I'm a doctor and I vape - FDA can get STUFFed!

[UBRocked]

Great post here! I feel like many of you that this is a common sense issue. Do we KNOW what the long term effects of these e-cigs are? No we do not but we DO know what the long term effects of tobacco products are...death! I have received so many messages from users on Youtube that have quit smoking using these devices and like myself, they don't believe they would ever go back to tobacco products. California has signed a bill and I am currently looking for a post on this forum site to see if anyone has posted a topic on that matter. They want to ban the e-cig until the FDA can determine if they are safe! Forget that because the FDA is in bed with tobacco now and with the current spending spree in Washington, the government NEEDS smokers to help pay for their spending. The FDA might regulate e-cigs but that just means they will tax it to death like they have with tobacco!

-Brian

 

[surbitonPete]

Great post here! I feel like many of you that this is a common sense issue. Do we KNOW what the long term effects of these e-cigs are? No we do not but we DO know what the long term effects of tobacco products are...death! I have received so many messages from users on Youtube that have quit smoking using these devices and like myself, they don't believe they would ever go back to tobacco products. California has signed a bill and I am currently looking for a post on this forum site to see if anyone has posted a topic on that matter. They want to ban the e-cig until the FDA can determine if they are safe! Forget that because the FDA is in bed with tobacco now and with the current spending spree in Washington, the government NEEDS smokers to help pay for their spending. The FDA might regulate e-cigs but that just means they will tax it to death like they have with tobacco!

-Brian

Unfortunately the governments have a fantastic excuse for constantly raising taxes on tobacco....they are only doing it for you health and they want you to quit smoking (yeah right!) but they haven't got a clue what excuse they could get away with for taxing e-cigs to death. That's the dilemma they are stuck with and why they are only thinking in terms of banning it. (for your own good)

The ability to get away with constantly raising taxes on smokers and drinkers, rather than the whole population, has been the mainstay of their yearly budgeting strategy for years in the UK. I am amazed they don't seem to be doing anything yet to stop e-cigs here.

 

[Vocalek]

Great post here! I feel like many of you that this is a common sense issue. Do we KNOW what the long term effects of these e-cigs are? No we do not but we DO know what the long term effects of tobacco products are...death! I have received so many messages from users on Youtube that have quit smoking using these devices and like myself, they don't believe they would ever go back to tobacco products. California has signed a bill and I am currently looking for a post on this forum site to see if anyone has posted a topic on that matter. They want to ban the e-cig until the FDA can determine if they are safe! Forget that because the FDA is in bed with tobacco now and with the current spending spree in Washington, the government NEEDS smokers to help pay for their spending. The FDA might regulate e-cigs but that just means they will tax it to death like they have with tobacco!

-Brian

Yes, here is a link to the discussion of the California bill:
http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...amended-september-2-prohibit-sale-e-cigs.html

 

[UBRocked]

Unfortunately the governments have a fantastic excuse for constantly raising taxes on tobacco....they are only doing it for you health and they want you to quit smoking (yeah right!) but they haven't got a clue what excuse they could get away with for taxing e-cigs to death. That's the dilemma they are stuck with and why they are only thinking in terms of banning it. (for your own good)

The ability to get away with constantly raising taxes on smokers and drinkers, rather than the whole population, has been the mainstay of their yearly budgeting strategy for years in the UK. I am amazed they don't seem to be doing anything yet to stop e-cigs here.

And thank god for them! I don't know how I could possibly live my live my life without consulting the US govenment! I called this when they invoked the last (and biggest ever) tax increase...When are they going to tax fat people for McDonalds? I can hear it now..."You want that supersized? Of course you do fatty! Chocolate Shake instead of a Sprite?...That will be an extra $34.60 Lard-...!"" Sure enough, I have heard rumblings of that as a potential "sin tax".

Drug test wellfare recipients for the sake of our tax dollars and their children? No way! That's not fair...just increase the tax to smokers! Oh, they all found a new smoking alternative?...Lets call it unsafe and tax..eh....I mean regulate it! We want our population to be healthy!

