Hostility towards other methods of quitting and a thank you to my fellow ECF members.

[Arnie H]

The purpose of this thread is two-fold.

Firstly, I want to thank everyone for the intelligent and thoughtful responses in the "What's up with all the China Hate" thread. Unfortunately the thread was closed, so I have no way of conveying this except in a new post. I want to reiterate my view regarding "controversial subjects", and my belief that they can be a good thing and stimulate the mind and get people talking. I do not neccesarily agree that closing the thread was the best solution, but I understand why the mods did what they did and I have the greatest respect for them. Their job is certainly not easy, and I hope I don't give them a hard time with some of my topics. Free thinking and intelligent debate is something which should be encouraged and I hope it will continue to be so. It has at least confirmed for me that there is a rift within the vaping community regarding this and other issues.

Second, I have observed some within the vaping community attacking Chantix, Nicotine Patches/Gums/Lozenges, and other methods of quitting smoking. Some of this may just be competition between different products. Some of this may also be retaliation against attacks made by big pharma or big tobacco, or others. I don't know enough though about the anti-ecig lobby or ANTZ to know everything that is going on. But I do want to state my opinion, that I think attacking other means/methods of smoking cessation or e-cigs (like Blu or Vuse) that are produced/owned by big tobacco is the wrong approach. My thinking is that anything that helps a person quit smoking is good (for those people) and ought to be supported for those for whom it works. We should never look down our noses upon any individual who wants to quit or is able to quit by means other than the e-cig or the products/services they use to do so. The big picture is human lives and nothing should come before this in my opinion. Not money, not politics, NOTHING!

 

[EvilZoe]

Well, technically vaping isn't classified as "smoking cessation" even though most of us here DO give up cigarettes soon after taking it up.

Chantix worked for my mother so I'd never speak badly of it. I know the success rate of all the smoking cessation products is even lower than Chantix, which I strongly suspect is much lower than vaping.

In the end, however, whatever actually WORKS is the way that is best....even if it comes from China. Which, frankly, a lot of good things do, along with the bad. Just like here in the US.


You can't, however, make me speak well of Blu as I'm sitting here sucking on one because my batteries are dead on my real devices. It IS revolting, no matter how you spell it...hehehehehe

 

[Myrany]

I wouldn't say I attack other methods. I would say that I have some issues with them.

Chantix just scares me the side effects are horrible and I have to wonder how it got approval.

Patches/gums/etc just don't work for me. Sorry they don't. As such I certainly couldn't recommend them to anyone.

When it comes to future regulation of ecigs it is impossible to not take notice of how much big pharma stands to gain by putting vaping out of existence.

Whatever works to keep someone off cigs is all that really matters in the end.

 

[Rat2chat2]

I didn't get to read the other thread you were talking about but I agree with what you are saying now. I personally have tried gum, patches and Chantix. They only temporarily worked for me but I know they have helped lots of people. It's kind of like going someplace you've never been before. Doesn't matter what route you take as long as you get to your destination and enjoy the ride. Just my 2. I do not know what tomorrow will bring for me, but today for the first time in 40+ years of smoking....... I'm content at being a non-smoker. View attachment 258984

 

[Harlen]

Way to go I'm right there with you

 

[twgbonehead]

Well, this is a difficult subject.

I did try zyban, when trying to quit. I would not recommend it to anyone, given my experience with it. My wife FORCED me to stop taking it after about a week, not because she was uncomfortable with it but because my behavior was scaring the hell out of her, and I am normally a very gentle and mild-mannered person. Several years later, the instructions for Zyban got changed, in particular they added the warning "DO NOT DRASTICALLY CHANGE YOUR ALCOHOL INTAKE WHEN USING THIS PRODUCT" (I had decided to do a major cleanup, and quit both drinking and cigs at the same time, reasonable IMHO because I smoked (and wanted to) the most when I was drinking. I would call that a product that was released to the public "without adequate testing".

Likewise with Chantix. Released to the public, with no expectation whatsoever that it had a tendency to make people suicidal. Should I applaud Chantix (Particularly given it's very low success rate) when some of those who took it would have been MUCH better off with cigarettes? (Much as I hate being a smoker, I still prefer it to being dead, AFAIK. Can't say for sure since I haven't tried option B yet.) Once again, a case where a drug was put on the market before adequate testing was done.

I also tried hypnosis, gum, and cold-turkey, all of which had a 0% success rate for me. (Although once, many years ago, I did manage to "cold-turkey" for about 15 months. During the whole time, I craved cigarettes, which made it pathetically easy to fall off the wagon).

