LI New York Front Page Propaganda 3-7-2014

[Startle]

Front page of today's Long Island newspaper. Seems likely some forth coming legislation is in the works...


---------------------

 

[Startle]

Here is the text of the article:

E-cigarettes appear to be a
gateway product to cigarette
smoking among youths, according
to researchers who studied
the “vaping” and smoking patterns
of nearly 40,000 teens nationwide.

The controversial nicotine containing
products used in
smoking cessation programs
to help cigarette smokers
break their habit are having
the opposite effect on some
youths, according to a study
in this month’s Pediatrics, a
journal of the American Medical
Association.

{MODERATED and ADDED LINK}

http://www.newsday.com/news/health/study-youths-who-use-e-cigs-move-on-to-cigarettes-1.7310999

 

[rothenbj]

Yup, Slantz gets his message broadcast everywhere in this lazy MSM environment. Nobody around to stop it either.

 

[wv2win]

Glantz is the king of the ANTZ. Lying and misrepresenting the facts are his stock-in-trade. Liberal media outlets just lap this stuff up.

 

[Roger_Lafayette]

You might have a look at yesterday's media roundup. Media outlets are sorted into two piles at the end. Those which uncritically report the inferences that Glantz draws from the data, and those which question them. Most are in the former category

 

[rothenbj]

You might have a look at yesterday's media roundup. Media outlets are sorted into two piles at the end. Those which uncritically report the inferences that Glantz draws from the data, and those which question them. Most are in the former category

The ones I heard on NBC were strong on Slantz with mention of opposition, that was both local and national.

 

[Stosh]

No one in these studies mention how it is that after decades of advertisement / selling / purchase / usage restrictions there are children under 18 still smoking tobacco (and other substances) in appreciable numbers.
Are their methods ineffective? Are children just ignoring them? How are children obtaining these burning devil sticks?

Now some children are experimenting with a SAFER alternative and panic ensues.....

 

[AttyPops]

teens. webmd .com/news/20140306/rising-e-cigarette-use-tied-to-more-smoking-in-teens
Rising E-Cigarette Use Tied to More Smoking in Teens

The study raises the question of whether e-cigarettes are a "gateway drug," and Dutra said she believes they are. "But that's more my opinion," she said. "The study doesn't show a causal relationship. I can't say e-cigarette use causes kids to smoke based on this finding. We need some more longitudinal data on this. But it does look like these devices are contributing to it."

Again, headlines are a bit deceptive...even with WebMD.

The scientists are cautious. It is interesting to note: even if occasional smoking is up among teens...they have brains...I hope they are smart enough to see through all the hookah propaganda and also know that cigs are bad...and avoid the smokes. I'm sure they with "try" it...but I hope they stay way the heck away from smoke (hookah or cigs) in the long term.

Best that they didn't do any of it. But...we're talking teens here. I think it's unavoidable. And if they make it prescription only, then they'll use that stupid hookah and cigs. Sigh. Best to do the "less harm" (THR) approach, IMO. Alas, the politicians won't figure it out.

 

[Roger_Lafayette]

<snip>
Now some children are experimenting with a SAFER alternative and panic ensues.....

Watch the logic:

1) If a minor has used both tobacco and a PV - but we don't know which came first - then we may conclude that there is at least a possibility that the PV lead to the analog cigarette since we "know" that PVs are marketed to children (because of the coloring and the flavors). This also makes the minor a "dual use smoker" which means that PVs may be actually preventing them from quitting, since they use PVs where they can't use analogs. (This argument also applies to adults.)

2) If a minor has used PVs but not tobacco cigarettes, then they are at risk of taking up tobacco cigarettes, because they're addicted to nicotine. If they haven't used nicotine with their PVs, then they are at risk of becoming addicted to nicotine, because PVs "renomalize smoking."

This is why the data shows that PVs lead to "more smoking, not less." Well, allegedly.

Anything is possible in a world in which correlation can be used as a substitute for causality, and no distinction is made between sheer conjecture and hypotheses which are at least arguably supported by data.

That's why respected publications like JAMA have a peer review process

***

The ones I heard on NBC were strong on Slantz with mention of opposition, that was both local and national.

Yesderday's summary cites both a local NBC and national doing just what you describe. CBS nat'l was more critical. The bus. press was also mixed. Bloomberg swallowed it hook lne and sinker. Reuters (also picked up by Yahoo news) was more objective. NYT, WaPo and HuffPo were skeptical, but many small-town papers bought it whole hog.

If there's any correlation between how this story has been covered and certain claimed characteristics of the outlets, I haven't spotted it. I think the skill set of the reporter and/or the amount of time and space available for the story could be more important variables. Opinion pieces and/or editoriials are a different bag of tricks - we should see lots of those today.

