Just discovered TFA's black honey tobacco.... So good

[Aurora-Oblivion]

Mmmm Peach, that would be good too! I'm working on the apple for a family member, hopefully to come up with something they like so they don't have to get an expensive brand they like, it's keeps changing on them so they're getting tired of spending money and it never tasting the same.

It's a highly touted brand too, and one that shouldn't have much variances either (Lab), but it's never the same for them even after extended steeping (1-2 months), shorter steeps, or fresh, ect. Different batches always taste different, and none like the initial sample that hooked them, so they've been looking for something similar but new, and so I told them I'd try and it'll save them a ton of $$ too.

I thought graham too, but haven't picked up any yet

 

[Cavediver]

I bought a vial of this from WL and mixed some up this evening.
5ml, 80%PG, 20%VG, 15mg
8% BHT
2 small drops of ACV

After a couple of shakes and a dip in hot water, the initial mix reminds me of root beer or sarsparilla.

 

[dannyv45]

Does anyone think (or already tasted) TFA brown sugar extra would be an OK mixer into this? If so, does anyone have a percentage suggestion to keep it in the background and not add too much sweetness?

I'm trying to work on combining green apple (Granny+Green) with this (BHT) as a secondary note, but after smelling the brown sugar extra it makes me think it would be the perfect accompaniment to the apples, so I want to get it in there and right first, before trying to get the apples in.

Suggestions anyone, thanks! Maybe this could get you trying a few new ways too dannyv45?

I'm not sure about the apple I'm still on the fence. I haven't done anything else with the BHT but over the last few days I've notice quite a flavor fade and the honey taste is more fruity then honey. I'm still thinking along the lines of 8 - 9% BHT and jamacian rum but still not sure how much rum to start with. I'm also thinking a touch of coffee to darken up the flavor a little.

 

[Aurora-Oblivion]

So how quick does the flavor fade anyway? Mine's seems to taste about the same since I mixed it, plain with no ACV because I was waiting to hear from you guys if that helped with the fade or not. It's only been a few days for me though, mixed on 6/27, so maybe that's not quite long enough for the fade to even start yet?

How can one wait for the tobacco or whatever flavor to start shining via steeping, while over that same period the flavor is fading? Seems like it would never even out, unless it only fades a little bit and then stops, like mellowing as it steeps.

So strange how we all can taste the same flavoring differently, yet a pizza or taco taste the same to all of us that like it To me, this taste like sweat soft leather, with maybe a hint of flower honey and patchouli

I agree on your coffee thoughts, it's definitely needing something darker. I don't have TA, nor have a tried it, so don't know if that would help or not. It's probably yet another thing everyone taste differently, grass, hay, or tobacco, maybe it taste like pizza to someone

I think I'm going to go ahead and get two more testers going, one with brown sugar/coffee, and the other with a light apple mix. Or, maybe I should wait to hear you guys feedback on if ACV helped the fade or not before I mix anymore.

 

[FinallyQuit]

I decided that everything I make and test on my rebuildable tastes burnt. Grr.

So, I loaded an Evod with my BHT and all I can say is, what's the flavor? I get a harshness that could be developing into a tobacco flavor, maybe a tiny tiny hint of the root beer/sasparilla that a previous poster mentioned.

I've decided to not touch it again for 7 days. We'll see if the flavor fade happens or if nirvana happens. I really really want to love this flavor. One thing I have noticed with my vanilla custard mix, the addition of all that sweetener and marshmallow and whipped cream make it a lot fuller flavored.

Maybe the BHT needs a brightener/softener? All mine has in it is tobacco and vinegar. Maybe a little em, a little marshmallow, a little graham cracker might round it out. . .

 

[dannyv45]

How can one wait for the tobacco or whatever flavor to start shining via steeping, while over that same period the flavor is fading? Seems like it would never even out, unless it only fades a little bit and then stops, like mellowing as it steeps.

