Hi. Newbie here with absolutely no idea.

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Jac2891

Full Member
Apr 28, 2019
5
9
Hi all

I have only just recently started vaping to try and quit smoking. And by started, I bought a vape pen, some nicotine liquid and some flavour. But after mixing and trying several variations, I just dont feel like im getting the nicotine hit i need to stop smoking aswell.

I bought the Innokin T18 II.

12mg Nicotine Liquid.

A couple of flavours.

The nicotine mixed 50/50 is only 6mg. When my cigs are more than that. So after vaping for a bit, I still feel like I want a smoke.

My questions

1. Can i vape the 12mg straight, without putting flavour in.

2. Should i buy some 100mg nicotine and mix with flavours as per calculators.

3. Are salts better, and in that case would i need to mix VG/PG in it, as it seems you can only buy it with either 100% PG or VG?

Sorry for all the questions, but I am completely new at all this, and i just want to be able to quit smoking without going postal :)
 

Hawise

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Mar 25, 2013
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Welcome to ECF! Don't worry about the questions. We're happy to help anyone quit smoking.

Hi all

I have only just recently started vaping to try and quit smoking. And by started, I bought a vape pen, some nicotine liquid and some flavour. But after mixing and trying several variations, I just dont feel like im getting the nicotine hit i need to stop smoking aswell.

I bought the Innokin T18 II.

12mg Nicotine Liquid.

A couple of flavours.

The nicotine mixed 50/50 is only 6mg. When my cigs are more than that. So after vaping for a bit, I still feel like I want a smoke.

I'm a bit confused about the flavours. Do you have straight flavourings or vape liquids without nicotine? Flavourings themselves usually make up about 3 - 10% of a mix. Pre-flavoured vape liquids, on the other hand, might be closer to 50%.

About the nicotine level of your cigs, you can't really compare cigarette nicotine levels to vaping levels. There are too many differences in how it's absorbed, how much of what's there is absorbed and how other substances in the cigarettes affect the way nicotine works. All you can do is say "at this level I seem to be craving more/getting enough/getting too much so I'll increase it/keep it here/lower it." The good news is that nicotine is definitely one of the less harmful substances in cigarettes (barring certain circulatory conditions), so feel free to bump it up to whereever you need to get off the cigs.

1. Can i vape the 12mg straight, without putting flavour in.

Yes. Does it say what proportion of PG and VG is has? If the nicotine is 100% VG it might not wick very well in your device. If it's a problem, you could try adding a drop or two of distilled water.


2. Should i buy some 100mg nicotine and mix with flavours as per calculators.

Sure. That might be a better approach for you since you're looking for a higher nicotine concentration.


3. Are salts better, and in that case would i need to mix VG/PG in it, as it seems you can only buy it with either 100% PG or VG?

Salts aren't better or worse overall, they're just more appropriate for high concentrations. Salts have less throat hit. As a quitting smoker, you'll probably want some throat hit to get the feeling you're used to with cigarettes. To figure out what's best for you, you might want to start with a small bottle of a higher concentration of freebase (not salt) nicotine. You might mix some up at about 12, 15 and 18 mg/ml. If one of those levels works for you, great. If you find you're starting to get too much throat hit but still don't have enough nicotine, then it's time to try salts.

If you're experimenting away and you find you experience some or all of:
  • Hiccuping
  • Nausea
  • Headache
  • Dizziness
Then it's time to take a break because you've had too much nicotine. As I understand it, it's very hard to harm yourself by overdosing on nicotine by vaping. It affects you so quickly that you'll notice the unpleasant symptoms and quit vaping long before you damage yourself. (Drinking it's another story, so keep your nicotine base away from kids.)

You will probably want to mix your nicotine with PG or VG. With your device, you might be aiming for about 70% VG and 30 % PG, but there's a lot of flexibility there. 50/50 might work too. If your VG gets too high the liquid will be really viscous and won't wick well. If your PG is too high, it's likely to be harsher and it may leak.

Another thing that you should know about is MTL (mouth-to-lung) vs DL (direct lung) vaping. MTL is more like smoking. You suck vapour into your mouth and then inhale. MTL devices have higher resistance coils and lower airflow than DL devices, and they're usually used with higher concentrations of nicotine because they vaporize juice more slowly. Your Innokin T18 II is an MTL device, and I took that into account when I said you might want to try 18 mg/ml juice or higher.

With DL, you inhale directly into your lungs. The airflow is higher, the coils are bigger and you go through juice a lot faster. You would not want to use 18 mg/ml juice in a DL setup. As a very rough guide, you'd want to drop your nicotine by at least half if you were to try a DL device.

You thought you asked too many questions, but I think I've just provided too many answers (half of which have probably generated new questions!) Feel free to ask about anything that's unclear or just come to mind, and we'll hope future answers are more concise.

