Help me with this - Mixing issue

[Dracconus]

Okay, so I'm sure a few of you have seen by now that I recently got into DIY flavoring, and I've got everythign I need to start mixing (finally.)
That being said I've run into an issue. I used a menthol recipe I found on here earlier and made it to the 't' and wasted a good portion of liquid,a nd flavoring making it because when I vaped it it tasted like smoking pure ...something..I'm not even sure. What I DO know is that it hurt so bad it made my lungs want to collapse, and I had to take a nap to even try and feel better.
I did a few "quick steeps" by heating it, and letting it cool to room temperature, then heating it again, and so on; but it seems to have done nothing. Now I'm stuk with a 30ml bottle of garbage that smells like spearmint, but tastes like smoking plastic mixed with mint.

I have begun to think, however that the issue is due to my flavorings. I purchased peppermint, wintergreen, spearmint, koolada, and vanilla from ecigexpress, but they didn't say whether they were dilluted. The mints are all Lorann, and are natural, except for the wintergreen which is artificial (still Loranns.)

My question is this. Do I need to dilute these flavors? I was under the impression that 1 drop meant 1 drop of flavor, or 1.9ml meant 1.9ml of direct flavor...am I wrong in this?

Also, I've wondered what the "quickest" way to test is, and what atomizer would be best for it? I've got a nova, and dct; but that's it atm (stardust busted open.)

The menthol that I attempted to make was this one:
Menthol
and I used the E-juice Me Up calculator to cut the percentages down to half since it calls for 60ml, but I wanted to test it first.

ANY Help with this will be greatly appreciated because I've got over 100 bucks worth of stuff here to make my own juice,a nd NOTHING I've made so far whether it was my own adventure, or others recipes is coming out right at all. They almost ALL taste overpowered, or "burn-y" I know, it's not a word, but they literally burn going down, even though they smell of delight, and i'm lost.

Thanks, and sorry if this has been answered. I've searched all day online, and to no avail.

 

[purelyscientific]

Maybe you are vaping at too high a voltage?
If you give me a list of your flavors I'll give you a recipe.
I promise the juice will come out at least okay.

How are you measuring your flavorings?

 

[Hello World]

I used a menthol recipe I found on here earlier and made it to the 't' and wasted a good portion of liquid,a nd flavoring making it because when I vaped it it tasted like smoking pure ...something..I'm not even sure.

Yeah, I have come across recipes which have been touted as the deal of the vaping century which only ended up doing the kitchen sink a favor.

Now I'm stuk with a 30ml bottle of garbage that smells like spearmint, but tastes like smoking plastic mixed with mint.

Don't go over 10ml for test batches.

I have begun to think, however that the issue is due to my flavorings. I purchased peppermint, wintergreen, spearmint, koolada, and vanilla from ecigexpress, but they didn't say whether they were dilluted. The mints are all Lorann, and are natural, except for the wintergreen which is artificial (still Loranns.)

Using the recipes of one brand of flavoring may not work the same way with another. Anyone that posts recipes without specifying the flavor source likely has no clue about different brands, so that's a red flag right there.

My question is this. Do I need to dilute these flavors? I was under the impression that 1 drop meant 1 drop of flavor, or 1.9ml meant 1.9ml of direct flavor...am I wrong in this?

No - No.

ANY Help with this will be greatly appreciated because I've got over 100 bucks worth of stuff here to make my own juice,a nd NOTHING I've made so far whether it was my own adventure, or others recipes is coming out right at all.

Tears shouldn't run until you hit $ 500 ... my estimated cost of a decent self-taught DIY evening course. But then that's knowledge you will have forever, and over a span of 10 years ... that's a ton of money. Don't be hesitant to invest in yourself.

 

[Dracconus]

Maybe you are vaping at too high a voltage?
If you give me a list of your flavors I'll give you a recipe.
I promise the juice will come out at least okay.

How are you measuring your flavorings?

I've tested everything from basic menthol to menthol with peppermint, wintergreen, spearmint, and crystals added to it with koolada, and Ethyl Maltol, and every single one of them tastes exactly the same...It tastes like I'm burning cotton that's suturated in spearmint flavored menthol crystals. (that's the best way I can describe it - but whatever it is it's a muted flavor that is burning the hell out of my lungs. I've vaped nothing BUT Ice Ice with extra flavor from Vapedudes, so menthol doesn't hurt me - That, and All I ever smoked was menthol too...so yeah...
I've tried on voltage from 3-6 on a 2.4, and 1.8 nova and a 2.0 dct tank.
All of my flavors except for the wintergreen are natural, and all of them are LorAnn Oils.