......!

 

[SSRob]

I'd like to add to this. My experience may be coincidental or maybe I am just a healthier person (not likely since I smoked) but my brother and I recently cleaned out my mothers house. It was unfortunately ridden with all kinds of things that I don't even want to go into. The airborne dust and nasties wound up causing my brother to get a serious chest infection. I on the otherhand did not have any chest issues or even congestion. My brother has NO pre-existing conditions that may have caused him to get ill.

An interesting point is that one aspect of studying PG was to see whether it could be used to prevent the flu. On, Thursday my brother-in-law was in an accident and my husband and I spent some time in the ER lending moral support to my husband's sister. There were a lot of people in the ER waiting area with pronounced coughing. Most were wearing the supplied surgical masks, but nevertheless, my husband has come down with a major cold. He does not use an e-cig. I was there about an hour longer than he was and I have not come down with anything -- even though my sick husband is coughing and sneezing around the house.

 

[Eric in AK]

The anecdotal evidence is that vaping has a high likelihood of assisting a tobacco user to quit smoking. See the somewhat unscientific poll here on ECF which corroborates what many of us have individually reported. The poll indicates an 80% success rate in quitting smoking. The other 20% report either substantial reduction in tobacco use or substitution of vaping for smoking where smoking is not permitted. (My hunch is that of the 20%, a substantial portion haven't really wanted to give up cigarettes completely.)

I assume there's a thread already here somewhere that is for people to report the noticeable improvements in their health. If anyone has a link, thanks in advance for posting that.

In just under a week of vaping, I've already seen some of the common benefits: no morning cough; teeth already noticeably whiter; less pulse elevation during strenuous exercise at the gym; improved senses of taste and smell; sounder sleep. Unfortunately, I've never had enough health issues to have a regular doctor, so I've got no medical person who's likely to say "gee, I can't believe how much you've improved your health".

I'm guessing, though, that there are quite a few ECF members among the 6,000+ active members who actually do have a physician who's assessed their improved health. Even if those doctors won't go out on a limb and say that vaping helped their patient become healthier, they probably would have no problem saying that their opinion is that the patient's health is demonstrably better than during the time of tobacco use. It will be interesting to see if the AMA ever comes out with a position statement on vaping. That's one of the biggest cash cows for politicians, and in an era when "health care reform" is a hotly debated issue, I would think doctors might side with fewer regulations of something that, on balance, shows massive potential benefit versus no perceivable risk.

 

[Snarkyone]

The AMA won't touch this issue until the E-cig industry gets an association together and throws cash at them.

 

[crashtestjeep]

Why doesnt big tobacco just test e-cigs, go pro-ecigs, manufacture, sell and produce PVs/Liquids? Then...everyone wins, right? It may mean we pay more if we so choose to buy in the US, but then they can get their famous "cut". ....I guess that would just be too easy tho, huh?

Some argue they wont take a stand unless it is proven safe, but on the other hand, look at all the drugs that undergo "rigerous testing", get prescribed to millions and a year later pulled bc of its ill/fatal effects.....

Simply put- The government is just running out of excuses why NOT. I see a bright future in E-cigs, and the second e-cig stock goes global, I know where my investments will be going for sure!

 

[Snarkyone]

I said pretty much the same thing in a post the other day. When I decided to try the E-Cigs it would have saved me so much frigging stress if there had been a E-Cig made by Phillip Morris Co. or RJ Reynolds or somebody I would have jumped right on it without a second thought. I'm sure a lot of others would agree that if there had been a E-Cig alternative made by their brand they would have bought it without so much worrying over the purchase. It makes sense and the tobacco companies have proven over the years that they are greedy if anything and I imagine before too long we will see a true Marlboro or Camel E-Cigarette (tm).

 

[Madness008]

I would not but an e-cig from an analog manufacturer if there were other brands on the market.

 

[WebJunkie]

I have to say that eCig's are incredible.

