Houston, we have a problem...BE nic titration results

[rkayw]

All - I had a brief email coversation with the president of Gourmet Vapor over this situation today. As I don't have permission to post his message here, I will summarize the conversation:
• Box Elder is owned by the parent company of Gourmet Vapor and both are very aware of the situation
• Gourmet Vapor utilizes multiple suppliers for their nicotine and confirms one of the suppliers is Box Elder
• Through internal testing, they have no indication that any of the products we have used from them were in error.
• The nicotine they purchase from Box Elder is no more than 36mg base.
• Internal tests show nicotine content to be consistent with the labeled contents

Other than living in the same state as both companies, I have no affiliation with either organizaiton or the parent company. I simply want to help aleviate some of the fears folks have so everyone is not getting so excited over the situation.

Yes it's known the two companies are affiliated but that does not mean both companies have issues. Seriously folks, if Pepsi had a contaminiation in their soda cans would you stop eating at Pizza Hut? Companies diversify for obvious reasons but that does not mean all affiliates are affected by issues in another branch.

Aaron

They utilize multiple sources of nic ...other then their own chemical nic company?
humm... I call bullchit!

 

[Hoosier]

Nah, it does happen.

I know for a fact that concrete producers use other's concrete at times. Tying all your sourcing to one and only one person/company is bad for business.

(Not saying it has happened more than once or twice in this instance rkayw, but it could happen.)

 

[swedishfish]

All - I had a brief email coversation with the president of Gourmet Vapor over this situation today. As I don't have permission to post his message here, I will summarize the conversation:
• Box Elder is owned by the parent company of Gourmet Vapor and both are very aware of the situation
• Gourmet Vapor utilizes multiple suppliers for their nicotine and confirms one of the suppliers is Box Elder
• Through internal testing, they have no indication that any of the products we have used from them were in error.
• The nicotine they purchase from Box Elder is no more than 36mg base.
• Internal tests show nicotine content to be consistent with the labeled contents

Other than living in the same state as both companies, I have no affiliation with either organizaiton or the parent company. I simply want to help aleviate some of the fears folks have so everyone is not getting so excited over the situation.

Yes it's known the two companies are affiliated but that does not mean both companies have issues. Seriously folks, if Pepsi had a contaminiation in their soda cans would you stop eating at Pizza Hut? Companies diversify for obvious reasons but that does not mean all affiliates are affected by issues in another branch.

Aaron

If Burger King had tainted meat and you found out they sold some of their meat to McDonalds, would you eat meat from McDonalds?

 

[carpedebass]

If Burger King had tainted meat and you found out they sold some of their meat to McDonalds, would you eat meat from McDonalds?

Precisely!!!!!!!!!!

 

[GiMante]

I think that Coz conducted an extremely professional interview in a fair and unbiased manner.

I did contact both Kurt and Brad to see if they wanted to come on my show last night to talk about this situation. Brad said that he would send me an email statement (he never did) and Kurt said that he was too busy. At first I was disappointed, but it turned out to be a good thing because we learned much more by this interview being done by Coz.

I'm glad that the interview happened on VapeTV, for two reasons. First, I think that Coz has better interviewing skills than me, and he probably got more information out of Brad that I might have been able to. Second, I think everybody learned a lot from the comments made in the chat room by Lu, Violet, and Blacksmith Pro, which would not have happened if the interview was on my show.

It is obvious that Lu, Violet, and BSP continued to defend Brad and berate other viewers who were coming down hard on Brad in the chat room because he is a VapeTV advertiser. Their reaction to this situation, and his comments, would have been much different if he were not a VapeTV advertiser.

I was on the fence as to wether Box Elder really did have any responsibility for dangerous eliquid being sent out. My comments on my show last night are on the record, and I said as much. After listening to Coz's show, my opinion has changed.

It's very clear to me now that there are some big problems with Box Elder. He admitted to sending out eliquid with the wrong nicotine level. Even with that admission, Lu, Violet, and BSP continued to defend Brad again and again and berate people making comments against Brad. There is absolutely no doubt in my mind that they defended him because Brad is an advertiser on VapeTV. It's disgusting. We're not talking about a mod or a cartomizer here - this is potentially lethal eliquid.

