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Liquid Sales Temporarily Held

Discussion in 'DiscountVapers' started by gormly, May 10, 2012.

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  1. gormly

    gormly Forum Supplier ECF Veteran

    Jun 9, 2011
    Connecticut USA
    Liquid Sales Temporarily Held

    Today I had a customer email me about an allergic reaction, nothing serious, just a tickling etc...
    He is a current customer and has ordered liquids before, so it is entirely possible that he has developed an allergy to something unrelated or that it just popped up.

    But because I recently changed the nicotine I use to a cleaner version (almost entirely clear) and it is strained more than the previous version I want to do some more tests. It's the only variable that has changed.

    Over reaction on my part?... probably, but I must make sure everything I do is safe to the best of my ability.
    So to that end, I am clearing everything out, cleaning up from top to bottom and then testing my ingredients and equipment, from the beakers and droppers to the PG/VG and Nic, and starting over. Obviously this will not fix anyones allergic reaction but it will give me a chance to go over everything and make sure it's not caused by anything here.

    Not sure when it will start up again, but shouldn't be too long.

    *This does not affect Tobacco eLiquid
  2. Bayemon

    Bayemon Senior Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Mar 11, 2011
    Any updates Eric?
  3. Lethalp

    Lethalp Ultra Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Aug 29, 2011
    Nice to see a vendor go above and beyond to try to keep customers safe! Thank u Eric!
  4. gormly

    gormly Forum Supplier ECF Veteran

    Jun 9, 2011
    Connecticut USA
    Updates on Liquids.

    1. All tests are done, everything is cleaned and ready to go.
    2. I am now pondering the future of liquids.

    So as you all know I tell it like it is.
    This past week, although still busy, has been quite the eye opener. I have spent significantly less time with orders.
    For example, this morning I processed 40 orders in about 2 hours. That's packed, labeled and shipped.

    However, I also had three orders with liquids I put aside, they were special for a few people who desperately wanted liquids or had an old order that was just paid. Those three orders took me almost as long as the previous 40.

    I am not kidding. Clearly, I am approaching this the wrong way. Just as an FYI I do not just throw stuff together and ship. I am not sure what other vendors do but I takes this extremely seriously and do not wing it, so the station is cleaned and prepared, bottles inspected, measuring tools sterilized, all that.

    I am deciding what to do, working all that extra time for less than minimum wage is not really what I set out to do.
    When I was shipping 50 bottles a week it was no big deal.. but now it's a lot more.

    I have three options:
    1. Sell the liquids for a lot more, which will make it worthwhile and possibly allow me to get some help.
    2. Sell flavored liquid bases so people can DIY my stuff. (this way it can be premade)
    3. Premake everything and only sell what I have in stock.

    All three options have issues for me, the first because I'd rather not raise prices, the second because a lot of people will not want to DIY and third, I'd end up throwing some out because I am paranoid about letting liquids sit.
    Interestingly enough I have given some thought to combining all three.

    USPS is closed for the weekend now so I am going out with the family to LongHorns Steakhouse (we tried on Mothers day.. so crowded) and to the mall and we'll hang out, have fun and my wife and I will talk about it. Hopefully I come up with something useful, because I cant do it this way anymore. I really do need to sleep. I've lost about 20 pounds over the last year (i forget to eat because I have to answer that one last email, process that one last order)
    I am at 179! and I am 6' 2" :) Soo skinny now. That's kind of a good thing but not this way.

    I've only been at this ecig business a year now and for the most part I've been working "in a box" because I don't have much time to get outside advice, so if anyone has some advice they can share, I am all ears.

    If I didn't still have a day job, this wouldn't be an issue but I do.
  5. mohawkx

    mohawkx Ultra Member ECF Veteran

    Mar 14, 2011
    I for one wouldn't mind paying 15.00 for thirty ml of your juice. Your juice is the only juice I use, presently.
  6. gormly

    gormly Forum Supplier ECF Veteran

    Jun 9, 2011
    Connecticut USA
    I was kinda leaning that way, make the 15ml more but give a discounted on the larger size. The bottle size is actually 35ml now because my supplier ran out of the 30ml bottles and I had to get something.

    Can I ask a general question of everyone? when you buy from other vendors are the bottles filled to the top?
    I've tried two other vendors just to test and both times I got 29ml in 35ml bottles and once I receive 13ml in a 15ml bottle.

    I tend to fill them to the top which makes them actually 36.5ml I think. (I mix separately so it doesn't affect the bottle ratio)
  7. DPLongo22

    DPLongo22 "C'mon, Algebra..." Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Supporting member
    Dec 17, 2011
    Two comments from my perspective, Eric.

