these items.. including some totally destructive ones.. he he

i have half dozen wimpy pipes laying around.. i have found a method to eak those out a little longer.. connect them up to a 4.8 volt supply.. but its not really a valid option but it kinda proves something.. upping the voltage brings a wimp back to new for a while..

but a lithium cell is only four volts fresh off charge.. no way of upping the voltage from that.. he he

my testing methology is sound i think.. the things soon drop off from their as new levels.. four days would be around 8 ml of fluid in my case.. they vary a bit but they all drop off.. its either because the wrapping around the heater coil loses it absorbency or the resistor wire itself developes more resistance with use and the coil dosnt get as hot... or a combination of both..

trog

 

[trog100]

its a real problem karen.. not an imaginary one.. one that we should think about.. i know a really good e device delivers the nicotine.. a wimp dosnt.. i have been using the best.. now it seems the best is hardly good enough for me..

it is all too easy to over use the things.. a 901 atomizer is 7 dollars plus shipping from china... ten at a time and i could afford to chuck one every three or four days.. but the cost is only one side of the problem.. the other being excessive use and dependency on the things..

trog

 

[phylo]

Im trying to remember if you have tried the pen style e-cigs yet? I have had pretty good luck with mine although I don't think I use mine as much as you do... I just compared the atomizer I have been using for a couple of months to a new one and I would be hard pressed to tell the difference.. I do notice that after a while vapor production does drop a bit, but a good cleaning new batteries and a new cart usually fixes that. I dont have as much experience with the 901 so I cant really venture an opinion on it yet..

Phil

 

[karenwest1961]

the other being excessive use and dependency on the things..

trog

I never even thought about that angle until I saw how many devices and spare parts and carts I actually had. And I carry three or four different device with me everyday. Each with a different flavor. (even if they have the same cartridge, they all have a different flavor.)

With cigarettes, I could tell when I was smoking too much. With e-cigs, I can't anymore. If I had vaped in the beginning the way I vape now, I would have OD'd myself several times over. We just may have built up a tolerance...and that can't be good.

 

[trog100]

Im trying to remember if you have tried the pen style e-cigs yet? I have had pretty good luck with mine although I don't think I use mine as much as you do... I just compared the atomizer I have been using for a couple of months to a new one and I would be hard pressed to tell the difference.. I do notice that after a while vapor production does drop a bit, but a good cleaning new batteries and a new cart usually fixes that. I dont have as much experience with the 901 so I cant really venture an opinion on it yet..

Phil

i have tried all types phil.. cigarillos.. cigars.. classic.. pipes.. the bottom line being a new 901 beats the lot easily as a smoke producer..

i made the mistake of thinking bigger would be better.. it isnt.. the pipes are nice to smoke but four new atomizers that arrived only two weeks ago are all wimpish.. none produce as much smoke as the 901 when new..

try one phil.. until u do u wont know.. he he

trog

ps.. part of the problem is human subjectivity.. spend some hours at 90 mph on the motorway and forty mph seem to be stood still.. do it the other way around and 90 mph seems suicidally fast.. folks make the mistake of thinking they can trust their own memory and judgement .. they cant..

 

[phylo]

I have one of the 901's (actually a RN4075 but they look exacly the same) and I like it quite a bit.. Although I haven't used it a whole lot.. I have new stock coming in on Tuesday or Wednesday and have a few samples of the black RN4075.. Ill be pitting my old 901 against the new ones then...

Phil

 

[tribalmasters]

Well for me its the hit at the back of the throat and the smoke exhale. I have already weaned off nicotine and you should do the same. Big Pharma or someone said the first 2 days are the worst and for me they were right. Get off the stuff. Gradually go lower and lower with the nicotine untill you are happy with no nicotine carts. Heart Attack will persuade you hopefully. If when gone to the no nic carts, try a patch from Big Pharma, it will give the nicotine boost you need

 

[trog100]

Well for me its the hit at the back of the throat and the smoke exhale. I have already weaned off nicotine and you should do the same. Big Pharma or someone said the first 2 days are the worst and for me they were right. Get off the stuff. Gradually go lower and lower with the nicotine untill you are happy with no nicotine carts. Heart Attack will persuade you hopefully. If when gone to the no nic carts, try a patch from Big Pharma, it will give the nicotine boost you need

he he he.. i cant dude.. why else would i be pissing about with these f-cking things.. my advice to u is get off e cigs.. u dont need them so why use them..

trog

 

[CaSHMeRe]

he he he.. i cant dude.. why else would i be pissing about with these f-cking things.. my advice to u is get off e cigs.. u dont need them so why use them..

trog

Ever think there was joy in inhaling/exhaling vapor only without the Nic trog?

I wouldn't expect you to know how it felt since you haven't tried (atleast out of the reach of Nic withdrawls) Don't squash it without trying it

 

[TropicalBob]

Trog, have you tried a real pipe? I know you went through plenty of the e-pipes, so you're familiar with the different handling of a pipe. Pipe use just has to be the cheapest form of smoking tobacco. I'm guessing you'd find it cheaper even than RYO. If your law and environment permit it, you can smoke pipes all day.

I might also add that public acceptance is better. I've sat in front of restaurants here and smoked a pipe ... and had people comment favorably on the smoke aroma! Now that's a freakin' change. No, you can't do it indoors. No, you can't smoke it anywhere. But you can take breaks and relax with it. You can use your e-cig inside and your pipe outside.