That's the point of steeping not all tobaccos react the same. Some may be to weak right after mixing and as it steeps the flavor develops but with other tobaccos the flavor is very strong or harsh but they mellow and smoothen with time. Even though to me BHT is decent after mixing I think this tobacco still falls into the later category because of the fade. My mix seems to have stabilized over the past 3 days and taste the same now as it did 3 days ago. So my conclusion is if you steep naturally I think at a minimum it will need 2 weeks. But steeping in a ultrasonic cleaner it will still need 2 days to rest and cure. So my final result is 7% is not enough I think more like 9% but I am also not thrilled with the honey taste to me it has a fruity note and something needs to be added to cut that a bit. I'm still on the fence about what to cut it with but my thought is coffee or rum. As I haven't tried the rum yet I'm going to make 2 more test batches at 9% one with coffee (super concentrate) starting at .5% and one with rum at 1% then go from there. I'm also thinking a bourbon may go good with this so maybe Ill do 3 batches.

 

[FinallyQuit]

Danny, I don't have any rum but I do have a sample of Kentucky Bourbon that I have never even cracked open. Would that do it?

 

[dannyv45]

So, I loaded an Evod with my BHT and all I can say is, what's the flavor? I get a harshness that could be developing into a tobacco flavor, maybe a tiny tiny hint of the root beer/sasparilla that a previous poster mentioned.

I've decided to not touch it again for 7 days. We'll see if the flavor fade happens or if nirvana happens. I really really want to love this flavor. One thing I have noticed with my vanilla custard mix, the addition of all that sweetener and marshmallow and whipped cream make it a lot fuller flavored.

Maybe the BHT needs a brightener/softener? All mine has in it is tobacco and vinegar. Maybe a little em, a little marshmallow, a little graham cracker might round it out. . .

You need to let it steep. It will fade and mellow. See my previous post.

root beer/sasparilla I did not get that at all and to me the honey is off. As far as brightness for what I'm trying to do I agree it can use some body but body needs to be added without adding additional sweetness. Marshmallo will add thickness but not body. A cream will add body but sweet creams needs to be avoided. I have the cream super concentrate from VZ which seems to be a natural flavor which I think will do the trick.

 

[dannyv45]

Danny, I don't have any rum but I do have a sample of Kentucky Bourbon that I have never even cracked open. Would that do it?

That's exactly what I have but like you have not tried it. I also have the rum which I have not tried so its time to experiment..

 

[FinallyQuit]

Have you ever used Bitter Wizard?

 

[dannyv45]

No but I think that adds bitterness and doe's not remove it. Not sure how that would help your mix.

 

[FinallyQuit]

For your mix, to cut the sweetness of the candy/honey.

 

[dannyv45]

I just had a thought I think what will give it the body that's missing and cut down on the brightness may be either AP or TMP (Trimenthyl pyrazine) at .05 to 1%. Should give it a slight nutty/mossy taste. The TMP is a bit more subtle and mosser.

 

[dannyv45]

For your mix, to cut the sweetness of the candy/honey.

I don't think that will cut the sweetness just make the mix bitter.

 

[Cavediver]

You need to let it steep. It will fade and mellow. See my previous post.

root beer/sasparilla I did not get that at all and to me the honey is off. As far as brightness for what I'm trying to do I agree it can use some body but body needs to be added without adding additional sweetness. Marshmallo will add thickness but not body. A cream will add body but sweet creams needs to be avoided. I have the cream super concentrate from VZ which seems to be a natural flavor which I think will do the trick.

That's OK. I asked my wife to vape the same thing; she thought it tasted like a cinnamon danish.



Subjective.

 

[dannyv45]

Yes yes yes TMP is the missing ingredient. I'm already seeing a difference with the brightness. It took it off and mellowed the honey with no noticeable nut taste but it's only been 15 minutes. Only added in 4 drops from a 22 gauge needle (Tiny drops) into 3 ml which would be approx. 1%.


Edit:
You should be able to achive the same results with AP but use 2 drops per 3 mil from a 22 guage needle.

 

[FinallyQuit]

What's TMP? Duh. . .

 

[dannyv45]

Trimenthyl pyrazine you can get it from TFA or use AP at 2 drops per3 ml. It's very important to use a 22 gauge needle which is as thin as you can get. They usually come with 1ml syringes. the size of the drop is very important here when working with tiny test batches..

 

[FinallyQuit]

Okay, never heard of TMP but do have AP on the way. Nice to know I can still save this flavor!

 

[dannyv45]

Okay, never heard of TMP but do have AP on the way. Nice to know I can still save this flavor!

TMP is very close to AP except is more forgiving on it's concentration and gives a wetter/mossy nut taste to the mix. TMP helps you stay away from the usual corn/popcorn taste like AP gives you when you over do it.