    1. When I'm shopping for juice, I see .$50 (per ML) as a very good bargain, $.75 is reasonable, and $1.00 as high, but sometimes worth it if the juice is real good. I wouldn't buy that particular juice as an everyday-vape (due to pricing), but I don't feel it's robbery either.

    A pack of Marb Medium costs $11 here ($.55 per "nail"!). 'Nuff said.

    2. Regarding "fillage" (with all due respect to George Costanza), only you and one other vendor (from which I buy) fill to the very brim. All my others are to the neckline. As a rule, I actually prefer a small amount of space, since I tend to be (on only very rare occasions, indeed!) - somewhat "clumsy".

  8. DPLongo22

    DPLongo22 "C'mon, Algebra..." Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Supporting member
    Dec 17, 2011
    And yes, I do realize that it would be physically impossible for you to fill your bottles "to the neckline." You can't rightly fill to that which doesn't exist (existentially speaking).
  9. Andyhrn

    Andyhrn Super Member ECF Veteran

    Mar 1, 2011
    Well, I have discovered the next thing : PA flavors (even not dark ones) + 20/80% PG/VG are produce a very high acid level e-juice that killing cartos and teeth enamel (not kidding).
    There is not such a problem with the tobacco PG I got from you . May be just keep it simple (and cheap,LOL).
    Btw, it will be a really nice to get e-juice bottles with a drip tip.
  10. chewie

    chewie Full Member Verified Member

    Wow, that's insane. Those are approaching Vegas, L.A., New York City cigarette prices. I live in Colorado, and Premium brands range between $6 -$7 a pack, or $49 - $59 a carton. When I smoked analogues I could get a pack of Kools for slightly less than Marlboros or Marlboro Menthols, I used to smoke Marlboro lights when I was a kid, when the Camel Filters or Camel Lights made my throat irritated or gave me a cough. Marlboro Mediums were a good smoke, I would switch to those when I needed a break from Menthols or Camels, they were almost full flavor, but less throat hit and tar.

    Regarding Eric making some E-liquid flavors in advance. I thought that most e-liquids were better with a little age? They call it steeping on the forum here since I have started vaping. I have been browsing your site for the last 2 days (also visiting periodically over a couple months), and just got around to looking at the E liquid flavors you offer. It looks like you have some good flavors, and USA made USP grade ingredients sound like a good thing to me. You mentioned that one of the options you were considering was pre-mixing some of your flavors. Would that make filling orders less time consuming as they come in, is that why? I always hear people saying that their E liquids taste better when they have time to steep. What is the drawback to letting liquids sit ready to sell on a shelf, except for the obvious one that after a rather prolonged period they would obviously get stale, lose flavor, and nicotine could lose it's potency?

    I know I got my Apple E liquid from a vendor I have been buying a lot from recently that tasted more muted than the first time I ordered it, like it was weak in flavoring, so I vaped my other E liquid flavors, and noticed my Apple got more flavor intensity over the following month and a half. I think it would be nice for people who vape your liquids to get them ready to vape when the order gets to their door, I can't say because I haven't tried them yet, but just thinking about this steeping issue that people are always talking about. I often am forced to wait until I get paid before I place an order, that way I get the larger size bottles of E liquid, so I want my juice ready to vape as soon as I get it, I don't want to need to let it steep in order to get the best flavor.

    Also, shouldn't you shake your juice when you get it, so that the nicotine and VG and PG (if it's a blend), not to mention the flavorings, will mix properly before you vape it? That's difficult to do if the bottle is filled to the neck. As long as it measures the ml you advertise, you are being fair, I guess if you want to fill them to the neck, people can always use their left over bottles from previous orders to pour out some contents and leave a little air, if they feel shaking is necessary.

    Your customers who regularly vape your E liquids are more qualified to speak on this. I was curious if you were going to continue selling your E liquids which is why I came to ECF to visit, and linked here from the DV site. I was also curious if there were any new developments after a customer's possible allergic reaction. Glad to hear it wasn't more serious allergy, if the e liquid was even the culprit at all, difficult to tell. (I just got itchy hives on my leg today, and I haven't changed detergents, soaps, put on new clothing, started new medication, vaped anything different, or even been outside this weekend, don't know what it could be.)

    Interesting to find out what you ultimately decide to do with your Eliquid line. Good luck.
  11. gormly

    gormly Forum Supplier ECF Veteran

    Jun 9, 2011
    Connecticut USA
    Steeping is a subject I am not really going to touch, it's one of those areas that no matter what you say, you will have detractors on either side and it's a no win argument.

