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Is Provape in danger of becoming like Blackberry?

Discussion in 'VV/VW APV Discussion' started by artbyshan, Aug 19, 2014.

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  1. artbyshan

    artbyshan Senior Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Jan 6, 2012
    Chattanooga, TN
    Since the sneak peak of the Provari version 3 has been released, a lot of mixed reaction has been generated in response to this highly anticipated device. For the diehards/fan boys (I consider myself as one), the recently released first look rendered excitement with new features such as the HotShot Boost, the ability to use flat top batteries, and a wider range of coil builds that can be used (Fires down to 0.7 ohms). This was my initial reaction to seeing the device. Then, I felt as though someone busted my balloon. I began to look at the responses from the other side. Several vapers have shown disappointment in (among other things) the OLED screen and the initial release being exclusively offered by brick and mortar establishments. However, most of the controversy seems to be surrounding the 20 watt limit (The V3 has added wattage as a feature). Many vapers (Including myself) rarely go beyond 10 watts. So the current version 2 Mini or 2.5 Full size is more than sufficient. However, a large group of the community enjoys being able to have a much higher limit. Many of the reviewers are now seen regularly sub ohm vaping on both mechanical and regulated devices that go well beyond 20 watts (eg., SX330, SX 350, and Evolv’s DNA 30 chips). These reviewers have a lot of influence on what our growing vape community desires to purchase. Provape has said this desire for higher wattage devices does not represent the majority of vapers, and seems to be standing firm on offering a lower limit than what their competition is currently offering or developing. Could this be a terrible mistake in judgment on their part?

    As is mentioned in the title of this thread, I cannot help but draw a parallel to Blackberry smart phone devices. Yes I still carry one of those (Actually two). It’s a rock solid device that I have used for many years, and I think of it as old reliable. Heck, I even bought the Z10 for myself and a Q10 for my wife when they were first released. They can’t do many of the things other phones on the market can do, but they are secure and reliable. So what if they are missing features and apps like the more popular I-phones and Android devices. I’m loyal to what I love and to what I’ve become accustomed to. However, instead of feeling like a trend setter, I feel like a rebel when I get those “Oh you poor boy” stares from the majority of smart phone users. Once, Blackberry was the standard. Businesses used them almost exclusively, and while most cell phone users at that time did not own a smart phone, this quickly changed once competition emerged. Once cell phone users saw both the fun and practical things that could be done on the competitors phones, they wanted a smart phone. In the meantime, Blackberry stuck to its guns and while they released phones that offered newer and revised features, their format was pretty much the same. They embraced business customers, and soon not only did smart phone users grow in number, in time their business customers began to carry two devices (One Blackberry provided to them by their employer, and an I-Phone or Android device for fun). In time, as the I-phone/Android market gained in popularity the majority of business customers (Once almost exclusively Blackberry) decided to switch to non-Blackberry devices. In many cases, the competitor’s phones were the same in price (If not cheaper), and with more sales came more app developers to the format. Now Blackberry is trying to stay afloat. Where is this going- and how does a smart phone and an Advanced Vaping Device compare (At least in my opinion)?

    Since the Provari V3 was first mentioned, there was genuine excitement for an update to a well made American device that used to be seen as the standard in variable voltage. The first look left many disappointed because this device does not seem keep up with the new trends in vaping (Higher wattage limits). Many have expressed that the P3 (As it is being called) should at least be able to perform at 30 watts like Evolv’s chip. Some of the fanboys have even said that’s why you should own a mechanical in edition to a Provari. Have a Provari for what it does well, and a mechanical when you want to vape at higher limits (e.g., RDA’s). Could this be have a Provari for business and SX - Evolv Chips/Mechanicals for fun (Stay with the trends)? Could this lower wattage limit be ignoring the desires of a growing number of vapers?

    Look, I’ve used my Provari Mini V1 almost exclusively since I got it in April 2012 without issue. When I got mine, there were limited choices in regards to regulated devices. You got a Darwin (If you could find/afford one), a Provari (If you could afford one), or a Lavatube version 1 (Considered affordable, but not the most reliable). That was the trend then. I chose the Provari because it was available and considered to be reliable. It’s been a rock solid device and it has fit my needs. However, there are times when I look over at what others are doing/building and would like to give it a try. The market has dramatically changed since I bought my first Provari. There are a plethora of devices that are available at both affordable and expensive prices. Unlike some of the early budget friendly devices available, there are several lower priced devices that are deemed both reliable and capable of exceeding many of the specifications than this V3 is offering. Even though the price of this device has not been released (At the time of this writing), it is speculated that it will be at least as expensive as the currently offered version (It’s speculated to be more). While that’s less expensive than some competition, it’s also more expensive than many. Several of these regulated devices (Or soon to be available devices) can meet or outperform the V3 wattage limits. This wattage limit seems to be one of the main factors for vapers in selecting a regulated device. Is Provape just being stubborn like Blackberry was in the past?

