Lava Tube: Better and cheaper than the Provari (video opinion)
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Here is an example of what quality is all about.
From this thread http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/provape/243180-help-my-provari-acting-weird.html
Guess it's more than just "nicer jewelry".
This is what you pay for when purchasing a Provari.
What say we put the LT to the test. Anyone want to volunteer to run over their LT and leave it in the mud for a week and see if the only issue is incorrect battery reading?
From this thread http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/provape/243180-help-my-provari-acting-weird.html
Guess it's more than just "nicer jewelry".
This is what you pay for when purchasing a Provari.
What say we put the LT to the test. Anyone want to volunteer to run over their LT and leave it in the mud for a week and see if the only issue is incorrect battery reading?
Probably not. Then again, I don't think any Pro-Vari owners would let you put theirs to the test either. I don't think you got my post. Fair enough. I don't get yours.
No need to test the Provari, it's already been done. Read the quote I posted.
Sent from my SPH-D700 using Tapatalk
I think availability will be the biggest seller in Europe,unless I am mistaken you cannot buy any similar type devices from any European Vendors ie Provari I-pro or Buzz pro !!! they all have to be bought from the USA
I have priced the Provari this week and with shipping it actually came out at 200 and that does not include any customs or import duty you may have to pay !! I really like the look of the Provari and the other two I mentioned,but it makes no sense at all when I can buy the Lavatube in Europe for 50 + 6 shipping !!!
PS If anyone is aware of a European Vendor that sells the other devices I would love to know
I have priced the Provari this week and with shipping it actually came out at 200 and that does not include any customs or import duty you may have to pay !! I really like the look of the Provari and the other two I mentioned,but it makes no sense at all when I can buy the Lavatube in Europe for 50 + 6 shipping !!!
PS If anyone is aware of a European Vendor that sells the other devices I would love to know
Yeah Pioneersnt, thats nice if you need that. Most people don't. Most people will never totally destroy a mod for any reason, it will just die on it's own.
The Provari vapes. That's all it does. It doesn't make you breakfast, fetch your slippers, tuck you in at night or make you any prettier or smarter. (in fact it makes you poorer and therefore dumber IMO, see below)
List price for the Provari is 200 dollars not including batteries, atomizer and charger. If you want those, (and they ARE needed) you have to pay an additional 12 for the batteries, 9 for the atomizer, and 17 for the charger. for a total of 236. Then if you wanted to use 18650 batteries add another 20 to that for the extended cap. for 256. It has a 1 year warranty. You can get an extended 1 year warranty for a total of 2 years, for another 25 bucks, so we are up to 281.00.
Lets say you buy all this and 2 years and one day goes by and you do something unthinkable - you drop it off the Hoover Dam. To replace it, you have to spend another 300 dollars.
You could have bought 4 Lava Tubes for that price. 70 x 4 = 280. ( the Lava Tube has everything if you buy the kit for an extra 30 dollars- batteries, atomizer, charger included in the kit. So you would be having to replace it 3 times if you needed the whole kit - It can already use the 18650 batteries without an extended cap and has a 1 year warranty)
Looking at it that way, just to have the ability to vape from 3 to 6 volts is it really worth it? Seems to me it's not. Either way you look at it the rugged durability of the Provari will not equal out the cost comparison to the Lava Tube.
This would only equal the Lava Tube if the Lava Tube died every 6 months and I doubt it will plus that's not gonna happen with the 1 year warranty.
*** It would take you a whole 4 years of having to replace the Lava Tube to equal what you spend on the Provari one time. The Lava Tube still wins money wise over Provari's durability and 2 year warranty, logically. !!!
So the guy in your example did not have to put out another 300 dollars. He would have come out better had he not bought the Provari in the first place and instead had to replace a Lava Tube a time or even two. Some people just like to "throw away money" because 1) they can and 2) they like to keep up with the Jones's. That's fine if that's their personal preference but logic doesn't justify it.
It sure ain't gonna vape any better than a 1500 dollar Rolex will tell time any better than a Wal-Mart 10 dollar special.
I just KILLED the Provari durability argument.
I proved you cannot use the Provari durability argument to justify the price or claim the Provari is a better value in the long run because of the durability and 2 year warranty.
P.T.Barnum was Right.
The Provari vapes. That's all it does. It doesn't make you breakfast, fetch your slippers, tuck you in at night or make you any prettier or smarter. (in fact it makes you poorer and therefore dumber IMO, see below)
List price for the Provari is 200 dollars not including batteries, atomizer and charger. If you want those, (and they ARE needed) you have to pay an additional 12 for the batteries, 9 for the atomizer, and 17 for the charger. for a total of 236. Then if you wanted to use 18650 batteries add another 20 to that for the extended cap. for 256. It has a 1 year warranty. You can get an extended 1 year warranty for a total of 2 years, for another 25 bucks, so we are up to 281.00.
