Got stopped by plainsclothes NYPD detective for Ego-C Twist 650

[Ken_A]

Police do NOT have the authority to take your property from you even if its "just to see that", unless you are under arrest, or they have a search warrant.

IF a cop approaches you on the street demanding to "see" your PV, grasp it firmly and hold it out. DO NOT let him take it from you.

Ask if you are being detained. Ask if you are free to go. If you are not being detained, then just walk away and say nothing more.

Do not answer questions. Do not "explain" what your PV is. When a cop asks you questions, he's not trying to get educated, he's "fishing" for you to say something that will give him probable cause to search or arrest you.

NEVER say anything to a cop, more than identifying yourself as required by law, without an attorney present.

And get some business cards for a good defense attorney in your area if you live in a place where the cops are vape-hostile, or are known to disregard civil rights. Handing a cop th ebusiness card of a well-known lawyer in lieu of "answering" his questions will usually make them go away.

Know your rights. Exercise them--or they will be slowly taken away...

It would appear that you have had some issues with various authorities. I would have no issue explaining what a PV is and what the liquid contains. I WOULD be offended if anyone snatched something out of my hands. I Also probably would not think of handing my eGo over to someone else just because they. Asked what it was. Easy enough to show how it works while I'm holding it.

 

[Abe_Katz]

It would appear that you have had some issues with various authorities. I would have no issue explaining what a PV is and what the liquid contains. I WOULD be offended if anyone snatched something out of my hands. I Also probably would not think of handing my eGo over to someone else just because they. Asked what it was. Easy enough to show how it works while I'm holding it.

Kena, I would have to disagree there. One of my uncles was a cop, he is retired now. He told me himself that anytime a police officer asks you any question they are basically looking for probable cause to do a search or arrest you. The job of the police is not to see who did what, their job is to arrest you and try to nail you with whatever they think they can nail you with. It is the job of the court system to figure out if you were doing anything illegal or not.

I'm sorry but that is the way it is. SteroDreamer's advice is sound, any decent defense attorney would say the same too.

--

Okay while I was away it seems that this topic has swung around several ways. I want to reiterate that the OP was stopped by the police and question while he was in the street. The street is an outdoor and publicly owned area. We are not talking about a private business establishment such as a store or restaurant.

In the case of a store, restaurant or any other private business the owner or the manager has the right to determine if vaping is or is not permitted (where it isn't otherwise restricted by laws or ordinances). I personally do not vape where smoking is prohibited. That is a personal choice of mine. However, for the sake of argument, if I did vape in areas where smoking wasn't permitted anyway should I be told to stop by one of the employees or management of an establishment I would. I would not feel hassled by them unless they made the request in an impolite manner.

On the street however, anyone who doesn't like my vaping and wants to be an ...... about it, can kiss my you-know-where. I don't care if they have a badge or are a little old lady. I'm sorry but I'm an American and vaping isn't morally wrong nor is it illegal.

 

[Alis grave nil]

I always ask when in some ones business, just common courtesy and I only really vape at bars not restaurants, some people can be allergic to the compounds of your vapor.

Was out to eat the other night with my vivi nova and eVic :x

and the manager came up told me she knew it was an ecig and I could not use it in the restaurant. I just said "fine" I was with a lady friend and didn't want the confrontation I could tell she was prepared to have....

next time I wont be pushed over so easily...

 

[Abe_Katz]

I always ask when in some ones business, just common courtesy and I only really vape at bars not restaurants, some people can be allergic to the compounds of your vapor.

I can't speak for California, however in Florida smoking is banned in both bars and restaurants (and most other places too). So I don't vape in those places. I can say that I may ask in the case of a bar, but I don't go to bars frequently. I think the last time I went to a bar was back in 2008 or maybe 2009.

I do vape at the local vape shop though...but then again you get five or six customers in there plus the staff (who all vape themselves) we start to fog up the place.