It's obvious to me that Box Elder is responsible for shipping out extremely dangerous product, and it's obvious that Lu, Violet, and BSP defended Brad because Brad gives VapeTV money for advertising. Anyone who thinks that their reaction to this news would have been the same if Brad were not a VapeTV advertiser is living in a fantasy world. Defending their advertiser is more important to VapeTV than stating the truth about an irresponsible vendor.

I used to be a VapeTV host, and I would give away products that I liked. I gave away mods and cartomizers and eliquid that I enjoyed using. One day Lu said that I was no longer allowed to do this, and that I would only be allowed to give away products from VapeTV advertisers. So most of the time I was stuck with giving away bottles of Gourmet Vapor eliquid.

I just realized that Lu gave me a bag of eliquid and a VapeTV sticker to give away but that never happened because they kicked me off VapeTV.

Anyone want it?

Actually, nevermind, I just gave it to the NYC Department of Sanitation.

View attachment 63262

Russ, I can't believe I'm saying this but I agree with every word you posted in the above post. It makes me sad. I was telling everyone the "defensive dream team" was disgusting. I have to honestly say, I'm still shocked.

 

[tmcase]

Ok so you don't like the way this topic is being handled. How about Kurts results are you throwing them into question or would you be happy ordering 100mg and getting 48mg (best case scenario)?

Edit: added quote.

I don't know about the rest of you but if my sample of 100mg that Kurt is sampling turns out to be 200mg, I'll be a happy camper because then I can make twice as just ejuice but it will shake my confidence in BE, which has already been shaken by the way, and that is why I will be testing my own nic juice from now on no matter where I buy it.

 

[GoodDog]

According to Public Record Box Elder and Gourmet Vapor have the same address. It doesn't make sense to me that these companies, owned by the same person, are not using their own nicotine. They're making it sound like they're a large company but in the interview he admitted that he did the dilution himself and had a few people in the mixing room (paraphrased). They're not a large company, he's just throwing corporate words around to make it appear that way. IMO

 

[BardicDruid]

Do you have the proper set up to do so without killing yourself?? At those levels nicotine becomes extremely dangerous.

I don't know about the rest of you but if my sample of 100mg that Kurt is sampling turns out to be 200mg, I'll be a happy camper because then I can make twice as just ejuice but it will shake my confidence in BE, which has already been shaken by the way, and that is why I will be testing my own nic juice from now on no matter where I buy it.

 

[Hoosier]

In the broadcast I think he said that they, BE, have had to source nicotine base from other nic suppliers due to runs on their supply.

So, if your main source, yourself, runs out, and you still need to mix juice, sourcing from others would seem logical.

But, yeah, the corporate speak was way too heavy for my tastes. Some of the buzz phrases caught in my craw too.

 

[davelog]

All - I had a brief email coversation with the president of Gourmet Vapor over this situation today. As I don't have permission to post his message here, I will summarize the conversation:
• Box Elder is owned by the parent company of Gourmet Vapor and both are very aware of the situation
• Gourmet Vapor utilizes multiple suppliers for their nicotine and confirms one of the suppliers is Box Elder
• Through internal testing, they have no indication that any of the products we have used from them were in error.
• The nicotine they purchase from Box Elder is no more than 36mg base.
• Internal tests show nicotine content to be consistent with the labeled contents

Other than living in the same state as both companies, I have no affiliation with either organizaiton or the parent company. I simply want to help aleviate some of the fears folks have so everyone is not getting so excited over the situation.

Yes it's known the two companies are affiliated but that does not mean both companies have issues. Seriously folks, if Pepsi had a contaminiation in their soda cans would you stop eating at Pizza Hut? Companies diversify for obvious reasons but that does not mean all affiliates are affected by issues in another branch.

Aaron

Every bottle of BE nic that I have gotten came from a sale at Gourmet Vapor. They're also all 48mg.