I've been smoking the better part of probably 12-14 years (and it wasn't even legal for me to do so 12-14 years ago...).

I've managed to quit twice. Once for 17 days. Once for 30. Both times, the most prevalent feeling I had was hating myself for denying myself something I enjoyed. That mattered even more than the fact that I was no longer killing myself. How sick is that? I mean, really?

So when I saw e-cigs, I thought I might finally might have a chance to quit smoking tobacco without hating myself, and guess what?

It's day 5 since my 510 arrived. My last analog was at 4pm on the 6th.

Oh, and today my lungs have figured out that it's finally safe to start clearing out all the junk from the analogs. Gross, but exciting.

Not looking forward to the next while of cleaning the junk out of my system, but from what I can tell the withdrawal from the /other/ parts of analogs is almost through, if not through completely.

I'm more able to focus than I was a few days ago, and I'm sure once my supply line orders come in, that will only improve. I tend to be less productive when supplies run low (used to be pop and analogs, now it's my juice that's slowly going away, haha).

Oh, and the other benefit? Now that my mouth isn't all nasty from the analogs, my desire for a two liter of cola a day (YIKES, I know. ) has gone away. I'm fine with water, as it does a right fine job of cleaning up any residue the juice leaves behind.


Even if there is some aspect of vaping that is worse than analogs (say, increased nicotine consumption, even if that doesn't end up going down), I'm sure that overall, at least more me, it's a much healthier option.

 

[Cheryle Davis]

According to MSDS safety sheets for PROPYLENE GLYCOL :

Potential Health Effects
----------------------------------

Inhalation:
No adverse health effects via inhalation.
Ingestion:
Relatively non-toxic. Ingestion of sizable amount (over 100ml) may cause some gastrointestinal upset and temporary central nervous system depression. Effects appear more severe in individuals with kidney problems.
Skin Contact:
Mild irritant and defatting agent, especially on prolonged contact.
Eye Contact:
May cause transitory stinging and tearing.
Chronic Exposure:
Lactic acidosis, stupor and seizures have been reported following chronic ingestion.
Aggravation of Pre-existing Conditions:
Kidney disorders.

My note: The only thing different between nicotine gum, patches, etc. VS. e-cigarettes, is propylene glycol. If the FDA and the medical community support gum, patches, and the like, why not vaping??
​

Now, on the other hand:

Tobacco smoke contains over 4,000 different chemicals. At least 50 are known carcinogens (cause cancer in humans) and many are poisonous.
Cigarette Chemicals (in Tobacco Smoke)

Benzene (petrol additive)
A colourless cyclic hydrocarbon obtained from coal and petroleum, used as a solvent in fuel and in chemical manufacture - and contained in cigarette smoke. It is a known carcinogen and is associated with leukaemia.
Formaldehyde (embalming fluid)
A colourless liquid, highly poisonous, used to preserve dead bodies - also found in cigarette smoke. Known to cause cancer, respiratory, skin and gastrointestinal problems.
Ammonia (toilet cleaner)
Used as a flavouring, frees nicotine from tobacco turning it into a gas, found in dry cleaning fluids.
Acetone (nail polish remover)
Fragrant volatile liquid ketone, used as a solvent, for example, nail polish remover - found in cigarette smoke.
Tar
Particulate matter drawn into lungs when you inhale on a lighted cigarette. Once inhaled, smoke condenses and about 70 per cent of the tar in the smoke is deposited in the smoker's lungs.
Nicotine (insecticide/addictive drug)
One of the most addictive substances known to man, a powerful and fast-acting medical and non-medical poison. This is the chemical which causes addiction.
Carbon Monoxide (CO) (car exhaust fumes)
An odourless, tasteless and poisonous gas, rapidly fatal in large amounts - it's the same gas that comes out of car exhausts and is the main gas in cigarette smoke, formed when the cigarette is lit. Others you may recognize are :
Arsenic (rat poison), Hydrogen Cyanide (gas chamber poison)

I think it would be better for one to ingest nicotine and propylene glycol via vaping than the above (plus a few thousand more toxins) noxious chemicals found in analog ciggies....eh?