I AM resentful that the FDA has launched an all-out effort to kill e-cigs, and that they justify this to some extent because there are "other approved cessation methods available". I AM resentful that the path they are taking will very possibly lead to re-directing any profits from e-cigs to the very companies that I have been a slave to for so many years, and to products which, quite frankly, just bite.

I have NO problem with Blus being in the market, and hope they help people quit. However, they very often don't help because it's supposed to be the e-cig USER who does the sucking, and are likely to convince thousands of people that "E-cigs don't work". Many people on ECF got here because they tried Blus (or similar) and said to themselves "Gee, this is almost close. Wonder if there's something better?" I DO have a problem with laws being enacted which basically hand over the market to Blus and Vuse, because these solutions will work only for a MUCH smaller set of people than the current spectrum of available products.

Anything that is effective in helping people quit smoking safely and with a good track record deserves applause and recognition. Anything which is ineffective and unduly expensive deserves criticism for its failure to perform.

 

[ScottM]

I owe some apologies to many. It was my rants on the China Hate thread that probably got it locked. I went back and reread some of what I wrote... A case study in some unresolved issues.

That is an interesting perspective regarding the other smoking cessation methods. I don't know if my situation is common, or not, but I have an odd relationship with vaping. I have had extremely high stress jobs, and am rather type-A, and never did develop any real coping methods to deal with stress- just smoking, and I smoked for about 45 years.

I finally went to a doctor last December, after complaining for several years (Typical married male that feels complaining to my wife is a viable treatment plan) The doctor nearly hospitalized me immediately due to blood pressure. A few weeks later, when the blood pressure was better and I felt 10 years younger, I was diagnosed with cancer. Surgery was my only option, and I smoked my last cigarette while walking into the hospital for surgery. Pills and gum weren't options for me. The surgeon did prescribe some things for me, and had a nurse stick a patch on me immediately following the surgery. I had stop using it because it was triggering motion sickness- especially when combined with the pain killers, and other pills and treatments. Following the surgery, once I was home, I was having a really tough time sitting around while recovering and remembered a coworker with an ecig... I soon started with a Blu, and the next day began with the Ego/clearo combo. Vaping really helped me to not smoke, because I didn't miss the cigarette rituals. I also just liked vaping much more than I ever enjoyed smoking.

I am now down to 4mg/ml in the eliquid, and plan to be at zero in a month. I plan on continuing to vape at 0mg, and have no real plans to stop at this time. Smoking again is not an option for me. If I have to, I will go back to a patch, or gum, if ever needed. Some people want to quit smoking, I simply had to. If vaping wasn't available, the patches and gum would have helped with the cravings for nicotine, but not the "keeping the hands occupied" portion with which vaping has helped.

 

[Coastal Cowboy]

ECF is a diverse, international community.

In diverse, international communities, there are going to be a lot of people who worry too much about what other people are doing. They worry about how much they're spending, what they're spending it on, where they're spending it, who profits from that spending.

And then, there is that whole other side, where people worry too much about what other people are worrying about.

My advice: Enjoy the VapeQuest^TM and don't worry so much about what others are doing or worrying about.

 

[RoseB]

Well, I haven't paid much attention to the China thread. This is a forum about E cigarettes. In my opinion: this place is pretty tolerant There are forums for other products (that aren't cigarettes). Sharing stories is part of playing here. Relating to one and another about fighting cigarette addiction.

 

[Fulgurant]

Hostility towards other smoking-cessation products? No.

Morbid amusement at the pharmaceutical companies' hypocrisy? Oh yeah.

The hostility is all on their side -- or rather, the callous and self-absorbed disregard for others. We are the bullied, not the bullies. Worry more about what the powerful think; it's more likely to affect you than what we think.

 

[440BB]

I tried all of the listed methods, as have many vapers, without success or with significant side effects.

I think the failures that many ecig users experienced with the alternative ways to stop smoking are what drives many of us to speak of them dismissively. If they worked well, we wouldn't be here.

 

[Vaslovik]

For my part I really liked my cigarettes, until I started vaping. I never once considered the gum, pills, patches, whatever, so I can't speak to that matter at all. I can only say that vaping got me off tobacco, and a 3 pack a day habit at that. Between my guy and I we spent $500 a month on cigarettes, easy. I was developing PAD (Peripheral Arterial Disease) and was in serious pain from it. No more.

If others got off the analogs with patches, gum, pills, or whatever, more power to them. Vaping worked for me.