Good luck with switching, and congratulations on your efforts so far.
 

Frenchfry1942

Vaping Master
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Jan 12, 2014
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Vaping is not the same experience as smoking. For one, it is slower and less blunt in how the nicotine does its work. Many work towards the similar experience, but it isn't the same. Cigarette makers put a lot of chemicals in cigarettes and each of your cigarettes are made the same exact way for an exact experience.

I stronger nic content will give an experience closer to a cigarette, especially if PG is the stronger percentage in comparison to VG. If that is what you want. Direct lung inhales will amplify the throat "hit", too.

People like what they like. I started at low power and high (24mg) nic since that was all there really was at the time. I just wanted my nic fix. I don't do nearly that nic content now, and flavor is more the priority. I just enjoy sitting and having a flavorable vape. I am patient about the nic getting in my system since I can vape a little more. There are moments when I would like to have stronger nic, but I have changed and the reasons that I smoked aren't quite there anymore.

Read equipment reviews and note the styles of vaping. Learn what works for you. Vaping is a big world with a lot of avenues to go down; really, a hobby for many. Just remember that vaping and smoking aren't exactly the same.

Good luck!
 

Jac2891

Full Member
Apr 28, 2019
5
9
Thank you so much for that info. I have tried a friends DTL device, did not like it one bit. Way too harsh for me. Coughed so much afterwards.

The nicotine I have is 80VG/20PG. The flavours I have are concentrates. No idea whats in them. I did mix a cappuccino flavour 50/50 but it was way too sweet, so i went and got a tobacco flavour, didnt mind that but again, with 50/50, its only 6mg, which just doesnt seem high enough for me. I dont like sweet stuff, so I am trying to find flavours that arent so sweet, which most of them seem to be. I also have an espresso flavour I need to try. I have about 90% nicotine and about 10% tobacco at the moment in my device, but it still doesnt feel like enough. But in saying that, i can smoke quite a bit depending on the day. I love seeing the setups that people have and wonder if its worthwhile upgrading but the terminology does my head in, so i think ill just stick with my little vape pen. Plus id prefer MTL anyway.

I think I might get some 100mg nicotine, but thats where i come unstuck, not knowing whether to get VG or PG base. For example, buy VG and then do i buy PG, and add it....or vice versa

Argh, so confusing sometimes.
 

Vapedog

Super Member
Oct 28, 2018
656
1,402
Hi all

I have only just recently started vaping to try and quit smoking. And by started, I bought a vape pen, some nicotine liquid and some flavour. But after mixing and trying several variations, I just dont feel like im getting the nicotine hit i need to stop smoking aswell.

I bought the Innokin T18 II.

12mg Nicotine Liquid.

A couple of flavours.

The nicotine mixed 50/50 is only 6mg. When my cigs are more than that. So after vaping for a bit, I still feel like I want a smoke.

My questions

1. Can i vape the 12mg straight, without putting flavour in.

2. Should i buy some 100mg nicotine and mix with flavours as per calculators.

3. Are salts better, and in that case would i need to mix VG/PG in it, as it seems you can only buy it with either 100% PG or VG?

Sorry for all the questions, but I am completely new at all this, and i just want to be able to quit smoking without going postal :)
Vaping is not the same experience as smoking. For one, it is slower and less blunt in how the nicotine does its work. Many work towards the similar experience, but it isn't the same. Cigarette makers put a lot of chemicals in cigarettes and each of your cigarettes are made the same exact way for an exact experience.

I stronger nic content will give an experience closer to a cigarette, especially if PG is the stronger percentage in comparison to VG. If that is what you want. Direct lung inhales will amplify the throat "hit", too.

People like what they like. I started at low power and high (24mg) nic since that was all there really was at the time. I just wanted my nic fix. I don't do nearly that nic content now, and flavor is more the priority. I just enjoy sitting and having a flavorable vape. I am patient about the nic getting in my system since I can vape a little more. There are moments when I would like to have stronger nic, but I have changed and the reasons that I smoked aren't quite there anymore.

Read equipment reviews and note the styles of vaping. Learn what works for you. Vaping is a big world with a lot of avenues to go down; really, a hobby for many. Just remember that vaping and smoking aren't exactly the same.

Good luck!
This, I agree with fully. You will never find the exact same substitute, cigs are a wicked evil chemical cocktail that hooks you in like a drug of dependence.
But, stick with the ecigs, persist and you'll get there.
 
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Jac2891

Full Member
Apr 28, 2019
5
9
I get that it wont be exactly the same, I just need enough of a nicotine hit to satisfy the cravings. And at the moment, its not happening. Plus since I am completely new to this, i figured maybe it was something I was doing wrong, so id ask the experts :)

Ill buy some 100mg and add enough for a stronger nicotine level, and hopefully find some flavours that I like, im more a savoury person, rather than sweet, so hopefully there are some out there that i will love and want to stick with, which will then replace the smoking at least in the short term. And hopefully, ill be able to get to 0 nic eventually.
 