    The idea that all (or most eliquids) are better with age is very subjective. The mind plays wonderful tricks on us.

    I am the kind of guy that is not swayed by general opinion or unscientific theory, I make mine fresh, it's how I feel it is best, what is done after is not my concern :) But at least people know they start off "new".

    In my opinion, you shake really vigorously, you're done, it will never taste as good as the first day.
    This is just me, others feel differently. And there is a really easy way to tell, get a liquid, try it first day, rate it, try it again in a week, repeat and review. if steeping works for your taste buds, awesome, if not, awesome.

    Just that it costs money. I can't premake 100 bottles of my flavors in different nicotine strengths and hope they sell.

    I think I covered this already, not sure but the customer was stressed and over vaped, it was the extra nic in his system that caused his issue, nothing to do with my liquid.

    as far as itchy hives, if one starts thinking this way they will never vape, an itch here, a breakout there, it's not automatically a vape liquid. I caution anyone going own that road... ever get an Ant on you and then for the rest of the day you feel them crawling on you? It's like that. Don't let itchy rash=bad liquid

    I bet many of you are itchy right now :)

    Right.... now.

    LOL (how many of you just scratched?)
  12. JZXJ

    JZXJ Senior Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Mar 16, 2012
    St. Louis
    Here is a suggestion, if you premake your liquids at 0% couldn't you just add nic to order when you package for shipping? You can guestimate roughly how much of any given flavor you go through in 2 weeks and just make 2 weeks worth at a time If you decide to not make any more liquid I'll miss it and I am glad I stocked up on PB cup and lemonade!! as it stands right now that stuff is Gold. I only have one other supplier I buy from regularly, If I lived near you I would work for liquid and cartos lol.
  13. gormly

    gormly Forum Supplier ECF Veteran

    Jun 9, 2011
    Connecticut USA

    It's a valid suggestion, I've thought about it but a lot of mixes have multiple flavors and mixing then ahead of time is the same as doing the entire thing I think, the idea I get about all this steeping is the flavors meld over time not just the nic.

    I could be wrong as I've never tried it. Maybe I should test it out :)
  14. sandybeach

    sandybeach Ultra Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Nov 8, 2011
    That's a tough situation; I wouldn't want to be in your place. I saw a vendor that cancelled someone's juice order because the person went on a thread saying that the juice made them cough. But now the customer is all upset. It's not an easy decision for you guys, is it? I also wonder about the payment thing I PMd you about too... ugh, what a pain. I haven't tried your liquids yet; mostly because I have enough liquids here to fuel a jet to Mars ;)
  15. mohawkx

    mohawkx Ultra Member ECF Veteran

    Mar 14, 2011
    Can I order juice again?
  16. gormly

    gormly Forum Supplier ECF Veteran

    Jun 9, 2011
    Connecticut USA
    I'll have to check this PM situation, It used to pop up not it doesn't.. argg.. probably my chrome browser blocking it or something.

    why would a vendor cancel someones order due to a complaint? that's lame. :(
    they should be working with the customer, not shutting them out.

    Yes Mohawkx I turned them back on :)
  17. heliguy

    heliguy Senior Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Jun 1, 2011
    I just wanted to say that posting this here is something most vendors would not do. I have a sincere respect for what you have done. It says a lot about who you are.

    Although, I dont often order liquid from you often I do order supplies and will keep doing so.

    Honestly if you have to slightly raise prices to make sure everything is good and get extra help. Dont beat yourself up about it.

    Or possible spread out the price increase slightly over all your products so it doesnt seem so drastic.

  18. Dragoncqb

    Dragoncqb Senior Member ECF Veteran

    Oct 3, 2011
    Louisville Ky
    Eric the flavoring in your site list is gone, are not selling it any more where will I get my Cream De Menthe, Apple, Jamaican Delight. If your not going to sale it can you tell me what brand ?


  19. gormly

    gormly Forum Supplier ECF Veteran

    Jun 9, 2011
    Connecticut USA

    I am just out, I had neglected to account for the flavoring sales and last weekend I sold so much I almost ran out for my liquids I use multiple sources for my liquids but almost every flavor is at least one component of something so being pressed for time, I just shut it off temporarily, I should have them back in 5 days, I have tracking for all of it.

    CDM and Apple are from TPA, the other I cannot tell you, but I think TPA has something similar just not quite exact. :)
  20. Dragoncqb

    Dragoncqb Senior Member ECF Veteran

    Oct 3, 2011
    Louisville Ky
    5 days, thats good hear. Pleased to hear your sales are good as well.
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