 

[dialx7]

I haven't been vaping very long, and I tend to stealth vape, to not draw attention to myself. I run a tight schedule, for my personal life, as well as on the job, and certainly don't have time for problems. I simply can't afford to be detained, even if it's just an explanation of my device. Furthermore, an arrest, even an unfounded one, could cost me my job. I am not a gambler with fate. I carry CASAA material with me, with the forum address on the bottom, so if I need to provide documentation of some sort, I am prepared. Let's just hope the need never arises.

I did openly vape at a Mardi Gras parade, and the consensus around me was how cool my setup was. They were smoking, and I didn't feel the need to ask their permission, nor did they ask for mine.

Vape on, my friends.

 

[patkin]

So what's the goal anyway? One's personal health or to change society? And how do you want it changed? Vape everywhere or separate vape areas? One or two people vaping in an office isn't a big deal but allowing everyone in it to vape is a problem... same thing in restaurants, bars, movies, etc. If one is allowed to do it then everyone has to be allowed to. I remember the days when everywhere you went was smoke-filled and can see why anti-smokers arose. Maybe not everyone remembers those times. Even as a vaper I don't want to walk into a small area filled with the smell of sugar cookies, cheese cake, tobacco, chocolate and dragon fruit intermingled... nauseating. When I've been vaping my favorite pecan roll and return to the room I've been vaping in it smells great but I don't think it would if I someone had been beside me vaping cranberry or pomegranate. Just sayin. And for those who don't want to vape where those stinky smokers are, I thought the goal was to convert them. How ya gonna do that if you don't want to go where they do? Some pretty confusing stuff here.

 

[Abe_Katz]

So what's the goal anyway? One's personal health or to change society? And how do you want it changed? Vape everywhere or separate vape areas? One or two people vaping in an office isn't a big deal but allowing everyone in it to vape is a problem... same thing in restaurants, bars, movies, etc. If one is allowed to do it then everyone has to be allowed to. I remember the days when everywhere you went was smoke-filled and can see why anti-smokers arose. Maybe not everyone remembers those times. Even as a vaper I don't want to walk into a small area filled with the smell of sugar cookies, cheese cake, tobacco, chocolate and dragon fruit intermingled... nauseating. When I've been vaping my favorite pecan roll and return to the room I've been vaping in it smells great but I don't think it would if I someone had been beside me vaping cranberry or pomegranate. Just sayin. And for those who don't want to vape where those stinky smokers are, I thought the goal was to convert them. How ya gonna do that if you don't want to go where they do? Some pretty confusing stuff here.

Patkin, I of course don't speak for everyone here. Naturally everyone has their own agendas. My agenda is simple. I vape for my personal health. I got tired of coughing up tar and being short of breath all the time (at age 33!).

As to society, I think it best to leave the regulation of vaping in private businesses/establishments (be it an office, a store, or a restaurant) to the owners and/or management of that establishment. Some will chose to allow vaping, others will not. In public buildings, I think vaping should not be permitted inside. Mostly because those places belong to the public. As to the outdoors, no regulation is necessary--in fact I think the attempts to ban smoking while even outside are absurd and excessive.

Over all my goal for society is to be left to vape in peace. I have no intention of harassing anyone by vaping and I don't wish to be harassed for vaping.

 

[StereoDreamer]

It would appear that you have had some issues with various authorities.

The only issue I have with most modern LEOs is that I know all to well how they are trained, and how they operate. I've never been arrested, or even harassed by a cop for anything (despite the fact that I am a pretty active activist on several issues, including Open Carry).

I worked as a DOJ contractor for 10 years--involved in research, drafting reports, certifications, and training of LEOs--so believe me, I know all about how it REALLY works on the inside of the LE community--especially with regards to the astoundingly treasonous policies being incrementally implemented by the Feds, and the way they trickle that thought process down through the State Police and into local LEAs. This is no conspiracy theory--I worked with them for a decade, writing and publishing the training manuals...

I would have no issue explaining what a PV is and what the liquid contains. I WOULD be offended if anyone snatched something out of my hands. I Also probably would not think of handing my eGo over to someone else just because they. Asked what it was. Easy enough to show how it works while I'm holding it.

I have no issue explaining a PV and vaping to a citizen. LEOs are a different animal--they are "agents of the state" and these days they serve only two purposes--to collect revenue through the issuance of citations, and to generate income for the State by getting as many people involved in the "criminal justice system" (translation: arresting and imprisoning people) as they can for any reason they think they can convince a jury of.