The ones I have at this moment are
Vanilla (diluted 10%vanillin in pg)
Ethyl Maltol (diluted 10% in PG)
Wintergreen (LorAnn - Artificial)
Spearmint (LorAnn - Natural)
Peppermint (LorAnn - Natural)
Cowboy Tobacco (Flavour Art) - But I'm not terribly concerned with adding this.
Menthol Crystals (~30% in PG) Did this because some say 50%, while others say 10, so it seemed like a safe margin to me ^_^
For Bases I have:
50/50 No Nic
50/50 9mg/ml
and 50/50 18mg/ml

I also have Koolada

Those are the menthol workings I have. At first I thought "Maybe it's because I don't have sweetener", then I remembered seeing a vid where one guy put JUST a menthol crystal dilute into his base, and vaped it just fine.)

 

[Dracconus]

Yeah, I have come across recipes which have been touted as the deal of the vaping century which only ended up doing the kitchen sink a favor.

Yeah, that seems to be all I've gotten so far >.< - Good to know I keep it fed though.

Don't go over 10ml for test batches.

Itend not to, and generally don't, but this one was supposed to be the end all be all - so much for that idea...

Using the recipes of one brand of flavoring may not work the same way with another. Anyone that posts recipes without specifying the flavor source likely has no clue about different brands, so that's a red flag right there.

I've noticed that, but others had tried his, and all said they'd loved it although no brands had ever been mentioned. I thoguht the odds small that all of them were using the same ones.

Tears shouldn't run until you hit $ 500 ... my estimated cost of a decent self-taught DIY evening course. But then that's knowledge you will have forever, and over a span of 10 years ... that's a ton of money. Don't be hesitant to invest in yourself.

I really don't have that kind of time, nor learning curve; or money. Our only car just blew a rod, so we're donating our entire income tax to repairing it, and getting a new one asap since my wife has to sleep at her hospital 'till we get something else going hence me trying others recipes instead of dabbling atm.

 

[GrannyM]

It sounds to me like you have waaaaaaaaaay too much flavoring. The recipe you linked uses Flavor Apprentice flavorings. You substituted Lorann's. The Lorann's mints are super strong!!!!

Try diluting your mix just a little at a time and see if that helps. For example, make a new 5 ml batch with 1 ml of your menthol mix and 4 ml of unflavored. And then adjust from there. The key is to do this in small steps. Don't experiment with the entire 30 ml at 1 time.

In regards to the atty: Personally, I use the I06 from Ikenvape and prefer it over other attys for testing purposes. But you really do need to get an atty or 2 - it's so much easier for testing. GOOD LUCK!

 

[BakuPeg]

I think I've found the problem friend.

The recipe you pointed to uses TPA (the perfumers apprentice) flavorings.
The flavorings you bought are Lorann natural. When it comes to flavorings substituting is not recommended for a beginner.

While "MOST" TPA are mixed between 5-20% flavorings. Lorann "Naturals" are usually pretty weak. I wish I could get a recipe for you using what you bought but I don't. I havent used any lorann naturals. I would suggest running to wizard labs, for 10 bucks you can get a handful of flavorings that will work. ($1.49 for 8 ML vial)

Always mix in small test batches, always take notes of everything you do. If the mix isn't good. let it steep.
*edit*
On re-read did you heat the vape in a plastic bottle? and you taste plastic?

 

[Dracconus]

I think I've found the problem friend.

The recipe you pointed to uses TPA (the perfumers apprentice) flavorings.
The flavorings you bought are Lorann natural. When it comes to flavorings substituting is not recommended for a beginner.

While "MOST" TPA are mixed between 5-20% flavorings. Lorann "Naturals" are usually pretty weak. I wish I could get a recipe for you using what you bought but I don't. I havent used any lorann naturals. I would suggest running to wizard labs, for 10 bucks you can get a handful of flavorings that will work. ($1.49 for 8 ML vial)

Always mix in small test batches, always take notes of everything you do. If the mix isn't good. let it steep.
*edit*
On re-read did you heat the vape in a plastic bottle? and you taste plastic?

I didn't heat in plastic, although that seems like it would best describe my issue just in a more..flavored? ...state.
I DID however steep in the plastic, and that may have caused it. I'm going to try a small diluted version of this in glass, and see what happens.

It's odd though, and this is what's throwing me off the most. Everywhere that I've read people say that LorAnn's are weaker than anywhere else, and to use between 5-25% depending on the strength, yet I only used 1, and it feels like the wintergreen just over powered EVERYTHING in that bottle...matter of fact, I think that IS the issue...Hmm...