    It has been said that Provape is sending out beta P3’s to authorized seller’s to get their feedback and to work out any potential flaws before releasing this upgrade. Though I’ll probably never vape consistently above 10 watts, it would be nice to be able to at least keep up with some of the more trendy devices. Maybe it’s a psychological thing like having SIRI on an I-phone. It’s not used a regularly, but it’s a neat feature that is among the reasons that the phone was purchased. Hopefully during this feedback time, Provape will rethink this 20 watt limit and offer at least 30 watts. Currently, many consider 30 watts in to be the new minimum ceiling in regulated limits. As a loyal user, I’ll most likely purchase a P3. I look forward to many of its new features (Like the HotShot Boost and being able use 18350, 18490, and 18650 ). However due to the wattage limits, I can’t help feeling that in some respects I will be purchasing something that’s so 2013.
     
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  2. wheelie
    This message by wheelie has been removed from public view. Deleted by a moderator, Aug 20, 2014, Reason: Not a topic for discussion on this forum.
    Aug 19, 2014
  3. Rossum

    Rossum Surly Curmudgeon Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Supporting member
    Dec 14, 2013
    NE FL
    I see the parallel more like Apple sticking with 3.5" screens on their phones for so long -- they lost some customers to Android simply because they refused to make a phone with a bigger screen for so long.

    Personally, I think the wattage race is absurd. I'm vaping a DNA-30 bottom feeder at the moment -- at 15.5 watts.

    Also, my guess is that "HotShot Boost" will make it feel like a more powerful device than the 20 watt spec indicates.
     
  4. midficollege

    midficollege Senior Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Jul 8, 2011
    Texas
    Reverse battery protection is worth real money to me. I guarantee that I would, at least once, stick the battery of a replaceable battery dna30 in the wrong way.

    Step-down gives me the ability to use a wider range of toppers with a wider range of juices. Who's to say that I won't want to use a 1.5 ohm hh.357 at lower than 10W when trying out juices?

    So, the choice is between an Atlas (Sx350) or another $250-300 boxmod with available wattage overhead that I will never use , or the p3, from a company that I trust in a tube form-factor, which I prefer.

    Apparently it's always going to be difficult to fit the 350 into a tube due to the raw size of the chip.

    Everything's a tradeoff.
     
  5. heyilikethis

    heyilikethis Senior Member

    Jun 21, 2014
    pittsburgh
    i played with one a day ago, if it was cheaper than 300/250$, i might consider buying one, i have a v2.5 and love it for its durability and reliability it seems to withstand my particular form of abuse in a graceful way, that being said... since ive started playing with mech mods and 30 watt and 50 watt devices and the range of possible atomizers and builds one can use with them is near endless, i love the company and the idea of supporting a native company but i dont think i could justify that price tag when it falls short of the almost standard options on the market already, if it could handle lower than .7 or went higher than 20 watts i really would consider buying one but a v3 isnt going to let me do even what im doing now with my mods, so the only reason i can find do buy it again is for the quality and reliability of the device, but i already have a provari for that, imo the upgrades seem marginal i wish they would really go all out and make a device that can fit any style of vaping.
     
  6. AnsonJames

    AnsonJames Ultra Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Jun 23, 2011
    IRELAND
    No they're not becoming like Blackberry - come back here in a couple of months to see the amount of handchecks with P3's.
     
  7. midficollege

    midficollege Senior Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Jul 8, 2011
    Texas
    If nothing else, the IQ feature is a gamechanger, actually letting the vaper know when he needs to clean his contacts or similar.
     
  8. keonee

    keonee Ultra Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Nov 13, 2013
    USA
    I own 2 Provaris and a ZNA. I mainly use the Provaris. I for one am looking forward to getting the P3. Will the P3 be for everyone no.... just like cell phones, TV's, homes, cars, and the list goes on....

    Whatever makes a person happy with their setup is all that matters.

    Happy Vaping Everyone!!!
     
  9. vlodato

    vlodato Super Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Jun 22, 2013
    New Jersey
    Phil is probably the most popular reviewer and he rocks a provari/Russian setup daily. Rip trippers is a strictly cloud chasing user. Grimm and Todd seem to be more into mechanical mods then regulated mods. Twisted uses a dna20 and mechanicals mostly as well. The only big name reviewer who pretty much strictly uses 30watt regulated devices is rip trippers. Comparing provari to BlackBerry don't work well. More like provape is to Rolex like evolv is to Samsung. (talking watches here folks)

    Sent from my LG-D959 using Tapatalk
     
  10. Pinggolfer

    Pinggolfer Vaping Master Verified Member ECF Veteran

    I wouldn't compare provape to rolex and evolv to Samsung.The one thing not mentioned is the VW on the P3 which most every Provari owners states VV is the only setting they would use. I'm sure that thinking will change fast. The Innokin SVD 2 will be out soon using the Evolv DNA 20 chip and will be priced under $100.00 and it too has reverse battery protection. Innokin has also set up a USA center for repairs and replacements.
     