 

[Roger_Lafayette]

<snip>

Before you lavish too much praise on the lead author of this study, you might want to take a look at what the conclusions actually state: http://tobaccoanalysis.blogspot.com/2014/03/conclusion-of-new-glantz-study-on.html

It would be nice if she was the careful, well-trained and "cautious" scientest that we'd all prefer her to be. But if she signed off on this paper, then perhaps such accolades may be misdirected.

That said, one cannot entirely exclude the possiblity that hemline lengths are responsible for stock market trends. Or perhaps the reverse is true. We just don't know.

 

[Bramble]

What they are also not saying is that the recent study from Greece shows that vaping 18 mg for an hour supplies roughly a little less nicotine than smoking a cigarette in 5 minutes. They are completely ignoring the fact that vaping is probably about as addicting as the NRT that is already freely available.

They just can't stop lying about eCigs being the same thing as tobacco cigarettes.

 

[AttyPops]

Before you lavish too much praise on the lead author of this study, you might want to take a look at what the conclusions actually state: http://tobaccoanalysis.blogspot.com/2014/03/conclusion-of-new-glantz-study-on.html

It would be nice if she was the careful, well-trained and "cautious" scientest that we'd all prefer her to be. But if she signed off on this paper, then perhaps such accolades may be misdirected.

That said, one cannot entirely exclude the possiblity that hemline lengths are responsible for stock market trends. Or perhaps the reverse is true. We just don't know.

Well, for the record...I didn't praise her conclusions nor give the study any accolades at all. I simply stated that the headlines jump even farther than the partial caution/restraint the scientist showed.

 

[Joe Riccardi]

This ...... me off so much this morning the lady at the gas station I frequent pointed it out to me because she knows I quit smoking my brand doesn't sell much anymore and she knows I switched to vaping and I don't normally read the paper she also said when I pointed out its nonsense "I know why would anyone go backwards" and she's a non smoker the only decent thing in that article is the last paragraph or 2 where another dr in the city calls Glantz and the govt and bt and bp all greedy ......

 

[Roger_Lafayette]

Well, for the record...I didn't praise her conclusions nor give the study any accolades at all. I simply stated that the headlines jump even farther than the partial caution/restraint the scientist showed.

Just saw this video. Watch just how "cautious" (I believed you said something about that too) the lead author is:

http://www.nbclosangeles.com/news/local/
E-Cigarettes-Electronic-Tobacco-Smoking-Vaping-Teens-Health-School-Students-248928061.html

"We also saw that the kids who had used e-cigarettes were more likely to progress from experimenting with conventional tobacco cigarettes to becoming regular tobacco cigarette users."[At 1:03]

Now she doesn't say which came first (because no such data exists).

It's the data analyst's equivalent of "But ... I didn't inhale." More than merely spinning. And most definitely not "cautious." In fact, I'd say she was basicaly busted.

 

[Stosh]

Watch the logic:

1) If a minor has used both tobacco and a PV - but we don't know which came first - then we may conclude that there is at least a possibility that the PV lead to the analog cigarette .......

2) If a minor has used PVs but not tobacco cigarettes, then they are at risk of taking up tobacco cigarettes,......

This is why the data shows that PVs lead to "more smoking, not less." Well, allegedly.

Anything is possible in a world in which correlation can be used as a substitute for causality, and no distinction is made between sheer conjecture and hypotheses which are at least arguably supported by data.

That's why respected publications like JAMA have a peer review process

My logic was more to the point that after decades of increasing taxes, laws, restrictions, how is it that anyone under 18 (or over 18 for that matter) smokes, or would ever try smoking in any form. The present policies, strategy have been the ultimate FAIL....

The children can buy one $10 single use disposable e-cig OR a pack of 20 smokes for less money, that they can share with their friends. If both are as difficult to obtain (along with a 6-pack...) which is the more logical choice? (at least to a child..)

What intrigues me is where the kids get the money to develop any addiction, to any substance...Breaking Bad comes to mind...

SONORA, Calif. -
Two 8-year-olds and one 9-year-old were caught smoking ...(that other substance) in the bathroom of their California school, according to police. Now, they're wondering how the kids got their hands on the substance.

 

[DrMA]

By the same logic, one can conclude that energy drinks are also a gateway to smoking. Or NRTs. Or anything else that's marketed to teens. The SLantz gang really stepped into a massive steaming pile with this one.

I saw a comment on one of these stories somewhere (sorry, can't find it right now), and it said something to the effect that this article's conclusions are equivalent to being surprised that attendees to an AA meeting are more likely to be alcoholics, and concluding from this that AA is a gateway to alcoholism.