BrotherBob

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F-machine

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Nov 24, 2018
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I'm pretty sure some will not welcome my comment, especially to those who managed to quit smoking right after the first vape. But it is also common for people in the process of switching to dual use at the beginning. I did that too. It's hard to quit all at once in may case. I also didn't stop smoking right away. Even the lightest cigarette delivers more nicotine buzz than high nic salts. I'm thinking two, three weeks before I managed to stop? But that day came when I realized that I did not smoke for a whole day and I was happy. Then those days got plenty until I did not smoke anymore.

It's gonna be especially harder if other people are involved in your smoking too. Like your buddies or mates at work or at home, like smoking when chatting or after meals and you still sit with them, you know? I have this old mate lighting a stick for me everytime he sees me. I got tired of telling him that I don't smoke anymore and just accept the stick everytime. I just hold it, fake puff it and throw it away when he's not looking.

Just hold on to the thought, your goal, and you will get there eventually.
 
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vapdivrr

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I get that it wont be exactly the same, I just need enough of a nicotine hit to satisfy the cravings. And at the moment, its not happening. Plus since I am completely new to this, i figured maybe it was something I was doing wrong, so id ask the experts :)

Ill buy some 100mg and add enough for a stronger nicotine level, and hopefully find some flavours that I like, im more a savoury person, rather than sweet, so hopefully there are some out there that i will love and want to stick with, which will then replace the smoking at least in the short term. And hopefully, ill be able to get to 0 nic eventually.
6mg is to low in your particular set up....I would at least double and perhaps even higher. Mix up and try 12, but if that's still not doing it, move up to 18 and dont be afraid to even try 24mg.....the point is to stop smoking whatever nic levels are needed. And which ever works, stay with it and dont put pressure on yourself to bring nic levels down. The last thing you want to do is start thinking about reducing when you haven't even fully transitioned yet...good luck

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk
 

Hawise

Ultra Member
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Mar 25, 2013
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Thank you so much for that info. I have tried a friends DTL device, did not like it one bit. Way too harsh for me. Coughed so much afterwards.

The T18 is a decent device. In your case, I'd probably stick with it while I worked out the appropriate nicotine level. If you ever do decide you want to upgrade, a good MTL tank is the Innokin Zenith (or the Zlide, which uses the same coils). They'll work with pretty much any mod you want to pair them with.

The nicotine I have is 80VG/20PG. The flavours I have are concentrates. No idea whats in them. I did mix a cappuccino flavour 50/50 but it was way too sweet, so i went and got a tobacco flavour, didnt mind that but again, with 50/50, its only 6mg, which just doesnt seem high enough for me. I dont like sweet stuff, so I am trying to find flavours that arent so sweet, which most of them seem to be. I also have an espresso flavour I need to try. I have about 90% nicotine and about 10% tobacco at the moment in my device, but it still doesnt feel like enough.

I think I might get some 100mg nicotine, but thats where i come unstuck, not knowing whether to get VG or PG base. For example, buy VG and then do i buy PG, and add it....or vice versa

Argh, so confusing sometimes.

I'd recommend the following:
  • Get 100 mg/ml nicotine. PG or VG will do, but PG, being thinner, is easier to pour and measure.
  • Get a bottle of 100% PG
  • Get a bottle of 100% VG
That way, you can use your flavourings and ingredients to mix up whatever you like. For the VG/PG mix, I'd recommend aiming for 50% - 80% VG. For the nicotine level, try a few and see what suits you.

For mixing, you'll either need a set of graduated cylinders and syringes (not needles - get syringes without the metal needle) or a reliable scale that reads to two decimal places in grams.

If you're struggling to find any of the things I mentioned above, let us know where you are and someone should be able to point you to a local supplier.


6mg is to low in your particular set up....I would at least double and perhaps even higher. Mix up and try 12, but if that's still not doing it, move up to 18 and dont be afraid to even try 24mg.....the point is to stop smoking whatever nic levels are needed. And which ever works, stay with it and dont put pressure on yourself to bring nic levels down. The last thing you want to do is start thinking about reducing when you haven't even fully transitioned yet...good luck

I agree. This really isn't the time to be stinting yourself on nicotine. Go as high as you need to get off cigarettes. It doesn't mean you'll be stuck at that level forever - a lot of people find it much easier than they expected to lower their nicotine levels once they're confirmed vapers, but first you have to get over the cigarette hurdle. Dropping the nicotine level can be fairly easy but you can't do it too early or you'll just go back to cigarettes.
 