I, for one, am going to try vaping in an attempt to quit smoking analogs and, in the future, wean myself from the nicotine habit entirely. Now, since I'm entirely new to this e-cigarette thing, I need to find a reliable, reasonably priced source for e-cigarettes! Just got ripped of by SmokingEverywhere...they won't even answer my calls. Never recieved a thing, and am out over a hundred dollars.
​

 

[Ninjas67]

Analog manufacturers can go to He__- I wouldn't buy from them either.
They would have to outsource to China anyway to have a competitive price on the hardware. While not rocket science, these things are a fairly ingenious product for the money spent.

 

[SheerLuckHolmes]

Why doesnt big tobacco just test e-cigs, go pro-ecigs, manufacture, sell and produce PVs/Liquids? Then...everyone wins, right? It may mean we pay more if we so choose to buy in the US, but then they can get their famous "cut". ....I guess that would just be too easy tho, huh?

Some argue they wont take a stand unless it is proven safe, but on the other hand, look at all the drugs that undergo "rigerous testing", get prescribed to millions and a year later pulled bc of its ill/fatal effects.....

Simply put- The government is just running out of excuses why NOT. I see a bright future in E-cigs, and the second e-cig stock goes global, I know where my investments will be going for sure!

Hell, No!! I don't want Big Tobacco selling e-cigs. That is the only excuse the government needs to tax them at the same rate or higher that the analogs are at now. How does $35.95 sound for a 15ml bottle of e-juice sound?

 

[Crankyfuzz]

I, for one, am going to try vaping in an attempt to quit smoking analogs and, in the future, wean myself from the nicotine habit entirely. Now, since I'm entirely new to this e-cigarette thing, I need to find a reliable, reasonably priced source for e-cigarettes! Just got ripped of by SmokingEverywhere...they won't even answer my calls. Never recieved a thing, and am out over a hundred dollars.
​

Contact your credit card company you can get your money back if you did it thru your bank contact your bank and explain how you paid and never received a product you will get your money back

 

[a2dcovert]

So far 3 of my doctors know and approve of my switch to e-cigs. In fact I have had one adverse health effect from the nic juice. IBS and acid reflux have been made worse by vaping too strong Nic consentration. My gastro DR agreed with my accessment that this may be the cause. He supported my decission to try dropping the strength of my Nic juice to see if it helped. It did and he was satisfied in the solution.

My success with e-cigs will depend on my ability to find and maintain the proper dosage of nicotine. Too little and I get nicotine withdrawal symptoms. Too much and I get GI problems. Right now I am using 24mg and it seems to be working.

I'm sure that when I tell my lung doctor what is going on he will be glad. I no longer have ashma or COPD symptoms. I no longer need the inhailer or Sprivia. Lungs are completely clear, no caughing, wheezing, sinus infections. So far it's been a win,win situation.

Kevin

 

[Cheryle Davis]

Contact your credit card company you can get your money back if you did it thru your bank contact your bank and explain how you paid and never received a product you will get your money back

I did contact my bank. They said the charge will have to go through, they can't stop it, then I can file a complaint, explaining what happened and that it was unauthorized...and the bank will do an investigation.

I finally got ahold of someone at SmokingEverywhere...they said, oh my...and we will refund the amount...even the amount of the 'free trial' (i never received any product, even AFTER they charged me the $99.00)...they said someone will call me. No they did not. No one has called. I sent them an email. No response. Nothing.

So, I had to cancel my Visa card and start all over. What a pain, as I have multiple business accounts hooked up with this card. But, at least SmokingEverywhere can't charge me again. However, I'm out over a hundred dollars, no product, no answer or support from SmokingEverywhere. The bank will do an investigation and return my money. I highly recommend NO ONE does business with SmokingEverywhere!!

In the meantime, it has really messed up my bank account.

Lesson learned.

 

[tony206]

Please write to the FDA and news sources to express your feelings towards these devices.