 

[swedishfish]

I expect anyone on staff of ECF not to make light of potentially fatal mistakes.

Believe me, I understand sarcasm and wry humor ... I just don't think it's appropriate from "the board" in such a potentially serious situation as this.

Jan

He made those remarks where people were speculating about legal liability. A different topic really.

I'm sure he doesn't need me to defend him but he's made it pretty clear in the 4+ threads on this topic plus the stickies that he take the issue very seriously.

 

[rkayw]

Every bottle of BE nic that I have gotten came from a sale at Gourmet Vapor. They're also all 48mg.

The 48mg came from one of their "other nic sources".

 

[GoodDog]

In the broadcast I think he said that they, BE, have had to source nicotine base from other nic suppliers due to runs on their supply.

So, if your main source, yourself, runs out, and you still need to mix juice, sourcing from others would seem logical.

But, yeah, the corporate speak was way too heavy for my tastes. Some of the buzz phrases caught in my craw too.

You're right, now I remember that, but I think it was an exception because of a 50% off sale rather than the norm. I think he used that example as a indicator that this was regularly their practice which I don't think it is. Just doesn't make business sense. Businesses run sales when they have overstock or at least feel assured they have enough inventory to cover their sales, especially if they're a large corporation. LOL

They're being caught in too many lies for me to believe anything they say without proof.

 

[Hoosier]

You're right, now I remember that, but I think it was an exception because of a 50% off sale rather than the norm. i think he used that example as a indicator that this was regularly their practice which I don't think it is. Just doesn't make business sense.

They're being caught in too many lies for me to believe anything they say without proof.

Agree that it was probably an exception. But that allows enough room to truthfully say they source other nicotine base. While technically correct, and rational business, it still must be taken with a gain of salt.

You can say, "I eat Wonder bread.", and eat sandwiches made with other bread without being dishonest.

Or you can say, "I eat all different brands of bread.", and 99.9% of sandwiches you eat are made with Wonder bread and still be honest.

Have to take the words at face value and not what they may infer.


That is the opinion of a Hoosier who has been known to make funny felt hats and wear them in public, so there....

 

[Iffy]

That is the opinion of a Hoosier who has been known to make funny felt hats and wear them in public, so there....

Now that explains a LOT...

 

[TaylorMade]

Just wanted to say thanks to Kurt. It truly is an amazing service that he has provided and is likely to move the industry a step forward as a whole.

I've been following this thread from the beginning and it was nice to see that our product tested dead on as advertised given the intrinsic error rate of 2%. I'm sure that both the old and new suppliers that we wholesale to were happy to see this as well. We follow very strict guidelines when mixing our liquid to ensure this high quality control and I'm glad to see it noticed in the community.

At the same time, in light of all that has taken place, we at MFS believe that this is only the first step and will be proactively implementing even stricter guidelines and testing procedures moving forward to ensure that our nicotine and e-liquid remain top quality.

 

[tmcase]

Do you have the proper set up to do so without killing yourself?? At those levels nicotine becomes extremely dangerous.

The sample kit uses 1ml of nic juice. I don't think the fumes from 1ml will kill me, besides I opened the bottle to smell it and I'm still here. Of course I where rubber gloves when handling over 48mg strength.

 

[rise2it]

...you do realize this is EXACTLY what the government needs to make a case on why THEY must be in control of regulating everything...

 

[rkayw]

The sample kit uses 1ml of nic juice. I don't think the fumes from 1ml will kill me, besides I opened the bottle to smell it and I'm still here. Of course I where rubber gloves when handling over 48mg strength.

TM, a hood would most likely be needed for proper safety in the scenario of double nic strength. I'm sure other protective clothing would be highly advised. Like plastic apron, etc.

To get the 1ml, you still have to open the larger bottle and dispense it.

 

[afrazier5]

Every bottle of BE nic that I have gotten came from a sale at Gourmet Vapor. They're also all 48mg.

Let me clarify this from the email GV sent me today - the nic they purchase for their juice production is 36mg. If you purchase nic from them and it comes in a BE bottle, they are simply reselling the product sourced from them.