Since the privatization of our prison system, putting people in jail is no longer seen as means of punishment--it is now viewed by the State as a "revenue stream", AND on a more insidious level, as a way to deprive as many people as possible of their fundamental human rights.

The best thing you can do as a law-abiding citizen is to stay as far away from ALL elements of the criminal justice system--ESPECIALLY talking to LEOs when you are doing something that is perfectly legal and lawful, bu tthey are ignorant about. Because if they get you talking, you WILL eventually say something that will give them the ability to arrest you, or obtain a warrant to search your vehicle or home at a later date.

Th ebest thing to do if approached by an LEO when you are minding your own business is to ..... "Contempt of Cop" is not a legitimate charge, and refusing to chit-chat is NOT a chargeable offense.

And besides, you have the CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHT not to self-incriminate. And since we know that ANY TIME a cop tries to chat you up he is "going fishing", it is ENTIRELY SAFE to assume that "anything you say will be used AGAINST you", even if what you say is totally innocent, admits nothing illegal, and is totally without suspicion.

Name, Address, Date of Birth.

"Am I being Detained?"

"Am I free to go?"

Get on down the road...

 

[ClippinWings]

I can't speak for California, however in Florida smoking is banned in both bars and restaurants (and most other places too). So I don't vape in those places. I can say that I may ask in the case of a bar, but I don't go to bars frequently. I think the last time I went to a bar was back in 2008 or maybe 2009.

I do vape at the local vape shop though...but then again you get five or six customers in there plus the staff (who all vape themselves) we start to fog up the place.

Yeah... I choose not the say the word "waffle" in those places... for the same reason.


See how silly that sounds? That's cause one has nothing to do with the other... just as a smoking ban has nothing to do with Vaping.

Smoking IS banned indoors in CA, in fact in many places it's also banned within 20' of the building.

 

[ClippinWings]

So what's the goal anyway? One's personal health or to change society?

I vape for my personal health... AND because of society... but since I enjoy vaping and have no desire to smoke... I want Society to stay the same... which means it's perfectly OK for me to vape openly, until I'm told otherwise.

I AM NOT smoking... and refuse to act like I am.

Vaping is no more offensive or bothersome than talking to loud on the phone... but plenty of people do that everyday.

 

[PhreakySTS9]

I generally won't vape while driving through downtown or whatever for this reason. Even though it's not illegal and I can't get in trouble, I still don't want to deal with the hassle and waste of time. When i'm on the highway, interstate or even just a road that's not touch and go traffic I don't usually worry about it. Sorry, I don't have time to sit on the side of the road because some trigger happy jerk thinks he's going to be the day's hero...

 

[dsy5]

I think the more visible it is the less likely you will be hassled.

Back in the 70's, I thought the same thing about (OTHER STUFF)... Hoo boy, was I wrong!

 

[xanderxman]

The difference with vaping is that it is legal. Even if a cop stops you there is nothing they can do as long as you are not violating a no smoking ordinance.

 

[Chrispixx]

So what's the goal anyway? for those who don't want to vape where those stinky smokers are, I thought the goal was to convert them. How ya gonna do that if you don't want to go where they do?

You convert them when they come back in from having their smoke. When they see you/me vaping inside they think to themselves maybe i should switch to an e-cig so i dont have to go outside.

Bar/restaurant owners who have an issue with vaping indoors have no say if it is not illegal in that area. They can call the cops but they will tell them the same thing that they cant do anything about it because it is not illegal.

Non smokers who have a problem with it only "Think" they have a leg to stand on because of the no smoking indoors law. Well it is not smoke it is vapor, so not illegal. What did they do before the laws were passed if they wanted to go to a bar/restaurant? they had to deal with the smoking that's what.

Stealth vape, blow it down your shirt, through your beard, whatever, none of you are helping make this more acceptable by doing that.

For those that say i will not vape in public for respect to others, well do you think they would respect you if the roles were reversed. last time i checked it was a free country.. except for California.