Lets say you buy all this and 2 years and one day goes by and you do something unthinkable - you drop it off the Hoover Dam. To replace it, you have to spend another 300 dollars.
You could have bought 4 Lava Tubes for that price. 70 x 4 = 280. ( the Lava Tube has everything if you buy the kit for an extra 30 dollars- batteries, atomizer, charger included in the kit. So you would be having to replace it 3 times if you needed the whole kit - It can already use the 18650 batteries without an extended cap and has a 1 year warranty)
Looking at it that way, just to have the ability to vape from 3 to 6 volts is it really worth it? Seems to me it's not. Either way you look at it the rugged durability of the Provari will not equal out the cost comparison to the Lava Tube.
This would only equal the Lava Tube if the Lava Tube died every 6 months and I doubt it will plus that's not gonna happen with the 1 year warranty.
*** It would take you a whole 4 years of having to replace the Lava Tube to equal what you spend on the Provari one time. The Lava Tube still wins money wise over Provari's durability and 2 year warranty, logically. !!!
So the guy in your example did not have to put out another 300 dollars. He would have come out better had he not bought the Provari in the first place and instead had to replace a Lava Tube a time or even two. Some people just like to "throw away money" because 1) they can and 2) they like to keep up with the Jones's. That's fine if that's their personal preference but logic doesn't justify it.
It sure ain't gonna vape any better than a 1500 dollar Rolex will tell time any better than a Wal-Mart 10 dollar special.
I just KILLED the Provari durability argument.
I proved you cannot use the Provari durability argument to justify the price or claim the Provari is a better value in the long run because of the durability and 2 year warranty.
P.T.Barnum was Right.
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Wow.
Kind of harsh!
You know, in this country, you're entitled to take a risk, spend money on design, development, marketing, support of a new product, and then charge what the market will pay. You're NOT obligated to sell it for the lowest price you can charge and not lose money.
Now if YOU want to spend thousands of dollars designing a new PV, spend $$$ paying people to design it, test it, build it, market it, and then ONLY charge what you paid for each one, or a little more, please... be my guest.
Until that day comes, accusing others who ARE willing to take risks and work hard to put out (what many people feel is) a good product seems, to me, a cheap and unneccessary shot!
Competition, I agree, is great. Attacking people and companies which are working to bring new products to market in the vaping world is not productive.
By the way... it's relatively easy to copy another companies design, and figure out ways to make it cheaper.
Nobody should convince you... buy what you want.
All I have to say is don't hate the player, hate the game. If you don't like the game then take your ball and go home. As long as Provari makes a good product and people continue to buy it then you can't fault them. It is all about supply and demand. The GG is the best example of way over priced PV's but they will continue to sell at those prices as long as others are willing to pay the price. Putting a product down doesn't make it an worse or any better but I do respect your opinion on it.
It's kind of ridiculous to compare the lava tube to the provari. That's like comparing a Missy's wetbox to a reo. They both vape at 3.7v and bottom feed so they are the same right?
Yea, kinda like comparing a Rolex to some Chinese piece of junk watch from Walmart!
Oh.... wait.....
Look guys- some want a provari.
Some want a lavatube and $181 dollars extra in their pockets.
Some want a provari but only have a hundred bucks and get the lavatube.
I could say pretty much the same thing about watches, cars, or whatever.
We aren't all made the same- pretending there's a right or wrong answer is just a grade-school game.
Personally, if I wanted a VV tube mod...I don't know which one I'd choose. I don't want a VV tube mod.
Best,
Ande
PS- I did want to say, though- durability isn't just about replacement cost. While I type this, I'm vaping an ultramax and a flashlight mod I made myself. If I drop both, the max won't break. The flashlight probably will. You can say that the modded flashlight is still better because it cost $6, as opposed to $170 for the ultramax, so I can break and replace it dozens of times and be ahead. But when it's broken, it won't vape until I replace it, so if I'm leaving the house, I take the expensive one. Not because it's more expensive, but because it won't break too easy.
Some want a lavatube and $181 dollars extra in their pockets.
Some want a provari but only have a hundred bucks and get the lavatube.
I could say pretty much the same thing about watches, cars, or whatever.
We aren't all made the same- pretending there's a right or wrong answer is just a grade-school game.
Personally, if I wanted a VV tube mod...I don't know which one I'd choose. I don't want a VV tube mod.