  11. vlodato

    vlodato Super Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Jun 22, 2013
    New Jersey
    The chip isn't the unreliable part in an innokin. It's everything else from led to threading to top cap to the fire buttons. A provari has none of these issues at all. When it does it can be fixed. I use high quality devices, provari and reo because they are reliable and have never broken. I'm sorry but comparing them to any China made crop is completely insulting and if you wanna use 30watts then do it go buy a Hana clone for $80.

    Sent from my LG-D959 using Tapatalk
     
  12. chadsmo

    chadsmo Vaping Master Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Feb 16, 2013
    BC Canada
    Let's assume the P3 doesn't change in its lifetime as a device they make. Let's also assume they'll want at least 2-3 years out of it. That means in 2017 they'll be selling a 20 watt device. It's laughable and while I think they'll still sell a ton of them they would have sold way more at 30-50 watts.
     
  13. Pinggolfer

    Pinggolfer Vaping Master Verified Member ECF Veteran

    The LED comes with the chip. BTW Evolv is made in the USA not China. Where is your cell phone tablet, camera, and PC made?
     
  14. vlodato

    vlodato Super Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Jun 22, 2013
    New Jersey
    My Korean phone is still regulated by the fcc unlike all the Chinese mods being made. Did I call evolv Chinese made crap? No I called innokin crap because they are. And just like your entitled to you opinion about provape I have my opinions on innokin. Down regulating is more important to me then 30+watts and I'm in the majority of provari users. My Russian probably can't even wick up to 30watts and I don't drip. So please tell me why the hell I would need a 30watt device?

    Sent from my LG-D959 using Tapatalk
     
  15. vlodato

    vlodato Super Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Jun 22, 2013
    New Jersey
    Dddddd&dddddddddd
     
  16. serenity21899

    serenity21899 Vaping Master Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Jan 18, 2013
    Antioch IL
    I will be buying a P3 because it has features I want. I really don't care what everyone else does; they don't vape for me.
     
  17. Rossum

    Rossum Surly Curmudgeon Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Supporting member
    Dec 14, 2013
    NE FL
    FCC stands for Federal Communications Commission. Last time I looked, mods weren't communications devices and weren't likely to produce RF interference with other communications devices. Hence they don't fall under FCC jurisdiction.
     
  18. roflwaffles

    roflwaffles Super Member ECF Veteran

    Jan 16, 2014
    United States
    Why does everyone get so mad over this topic.
     
  19. vlodato

    vlodato Super Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Jun 22, 2013
    New Jersey
    It was a point I'm making and your being really dence about it. None of our devices are regulated. Untill that time I don't trust manufacturers that most likely cut corners and cheap out on important things the consumer can't see with out disassembling the device. I only trust provape and reomods.com to deliver me a solid product I won't regret and won't be DOA and won't blow up in my face. It's my opinion and how I feel. Stop getting butt hurt and just agree to disagree.

    Sent from my LG-D959 using Tapatalk
     
  20. Rossum

    Rossum Surly Curmudgeon Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Supporting member
    Dec 14, 2013
    NE FL
    True, and I'd much prefer to keep it that way, thanks. If you don't feel comfortable buying anything but a Provari or a REO, that's fine. But I prefer the freedom to buy from other, smaller manufacturers, or to make my own, thank you very much. The moment you subject devices to "regulation", you drive most (if not all) all the small manufacturers out of business.
     
  21. Rickajho

    Rickajho ECF Guru Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Apr 23, 2011
    Boston MA
    I don't think the Blackberry analogy applies. Perhaps the Apple LISA might be more appropriate if the price point on a P3 is as high as I think it's going to be. It may very well turn out to be a lot of features no one cares about, limitations people do care about, and all at a price that is going to severely restrict it's market. We don't even know the retail price yet, let alone projected repair costs. (If that oLED is really that well sealed in there, what is is going to cost to get it out and replace things if there is a problem?) We also don't know the warranty terms yet either.

    Maybe it's Blackberry in this one regard: The eVic Supreme is already in the market and by intent or coincidence has a lot of features that the P3 has, a few more even like upgradeable firmware and customized vape settings (aka "hot shot"), plus higher wattage. If the P3 enters the market at a price two to three times more than the cost of an eVic Supreme... Warranty, durability or not I don't see ProVape's reputation justifying the price of a P3 for most consumers if they had to choose between the two. And the P3 ever being positioned or suggested as an entry level device at what I think the price will be will lose that part of the market no matter what.
    :2c:
     
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