Frenchfry1942

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I work towards 100% or ML. Say, 40%PG, 40%VG, 10% Nic, 10% total flavorings. That is simple. Well then to make a 10ml bottle I divide all by 10. 4pg+4vg+1nic+1flavorings. If I wanted to make a 50ml bottle, I just divide the original numbers by 2. 20ml pg, 20ml vg, 5ml nic, and 5ml total flavorings.

Once you get your 100mg nic, try it....anyway, works for me. ;)
 

Letitia

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Apr 2, 2017
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I get that it wont be exactly the same, I just need enough of a nicotine hit to satisfy the cravings. And at the moment, its not happening. Plus since I am completely new to this, i figured maybe it was something I was doing wrong, so id ask the experts :)

Ill buy some 100mg and add enough for a stronger nicotine level, and hopefully find some flavours that I like, im more a savoury person, rather than sweet, so hopefully there are some out there that i will love and want to stick with, which will then replace the smoking at least in the short term. And hopefully, ill be able to get to 0 nic eventually.
Custard and coffee flavors aren't sweet, maybe try those. Most of my lemon or lime flavors aren't sweet either. The 100mg in a pg base will suit you better for mixing, easier to work with and better for your device. I'd suggest mixing 10ml of both 24mg and 18mg with the gear you're using. If you don’t care for a good throat hit order salts instead of freebase nic. Keep in mind you absorb with vaping thru your mucus membranes. Helps to hold the hit in your mouth for a moment and exhale through the nose. Your body will adust to this absorption fairly quickly over a few days usually. Good luck.
 
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Jac2891

Full Member
Apr 28, 2019
5
9
Thanks everyone for their advice. Really helps.

I found a site that sells premixed nicotine/flavour with various nicotine levels....worth buying, or still buy separately and mix myself. I figure with the premix, im stuck with that level of nicotine, and flavour. Buying everything separately, i can up the nicotine until i find the right level for me. Does the latter sound better, or too much effort.
 

F-machine

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Thanks everyone for their advice. Really helps.

I found a site that sells premixed nicotine/flavour with various nicotine levels....worth buying, or still buy separately and mix myself. I figure with the premix, im stuck with that level of nicotine, and flavour. Buying everything separately, i can up the nicotine until i find the right level for me. Does the latter sound better, or too much effort.

Learning at this early stage is never a bad thing. Most long time vapers graduate to DIY juice anyways. Just make sure your numbers are correct and never mix more than you can consume for testing. Most old mixers here will tell you stories of mixes going down the drain, I'm sure.
 
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charlie1465

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Welcome to the friendly bunch....In my view it's very simple. If you feel that you are not getting enough nic then up the strength...I vape 18mg/ml direct lung and 36mg/ml salt nic in my mouth to lung pods.

If you can get some higher strength nic salts that would be good as they really do give that satisfying feeling.

In relation to you not liking sweet juices then the only way for you to go is DIY.

Caution be careful if you try the 24mg plus salt nic to use a pod or MTL device....your current device would be fine with the correct coil in it.

Good luck to you :)
 
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Letitia

Citrus Junkie
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Apr 2, 2017
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West Frankfort, IL
Thanks everyone for their advice. Really helps.

I found a site that sells premixed nicotine/flavour with various nicotine levels....worth buying, or still buy separately and mix myself. I figure with the premix, im stuck with that level of nicotine, and flavour. Buying everything separately, i can up the nicotine until i find the right level for me. Does the latter sound better, or too much effort.
Mixing will save you money in the long run and it is great being able to tailor your juices. It's hit or miss how good your first testers will be honestly. Might consider buying a few flavors and a couple one shots. The one shots are usually okay to vape in a day or three. Your test batches may need at least 10 days to bloom depending on what flavors are used.
 
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DeloresRose

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Ok I’m not going to read all the responses. We need to clear up a few terms, first.

It sounds like your device is mtl. You’ll be at lower watts (10, give or take) which will require a moderate vg level, around /40og/60vg or 50/50 should do it. And higher nic preferably ( 12-24 mg/ml or so) and this will give you closer to what you’ll need to kill the cravings.

But the terms are important. There’s nic base, then there’s e liquid or juice. Sounds like you’re using nic base and trying to flavor it yourself (DIY) at 50% flavor, which is far too much.

I always encourage DIY, but I think it may be a bit soon for you. At least get to where your vape is satisfying and you have an idea what flavors you like, and what nic level and pg/vg ratio works for you.

Learn the lingo so that you can ask questions and we can assist better.


I’m just saying all this, not to discourage you, but because I don’t want you to think this is really hard. It’s not, but you’re struggling because there’s a lot of background info you need yet. It’s like you bypassed grade school and dived right into trigonometry.

Let us start you at the beginning, and we’ll have you mixing like a master by the weekend.
 
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