All of my pipes, BTW, were purchased off eBay, one at a time. None cost me a fortune or were bought for their "name". I have 46 briars that I rotate through. The nicotine hit can be whatever you want it to be, from mild to flatten-you, depending on your choice of tobacco. No inhaling. Ever. You head will spin in 5 minutes from just taking the smoke into your mouth, holding it a few seconds, and blowing it out.

I won't suggest other sources of nicotine for you, although you know I use snus all day, every day, and Stonewall tobacco bits. You obviously would have more difficulty buying those in your country. I understand that.

But if e-cigs are failing you in the nicotine department, you need to supplement. For me, e-smoking is about vapor and taste. Not nicotine. I can get that anywhere. You need to look elsewhere yourself.

 

[DeviLFisH]

okie here is my feelings about e cig here

I got one set of 901 and one set 103 v2 .
also brought extra atomiser for each set

and mind atomiser is weird here and is nearly all the parts is handmade here I finally believe as my supplier ownself told me is kinda hard to say which atomiser perform better even they are same as they are hand made here.

why I belive because I tested the atomiser ..and noticed some easy to draw and produce decent vapour whereas some hard to draw vapour is lesser .

yup I feel abit of frusration sometime...when out battery suddenly weak and atomiser not working well

so now when I am outside I smoke real cig whereas at home I mostly smoke e cig .

if fun to able to smoke freely at home in front of tv and pc.

or lying on bed. , not nasty smell from real cig.

and next I recently discover , I seem like to puff on e cig ....cos the vapour seem not hash , no tar ...no monoxide...and seem addicted on it.
whereas whenever I smoke real cig now , I feel is thick ...and hash alot.

but still I feel comfortable to smoke real cig when I am outside.
maybe my country here most ppl haven;t know this e cig and next my gov is banning commerical sales of this product.

actually I kinda envy those frds in here from US and UK
you can get johnson liquid...whereas for me I find it troublesome as confirm shippment from uk will be slow and not conveintent here..

that why now I going to try out flavours extract ...some days ..when my cart is finish.

the problem part of e cig I feel is the available of e liquid..mostly u have to order online and hence the waiting game here ..everday pray the goods come .

whereas u can easily buy real cig at stores.

and yup atomiser wise I don;t feel it will get easily spoil .
problem is your luck which one u happen to get as for my case
I do have one stable atomiser and one not stable ones.NOTE the not stable ones is not spoil here , is just that is happen poorly handmade here.


nicotine take ...I not sure ..maybe my intake of nictoine is getting high?
because now got e cig .and next I somke real cig

so far on real cig I can limit to less than 10 sticks aday .nowadays with the help of e cig but problem is why I can lower my intake of my real cig is becos I seem keep puffing non stop on e cig .
within one hr I can puff a lot of times.
whereas one real cig , I puff only two hrs once or even 3 hrs than smoke .

next my real cig nicotine is just 0.6mg here
whereas the cart I used is 18mg high , sometime medium and low.

so I also confusing here is it my nicotine intake is getting high nowadays?

 

[trog100]

i would simply inhale a pipe bob.. swap one form of tobacco intake for another..

no.. i havnt given up on e cigs they can satisfy my nicotine addiction.. and of course my eldest sons.. but the whole process has become far from a pleasure.. more like having to take nasty medicine to cure an illness..

i do have difficulty coming to terms with people who do it for fun.. to me it isnt.. he he

my advice is to get off it if u can.. to me its the lesser of two evils.. nicotine or not its another addictive practice and the dangers are as yet also unknown..

but thats just how i see it..

trog

 

[DeviLFisH]

i would simply inhale a pipe bob.. swap one form of tobacco intake for another..

no.. i havnt given up on e cigs they can satisfy my nicotine addiction.. and of course my eldest sons.. but the whole process has become far from a pleasure.. more like having to take nasty medicine to cure an illness..

i do have difficulty coming to terms with people who do it for fun.. to me it isnt.. he he

my advice is to get off it if u can.. to me its the lesser of two evils.. nicotine or not its another addictive practice and the dangers are as yet also unknown..

but thats just how i see it..

trog

I kinda like e cig becos I can smoke freely at home and office..

is good if ur parents don;t like u smoke and u can sneak smoking at home.

but problem is so far all cart I tried seem I don;t feel the strong sense of smell..in my nose..

draw back on the throat I can feel it provided is fresh cart and fresh bat is used . but that is short live to me..after just few puffs ..the feeling seem gone and the remaining puffs is like smoking air ..

I don;t feel I look for high nicotine intake here....as my real cig is only 0.6mg nicotine ...what I looking here is strong sense of smell I want.

and too bad johnson liquid is available in US and uk is kinda troublesome for me to order ...it will take many weeks to reach.

what I now plan to do is scouting or asking any frds in here can recommand an easy worldwide available flavour extract.whereby in any countries out there , this extract and easily find..

after my cart finish I going to try flavour extract to see how it go..if really I need nicotine here...

 

[TheEmperorOfIceCream]

you need to try some menthol fishy. It's funny but e-cig menthol works almost opposite to real cig menthol - in real cigs the point is to cut the harshness of tobacco, but in e-cigs it kinda gets up into your nose more than most other flavours. Remember it's more like mint than menthol. This is just my opinion - maybe try a box of five carts in case you hate it.

Signing off - it's nearly four am here.

Take care

Emp