So I really need to learn how concentrated FSUSA flavoring is. I did not see a guide to DIY on their website, though they sell everything you need. Thanks for advice. Might try another company.
Guide to DIY Flavoring
- Thread starter Nikhil
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fsUSA has a very active area -- try a post in their Supplier area asking for recommendations for the particular flavorings you got, and it's likely they'll respond fast.
Here's a post in this thread that might be helpful (back on page 1, post #2):
Guide to DIY Flavoring
but the percentage you end up using for any of the flavors will depend on your taste buds and the amount of flavor you prefer.
If you like an 80/20 mix at a certain nic level, this will change after you add flavoring. If you use FlavourArt (the brand FSUSA sells) it probably doesn't matter too much because FlavourArt is very concentrated. I buy 100% VG, 30 mg nic. I usually mix 10 ml at a time, so I use 2 mls 30 mg-nic VG, add flavoring which can be anywhere from 12 drops to 2 mls per 10 mls of e-liquid, depending on flavor company.
If I'm using FlavourArt, I just usually make an 80/20 PG/VG-30-mg nic base which will yield a total 6 mg nic liquid if I use 2 mls of the 30 mg nic VG. If I use 3 mls of 30 mg VG, I'll get a base that yields 9 mg nic. If I'm using FlavourArt, I just usually mix the base in a syringe, transfer it to a dropper bottle, then add 12 drops (generally) of FlavourArt directly into the dropper bottle. I believe 12 drops of FlavourArt equals about 4% in a 10 ml mixture. For the FlavourArt Tobacco flavors, I think I would try 2%.
You should be able to get an idea of what your FlavourArt mix really tastes like after letting it sit for at least one day. Because it's so concentrated, it needs to steep for the true flavor to develop. I know it's a pain, but it probably takes about a week for FlavourArt liquids to steep completely. Their flavors are fantastic, but you have to be patient. You will be tempted to add more drops when mixing. It's alright if you do, but the liquid will probably be too strong in flavor or may not taste anything like the real flavor after a day or so. If this happens, you just need to add more base and it should be OK.
I'll measure the flavoring in the syringe along with the PG and nic VG, if I'm using Perfumer's Apprentice or LorAnn's. These flavoring will change a bit after steeping too, but don't take as long as FlavourArt.
For me it's easier to have the nicotine either in a PG or VG base rather than in a premixed PG/VG base. There are many sources for buying pure PG or VG without nicotine.
You guys have been a big help, I'll go with FlavourArt next week and let it steep a week. If I have any problems I'll be back
Is it best to keep the finished product refridgerated for longer life? Or is that a rumor? I found where to get a liter really cheap too, pure PG or VG or mixed. I think the shelf life might be 2 years, but idk.
A ban is beginning to look more possible so I'm also looking for a mod or screwdriver for my e-bomb shelter that takes batteries I can buy anywhere. I have hundreds of 808 cartos, and hopefully even with a ban there will be a way to vape. But better safe then sorry.
Is it best to keep the finished product refridgerated for longer life? Or is that a rumor? I found where to get a liter really cheap too, pure PG or VG or mixed. I think the shelf life might be 2 years, but idk. A ban is beginning to look more possible so I'm also looking for a mod or screwdriver for my e-bomb shelter that takes batteries I can buy anywhere. I have hundreds of 808 cartos, and hopefully even with a ban there will be a way to vape. But better safe then sorry.
Hey Maxwell, you should not have to worry about refrigerating your e-liquid unless it's not going to be used for probably a year. Nicotine can lose some of its potency after time. Please make sure your PG and VG is USP grade. I've never refrigerated my VG or PG and they are fine in the cupboard for months (or probably years) as long as you keep them sealed tightly. I don't really know if they have a shelf life - it's not like they have oil that can go rancid.
Also, I think if you refrigerate your finished product, it may thicken it and that could be a problem, especially if you use cartomizers.
Another thing, after you mix, if you just let the bottles sit uncapped for a day, that speeds up the steeping process.
Also, I think if you refrigerate your finished product, it may thicken it and that could be a problem, especially if you use cartomizers.
Another thing, after you mix, if you just let the bottles sit uncapped for a day, that speeds up the steeping process.
OK, everything is out of the fridge, and so today I made an impulse buy at the store and bought Lorann Coffee and Maple and I've read a lot of stuff I wish I'd have read before buying it. One thing that would help a lot is to know at what % I should start with when using Lorann. I know 2% with Flavour Art, but is Lorann as concentrated as that?
I haven't used LorAnn for a while, but when I do, I usually use about 15%. I do like my flavors strong. I believe in general, most coffee flavorings are usually stronger than most. I think the maple has sugar in it that might gunk up your atomizer, but you can try and if it does, just clean it. I think I'd probably stay away from it though. Look at the first post in this thread and there is a lot of information on LorAnn flavorings with suggested percentages. Another good way to get ideas for recipes, is to look at recipes others have posted. It might be easier to try a recipe you think you would like and then you can always adjust it according to your taste. There are many recipes that use LorAnn flavorings on this forum.
Thanks Janet. I saw some recipes but not one that had a percentage of flavoring, so that is a big help.