 

[Dracconus]

I'm assuming that as it's cloudy that's a good indicator that it's too OP'ed?
I had assumed it was because I'd freshly shaken it. I never actually NOTICED that it was, 'till I just picked it up to get ready to make a diluted batch.

 

[GrannyM]

It's odd though, and this is what's throwing me off the most. Everywhere that I've read people say that LorAnn's are weaker than anywhere else, and to use between 5-25% depending on the strength, yet I only used 1, and it feels like the wintergreen just over powered EVERYTHING in that bottle...matter of fact, I think that IS the issue...Hmm...

The Lorann flavors that people say are "weaker' are the concentrated flavors like strawberry, grape, etc. Are you using the natural wintergreen oil or the artificial wintergreen flavoring? Huge difference. The natural oils are very, very strong!!!

 

[Dracconus]

GrannyM

The wintergreen is in fact the ONLY artificial that I'm using, and I use it at a lower percentage than all the naturals...Hence my utter level of confusion in this...
I used 1% wintergreen, and 2, and 3% of everything else

 

[GrannyM]

Well then....I hope the diluting works for you.
Outside of the plastic bottle issue mentioned by BakuPeg, don't know what else it could be.

Just a caution though on the oils (Peppermint, Spearmint): I haven't had an issue with them in my plastic bottles. However, they will dissolve the rubber tops of droppers used in glass bottles.

 

[Dracconus]

I found that with the Peppermint, and Spearmint I diluted them into a 50%, and 25% base, and they're a LOT smoother now, and far less over-encumbering; plus, since they're harder to pinpoint once more than one flavor is added, and tend to creep up, it's easier to add, than it is to subtract ^_^
I do appreciate all the assistance given, and will continue to tinker (although I'm running out of fluids fast...hope they'll last till I get more in...BTW, this is absolutely pissing my wife off. LOL But, I've still shown her that even in my hundreds spent I've saved way more (although her being a woman I had to crank out the receipts, and establish REAL PROOF!)

 

[StereoDreamer]

One big mistake all DIYers make in the beginning (I've mde this mistake too) is to try and taste-test out juice as soon as we mix it.

It usually tastes burnt, or too strong, or just weird and chemical.

You MUST let it sit overnight at the very least before taste-testing. The flavorings need a chance to really mix and meld and smooth out. I don't care how hard you shake it, and for how long--the first 24 hours almost ALL DIY juice will taste like crap.

Mix it up. Shake the heck out of it for 15 minutes to an hour. Set it aside for a few days, shaking it occasionally (I shake my new mixes twice a day--in the morning, and then in the evening.)

One day steeping is good. Two days is better. A week will let you know what it's REALLY going to taste like in the long run.

And if you make an changes to a juice when you DO get around to testing it, (like adding more sweetening, or upping the main flavor) let it sit overnight again before testing it again.

Take your time, and don't rush it.

Good luck, and happy vaping!

 

[Dracconus]

Take your time, and don't rush it.
Good luck, and happy vaping!

I totally agree 100%. Even though I use sonic vibrations (I rigged a massager onto a spring base, with a heating element (don't ask me how, it was WAY too much hell, but I had a portable massager, and extra coffee maker since i bought the wife a kuerig, so she wasn't complaining ^_^

Anyways, I heat mine for ten minutes every other hour, and let it vibrate for 30 minutes every hour, and steep open in a cabinet by my desk that never gets opened unless I do.
I've never tried a fluid straight up. The fastest, and only time I did was when I was testing the sonic heater that I use every hour, to see when "optimum" steep had occurred IF NOT within the first 24 hours. It actually came somewhere around 20 hours, but I figured eh, why not, it's just four more.

 

[GrannyM]

I'm glad the diluting worked. Looks like you're on your way now.

 

[pizza2me]

I'm assuming that as it's cloudy that's a good indicator that it's too OP'ed?
I had assumed it was because I'd freshly shaken it. I never actually NOTICED that it was, 'till I just picked it up to get ready to make a diluted batch.

I'm not here to help at all. Sound like you got some and are getting there. But.... What the hey is OP'ed?

 

[Dracconus]

I'm not here to help at all. Sound like you got some and are getting there. But.... What the hey is OP'ed?

OP'ed is a term that gamers use for Over Powered.

 

[purelyscientific]

OP means opening poster- the person who started the thread

 

[Dracconus]

OP means opening poster- the person who started the thread

Yeah, "OP" is Original Poster", or "Opening Poster", but "OP'ed" is "Over-Powered"... They'd asked what "OP'ed" meant as I'd mentioned it in one of my posts to describe the amount of flavor that was being produced; and it's my understanding that they didn't know what it meant.