 

[xanderxman]

Bar/restaurant owners who have an issue with vaping indoors have no say if it is not illegal in that area. They can call the cops but they will tell them the same thing that they cant do anything about it because it is not illegal.

That is not true. You are on private property and the bar/restaurant owner decides what is OK or not in their establishment. Just because it is legal does not mean you can do it on private property. On public property you have an argument but on private property you are at the disposal of the property owner, legal or not.

 

[DuaneNeveu]

Bar/restaurant owners who have an issue with vaping indoors have no say if it is not illegal in that area. They can call the cops but they will tell them the same thing that they cant do anything about it because it is not illegal.

That's misguided at best.

Restaurants and bars may welcome the public inside, but it's not a public place (i.e. funded or subsidised by any branch of government). It's a private individual's business. They can ask you (and enforce it legally) to not do anything that they believe compromises the atmosphere they intend for their guests.

 

[Talesin]

Man its New York, you can get stopped for having a damn pocket knife there. Good thing I never have to travel to the capital of the Nanny States of America.

As far as your question, it won't matter what you carry, if they want to stop you they will and there isn't a damn thing that will make a difference. Just don't have a visible pocket knife on you.

I've been vaping for about a month and this is my first time I took the twist out since I had only received it yesterday. Found it pretty funny and thought this must happen to lots of folks here.

While walking down the street and happily vaping away, the cop comes up from behind me and says he's police. He guardedly with both hands flashes his gold shield and asks me to see "that". I hand the Twist over and he's holding it up with two fingers while inspecting it. I tell him it's an e-cig and he hands it back. "Oh, I thought it was (OTHER STUFF)." Pats me on my arm and walks away.

Should I be hesitant to carry out any larger battery if I do decide to get one? Lol.



Edit by classwife : Removed drug references

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/ecf-forum-rules/51178-forum-rules.html
9. Flaming, trolling, other misconduct
a. These are not permitted -
3. Discussion or mention of illegal/illicit drugs or sexual content.



http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...ation/255864-why-we-dont-allow-drug-talk.html

 

[JShrigley]

You convert them when they come back in from having their smoke. When they see you/me vaping inside they think to themselves maybe i should switch to an e-cig so i dont have to go outside.

Bar/restaurant owners who have an issue with vaping indoors have no say if it is not illegal in that area. They can call the cops but they will tell them the same thing that they cant do anything about it because it is not illegal.

Non smokers who have a problem with it only "Think" they have a leg to stand on because of the no smoking indoors law. Well it is not smoke it is vapor, so not illegal. What did they do before the laws were passed if they wanted to go to a bar/restaurant? they had to deal with the smoking that's what.

Stealth vape, blow it down your shirt, through your beard, whatever, none of you are helping make this more acceptable by doing that.

For those that say i will not vape in public for respect to others, well do you think they would respect you if the roles were reversed. last time i checked it was a free country.. except for California.

That statement that I bolded is absolutely false. If an owner or ANY business has a problem with ANYTHING you are doing they have the right to tell you to leave no matter what and if you choose not to leave then you can and will be removed by the police simply as that. If you are in someones business you are in private property can be made to leave for any reason the owner sees fit and there is absolutely nothing you can do about it.

 

[Racehorse]

Was out to eat the other night with my vivi nova and eVic :x

and the manager came up told me she knew it was an ecig and I could not use it in the restaurant. I just said "fine" I was with a lady friend and didn't want the confrontation I could tell she was prepared to have....

next time I wont be pushed over so easily...

YOure in a privately owned restaurant. Not sure what you mean about being pushed over.

Proprietor asks you not to vape, and you don't like it, then you need to leave.....pretty simple. You have no rights in somebody else's establishment where they pay the bills and the taxes.

 

[xanderxman]

These types of opinions and thoughts are what is going to make getting vaping accepted hard. People who can't figure out that not everything legal is OK on private property are spreading misinformation. It is not a hard concept to grasp. It is legal to burn wood. Do you want me to burn wood in your living room? I assume you would attempt to remove me and stop me from doing so. Can I call the cops and have them tell you that since it is legal to burn wood I should be allowed to do so inside your home?