First of all, I've been diy'ing for just a short time, and am so glad to have found this thread. I would like to thank everyone that has contributed here with such great information. I'd like to help, so here the flavors I have tried from PA (The Flavor Apprentice):
Green Apple 20% 3/5 (a little tart chemical aftertaste, might be due to using too much flavor, I'll try at 10% next time)
Milk Chocolate 20% 4/5 (good flavor, but tasted more like hot cocoa powder than milk chocolate, to me)
Pink Watermelon 20% 4/5 (flavor tasted weak to me - possibly used too high %?)
Strawberry Kiwi 20% 4/5 (flavor tasted weak to me - possibly used too high %?)
Waffle 20% 5/5
Wintergreen 20% 5/5 (tastes kind of like Wintergreen Lifesavers)
Like Janet has said in this thread, I like a *lot* of flavor in my juices. So all the batches I've made so far are at 20%. I've been afraid to try mixing at lower percentages because I'm concerned that if I come up with a *really* weak flavor, just adding some more drops of flavoring will throw off the pg ratio and the nic content. (?)
Again, thank you ALL for an amazingly informative thread. Thank you especially, Nikhil, for starting it in the first place!
Green Apple 20% 3/5 (a little tart chemical aftertaste, might be due to using too much flavor, I'll try at 10% next time)
Milk Chocolate 20% 4/5 (good flavor, but tasted more like hot cocoa powder than milk chocolate, to me)
Pink Watermelon 20% 4/5 (flavor tasted weak to me - possibly used too high %?)
Strawberry Kiwi 20% 4/5 (flavor tasted weak to me - possibly used too high %?)
Waffle 20% 5/5
Wintergreen 20% 5/5 (tastes kind of like Wintergreen Lifesavers)
Like Janet has said in this thread, I like a *lot* of flavor in my juices. So all the batches I've made so far are at 20%. I've been afraid to try mixing at lower percentages because I'm concerned that if I come up with a *really* weak flavor, just adding some more drops of flavoring will throw off the pg ratio and the nic content. (?)
Again, thank you ALL for an amazingly informative thread. Thank you especially, Nikhil, for starting it in the first place!
Definitely give the Green Apple another try at 10%, it's strong stuff. I don't see Pink Watermelon or Strawberry Kiwi on their site, are those from somewhere else?
Added the others, thanks.
As for messing up the PG/VG ratio and nic concentrations when adding more flavor, that's why a lot of people test with small 0 nic batches at first. If you're testing with nicotine batches, it's fine to start at a high % because you can then dilute with an unflavored mix at the strength you prefer.
Added the others, thanks.
As for messing up the PG/VG ratio and nic concentrations when adding more flavor, that's why a lot of people test with small 0 nic batches at first. If you're testing with nicotine batches, it's fine to start at a high % because you can then dilute with an unflavored mix at the strength you prefer.
My bad! The Strawberry Kiwi and Pink Watermelon came from BlueMist diy flavorings (gourmet flavorings). Not sure what the original "brand" is.
So, 10ml of juice with 20% flavoring, I would add 10ml more of unflavored nic at the same strength to get it to 10% flavoring.
And 10ml of juice with 20% flavoring, I would add 5ml more of unflavored nic at the same strength to get it to 15% flavoring.
Is this correct?
Is there a formula for this?
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I ordered some healthy pear from MFS and really like it. Does anyone know how to make this?
There is no established formula, but I can make one for you.
You have 2ml of flavoring in the 10ml mix currently. Currently you have 20% flavoring in 10ml, but you want 15% flavoring in the target ml. 15% of the target ml has to be equal to 20% of the current ml since you don't want to add flavoring. The basic formula would be Current% * Currentml = Target% * Targetml. Since you know everything except the target ml, you can plug in whatever else you have.
For your example, if your target percentage is 15%, 15*X=20*10, where X is the new total ml (which you reach by adding unflavored PG/VG with or without nic). Then 15X = 200 and X = 13.33. You'll need to add 3 and 1/3 ml of unflavored to get to 15% flavoring, and if your liquid is already at some mg/ml, adding the same mg/ml will keep it the same. That's why it's not a problem to overdo flavoring if you're using nicotine, provided you can do the math.
Using SBD's calculator and punching the numbers in section 4 using percent flavoring in the “mg%” cell in lieu of nic, I came up with having to add 3.33ml of unflavored pg/vg to 10ml of 20% flavor to get to 15% flavor.
I guess that I could just use section 4 of the calculator to figure out the flavor calculation as it appears to be the same. I wasn't sure if it was a different formula due to nic content vs flavor content but it seems to be the same.
I had originally put 3.33ml in my post above. It just seemed to me that adding 5ml sounded more correct than 3.33ml, if that makes any sense. I did call a friend that said adding 5ml was the correct way to get it to 15%, I guess he was wrong. LOL
Thank you for the formula and prompt response, I will see if I can verify that it is the same formula used in section 4 of the spreadsheet.
And thank you for this wonderful thread!
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This would not equal 15%, if you actually used 3.33ml of FLAVORED pg/vg (as typed in your message above). Assuming the 3.33ml contains 20% flavoring, your total flavoring in the 13.33ml would be 17.5%.
Or did you mean to type UNFLAVORED pg/vg? If so, 3.33ml of unflavored pg/vg is correct to equal 15% flavoring.
Your right unflavored.
I did say "zero percent flavored pg/vg" though!
I did correct this in my post, as saying unflavored is less confusing.
Thank you!
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