Best,
Ande
PS- I did want to say, though- durability isn't just about replacement cost. While I type this, I'm vaping an ultramax and a flashlight mod I made myself. If I drop both, the max won't break. The flashlight probably will. You can say that the modded flashlight is still better because it cost $6, as opposed to $170 for the ultramax, so I can break and replace it dozens of times and be ahead. But when it's broken, it won't vape until I replace it, so if I'm leaving the house, I take the expensive one. Not because it's more expensive, but because it won't break too easy.
I'm well supplied with fixed voltage batteries and mods - 7 Ego batteries, an Omega and a precise plus 18650 + batteries for these. I'm very satisfied with my vaping experience so far. I'm not missing anything at all.
I just ordered a Lavatube.
I blame the hype
I just ordered a Lavatube.
I blame the hype
Since I own a Provari and have spent some time with the Lavatube and done some testing, I'll add a few comments in bullet form:
1. Voltages/Current Availability: There are measurable differences in voltage dips under load with the Lavatube. As much as .25 volt at 6v/3 ohms. The Provari has zero voltage drop at 6v/3ohms. This leads me to believe that the boost circuit in the Provari is superior. Will it make a difference?: .25 volts probably will not make a difference for anyone. Does it say anything about the hardware?: it's possible the regulator in the Lavatube is either inferior to the one in the Provari, or counterfeit.
2. Dual Coil Cartos: Both units throttle dual coils. The Lavatube will continue vaping at any voltage you select (And display that voltage), but supply a lower voltage- thus limiting amps. The provari throws an error over 2.5 amps. Does it matter?: *shrug*
3. Durability (Short term): Provari wins. Even with a short inspection of the two you can tell a difference. And I've dropped my Provari on Cement multiple times and it survived without a mark. The Lavatube would have been badly damaged by such a drop.
4. Quality Control: Anecdotally speaking, I've seen more complaints about Lavatube arriving in a messed up state than Provaris.
5. Durability (Long Term/electronics durability): Bullet point #1 may provide a hint. Lavatube is unknown. The Provari is rock solid.
6. Features: Provari wins. But the features are not important to all vapers. Multimeter functions or correct to decimal battery testing may not be everyone's cup of tea. The Provari's safety features are impressive.
7. Button Design: "tossup". Preferences about button pressing are simply preferences. Whatever you like... Yay! One thing I noticed with the Lavatube is that I would expect it to have button problems long term versus the single Provari button. The buttons are very cheapish on the Lavatube and do not appear to have a long "Mean Time Before Failure" regarding the physical switches. However, with more buttons they will get used less compared to the Provari. I'd still take the Provari switch based on my handling of it.
8. Price: Is it worth the price difference?: To me no. But I already owned a Provari well before the Lavatube was ever heard of. Being that the Darwin and Provari were the only two PVs in the class at the time I purchased- I'm happy with my purchase. Would I buy a Provari at the current price point?: Maybe. Fact is that the Provari is really really solid. I do not use an extender cap, and I already have batteries. For you?: Lavatube probably wins.
You can get a naked Provari for $159.00 or about $100.00 more than you can get a naked Lavatube for. However, if the price drops on the Provari (which I hope it will), a significant enough drop is really going to heat up this competition.
So which one wins?
Lavatube. But only on price differential.
If the differential between the Lavatube and the Provari gets down to about $50-$60.00, based on my handling of the products, I'd go Provari even with the smaller battery (18490).
But that's me. Based on my vaping habits, experience, and preferences.
1. Voltages/Current Availability: There are measurable differences in voltage dips under load with the Lavatube. As much as .25 volt at 6v/3 ohms. The Provari has zero voltage drop at 6v/3ohms. This leads me to believe that the boost circuit in the Provari is superior. Will it make a difference?: .25 volts probably will not make a difference for anyone. Does it say anything about the hardware?: it's possible the regulator in the Lavatube is either inferior to the one in the Provari, or counterfeit.
2. Dual Coil Cartos: Both units throttle dual coils. The Lavatube will continue vaping at any voltage you select (And display that voltage), but supply a lower voltage- thus limiting amps. The provari throws an error over 2.5 amps. Does it matter?: *shrug*
3. Durability (Short term): Provari wins. Even with a short inspection of the two you can tell a difference. And I've dropped my Provari on Cement multiple times and it survived without a mark. The Lavatube would have been badly damaged by such a drop.
4. Quality Control: Anecdotally speaking, I've seen more complaints about Lavatube arriving in a messed up state than Provaris.
5. Durability (Long Term/electronics durability): Bullet point #1 may provide a hint. Lavatube is unknown. The Provari is rock solid.
6. Features: Provari wins. But the features are not important to all vapers. Multimeter functions or correct to decimal battery testing may not be everyone's cup of tea. The Provari's safety features are impressive.