 

[Bassnorma]

My position on smoking cessation methods is this:

1) If it works for someone, great! I tried them all, literally; and nothing worked but vaping for me.

2) I have not given up nicotine, I have replaced my delivery method. I do take exception at the government labeling this as tobacco, so you may see some posts from me labeling that an illogical assumption. The regulated nic replacements are not regulated as tobacco, so why should vaping be?

3) Whatever works to save a human from the harmful effects of smoking is wonderful.

 

[Arnie H]

I never tried any other methods of quitting other than vaping, but I have heard success stories from all quarters, using many different methods. So I guess to each his own. I will congratulate anyone who has quit smoking, by whatever means they use. I actually enjoyed smoking (was only a half pack a day smoker at best), particularly after meals and with alcohol, but vaping's got it beat by a mile. But as much as I love vaping, personal experience (with my mom) has taught me painfully that it is not the solution for everyone, not yet anyway, but some day, who knows. I know someone personally who has had success with the patch, and I think that's just great.

 

[Robino1]

As someone earlier said, most of us tried the other "approved by the FDA" methods. We wouldn't be on this forum if they had worked. My son is using the patch, it may work for him. He wasn't quite the smoker his momma was. He knows about e-cigs but is choosing to try it his way. I really hope it does work for him.

I'm betting it doesn't, but I won't mind if he proves me wrong

We really only know our own personal experiences. All those other methods were dismal failures. Paid a small fortune for something that.....well......just sucked. Especially after I really wanting them to fix me. It wasn't for lack of trying.

The e-cig is what has brought us all here... Whether it be Blu or....

Hate? I can't say I hate the other things, frustrated would be a better word. Frustrated and angry. Throw in a disappointed too, for good measure. Oh....and all of those words are aimed at the FDA and BP. My eyes have been forced open. I really don't like what I'm seeing.

I think I went off on a tangent. Sorry 'bout that.

 

[JulesXsmokr]

Yes - I aim to attack all the Big Pharma crap out there, they are a disgusting, lobying bunch of dirty thieves that don't care about anyone except themselves and their stock holders.
They produce garbage cessation products..
I feel for the people who have to shell out all kinds of money to try these FDA approved placebo's.
Their success rates are what? Bad..
OK -- now back to our regularly scheduled football game and Vape...

 

[SissySpike]

I forgot the success rate numbers of gums and patches its not very good but Im glad it has helped some people. Taking a pill that alters your brain chemistry is not an option IMO. We have alot of people killing them selves their children and those around them. Lots of those people have taken antidepressants It seems the side affects of better living threw modern chemistry is not working out so well.

I think the hostility is towards the company's trying to regulate and or ban vaping for the profit of their product. Is where you will see peoples blood pressure rise. Not at the product its self.

 

[Fishtec]

I used champix horrible stuff that made me feel terrible gave me a horrible attitude ruined a relationship and made me feel angry constantly until I stopped smoking i find it hard to believe that the cessation products out there truly are the best options out there and tax plays a big part of that

 

[EddardinWinter]

I'll tell you what...

I will stop attacking the snake oil that big pharma is making a killing off of when their hyena allies (the ANTZ) get out of the business of trashing vaping.

Until then, I have no intention of playing nice with the FDA, Big Pharma, or any other group fear-mongering and using emotional pleas of "protecting children" to attack my habit. I love vaping. I will fight those who would infringe on my right to vape with everything I have. If that includes an attack or two on the other methods of cessation, so be it. It's nothing personal...but I will use any weapon at my disposal in this fight.

I don't hate patches, or gum, or lozenges. I hate the hypocrisy of their proponents. They can count on me skewering their lies, misrepresentations, and sanctimonious rhetoric.

 

[patkin]

Truthfully, I think we're just living in a society that, verbally, is barely civil anymore if at all and where narcissism seems epidemic. Considering that, I have seen the rare attacker on this and other subjects but they're far in the minority. That's one of the things I love about ECF in fact. The mods do an absolutely fantastic job. I've been on other forums that are barely navigable with all the attacking that goes on and that's certainly true of one of the sub-forums here where its almost expected. I don't stay in those places and pretty much ignore the occasional hate-speak encountered elsewhere. However, I do understand why some surely do literally hate BP and agree that they should restrain themselves a bit more. I'm definitely not a PC person and, in fact, consider it a problem in our society where truth has taken a back seat to it but there's a way to say things without being hateful.

Edit: EddardinWinter, I hadn't seen your post yet when I wrote this. No, I was not referring to you and enjoyed your post... actually my sentiments too... well said.