7. Button Design: "tossup". Preferences about button pressing are simply preferences. Whatever you like... Yay! One thing I noticed with the Lavatube is that I would expect it to have button problems long term versus the single Provari button. The buttons are very cheapish on the Lavatube and do not appear to have a long "Mean Time Before Failure" regarding the physical switches. However, with more buttons they will get used less compared to the Provari. I'd still take the Provari switch based on my handling of it.
8. Price: Is it worth the price difference?: To me no. But I already owned a Provari well before the Lavatube was ever heard of. Being that the Darwin and Provari were the only two PVs in the class at the time I purchased- I'm happy with my purchase. Would I buy a Provari at the current price point?: Maybe. Fact is that the Provari is really really solid. I do not use an extender cap, and I already have batteries. For you?: Lavatube probably wins.
You can get a naked Provari for $159.00 or about $100.00 more than you can get a naked Lavatube for. However, if the price drops on the Provari (which I hope it will), a significant enough drop is really going to heat up this competition.
So which one wins?
Lavatube. But only on price differential.
If the differential between the Lavatube and the Provari gets down to about $50-$60.00, based on my handling of the products, I'd go Provari even with the smaller battery (18490).
But that's me. Based on my vaping habits, experience, and preferences.
Just finished an order for Lava tube. Shet is really cheap. ordered Puff daddy tank with it with 3 pre-punched DCC. Thx for the thread ,lol.
you know there is know reason to be insulting if you don't want a provari fine don't buy one, the fact is most mods are expensive
provari -$159.00
Darwin-$245.00
Reo grand- $141.00
Redsky vv mods -195.00
GG -249.00
Alpha UltraMax Base Unit with RES $179.00
and I could go on but you get the point buy what makes you happy.
When you buy a Rolex your not paying for a watch. Your paying for jewelry. I can easily compare a Rolex to a 10 dollar watch because they both use quartz technology - The most accurate time keeping technology known to man ( in a wrist watch anyway) They both preform The Same function at the same level of quality. Time keeping is not what people buy Rolex's for.
Same thing with the Provari and Lava Tube. One is not going to out perform the other. They both use similar quality electronics that have similar design features to ensure constant voltages for vaping on standard atomizer coils. Everything works the same when the voltage hits the coil. No difference, just like there is no difference in the quartz technology of the watches.
Actually, The quartz watch will keep better time than expensive Rolex's because the Rolex's have mechanical movements.
I won't apologize for that. If you buy a Provari because you are swayed by the hype that I have shown to be overrated ( unless you really really need a stainless steel body which is rare) then I'd say you just didn't think this thing through.
Sure those mods are expensive. A few years ago someone made a pricy mod and decided with this new market they could make a killing and others followed suit. Do I believe for one second it actually cost so much to design, advertise and manufacture these mods to justify the prices? No way on earth. I believe they do it because they can get away with it and know people will pay, especially because the only competition they had was each other. The Lava Tube could be great for these companies and force them to level the playing field. Would they lose money? Of course not. They would make more money by offering a better product at a better price accessible to more people that they currently are.
Until an owner of one of these Mod companies comes here and details for me each dime he spent in design, advertising, manufacturing, materials - and shows me, he himself is not getting ripped off by these products or services and that his price is fair for the product and is justified, all you guys are just speculating on the price justification. None of you really know that the materials, manufacturing, design, advertising are what is keeping the prices high. None of you know the companies markup.
Yes, I know the Chinese do work cheaper and that's a big factor. Not only that but its the U.S Dollars fault prices are so high in the U.S. It's bad politics married with bad economy. Simply put the dollar is worth nothing. That's why people charge more. If the Government and the Federal Reserve would not play lose and fast with the American People's money it would not cost nearly as much for American materials and manufacturing services.
Here is a good article on that So Much for the Cheap 'China Price' - BusinessWeek
People say Buy American but they do not realize the system is flawed. Buying more American will not boost the economy and cause the value of the dollar to go up to bring these prices down.
Many American e-cig companies are actually starting to move their manufacturing plants to China like GotVapes. China has access to cheaper electronics because they have more access to them ( more of an abundance) than any other country in the world. That also helps keep Chinese prices down. Is everything in China made "Cheap" ? Of course not. I have been buying the highest quality Lithium Ion batteries on earth (and other parts for my E-bike) for years from China. There is no reason why a Provari clone made with stainless steel made in China cannot be both superior to and cheaper than the Provari we have now. I look at this as not so smart a business decision by the Provari company (and others) to not use the best manufacturing services they could have used.
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I must really be bored. I've read this whole thread thinking there was going to be a point made. Worst thread ever. Is this what's called trolling?
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