Looks like FDA making move to restrict JUUL and similar soon

[Rossum]

What I'm getting at is by being slow to act about the reputation they've managed to acquire as being a new teenage fad they've opened up the vape industry to the traditional 'won't somebody please think of the children' attacks.

Meh. Those attacks have been coming at us since well before juul even existed.

 

[Brewdawg1181]

As the biggest name in vaping in the states (by the sounds of it anyway) I feel like they had the responsibility to represent vaping and the community in a more constructive light.

I understand your perspective, but: Do I think Juul could've/should've done things differently? Maybe. And yes, some of those different things could be a benefit to the industry. But make no mistake - they have no responsibility to the industry whatsoever. They could have possibly helped themselves by better predicting the reaction to their success. But then again, it's too early to tell if that will really hurt them long term.

Myself, I don't want anyone in the public (especially those that aren't my customers) telling me what my company's responsibilities are. Really, they come down to:
1) make money for me and my family
2) provide real value for my customers
3) treat my employees well
4) do the above with integrity, and no harm to others

My company (like Juul) has zero responsibility beyond that. Same would be true if I were a public company, except #2 would be to provide profit to my shareholders. That said, as an ex-smoking vaper, and one who believes vaping is a tremendous option for millions, I hope their success won't trigger more actions that would limit choices that can save lives.

 

[Brewdawg1181]

I thought I was hip to teen slang. What is "spice"?

My daughter was into it back in high school-6-7 years ago. That stuff is scary! She got very paranoid. Back then it was kind of new and people didn't know how bad it was, especially teenagers. How bad can it be if it's being sold at a regular store? I am sure that's what the teenagers thought.

Spice is a form of poupori (spelling?) that kids smoke and gas stations sell along with their line of alternative tobacco products. It's pretty much banned anymore but those same places don't have a qualm about kids buying vape stuff along with their other alternative tobacco products.

Spice originally was referred to "legal wee_d." Herbs infused with lab created cannabin*ids. Other versions were sold with a different medium, called bath salts. And they was legal, simply because it wasn't specifically outlawed. Each time one version was outlawed, immediately a new one with a very slightly different chemical structure was created and released. So at the time, they had difficulty in completely keeping them off the market. And because each is chemically different, no one knows exactly what they do to the brain. There are no substantive scientific studies of their effects, because there are hundreds/thousands of variations. I do know that in 2010, my then 14 year old son tried it a couple of times with friends. The friends had no issue with it, but he was institutionalized two times over the next year. The ER nurse the first time told us they had probably a hundred admitted in the couple of months before us due to spice & variants. The circuit board that is his brain was essentially fried and rewired. It's been a looong road with private schools and therapy. He's not the same to this day, at 22. To my knowledge, they still sell versions in convenience stores today. Thankfully, c_b_d has become more available and widely used by teens as an alternative, and doesn't seem to cause the same issues. For a bit of irony, at 22, he actually buys Juul, and could still buy spice if he wanted to at many convenience stores.

But back on topic: hey, thank God at least he'll no longer be able to get the mango flavor soon, huh?

 

[Pete M]

I understand your perspective, but: Do I think Juul could've/should've done things differently? Maybe. And yes, some of those different things could be a benefit to the industry. But make no mistake - they have no responsibility to the industry whatsoever. They could have possibly helped themselves by better predicting the reaction to their success. But then again, it's too early to tell if that will really hurt them long term.

Myself, I don't want anyone in the public (especially those that aren't my customers) telling me what my company's responsibilities are. Really, they come down to:
1) make money for me and my family
2) provide real value for my customers
3) treat my employees well
4) do the above with integrity, and no harm to others

My company (like Juul) has zero responsibility beyond that. Same would be true if I were a public company, except #2 would be to provide profit to my shareholders. That said, as an ex-smoking vaper, and one who believes vaping is a tremendous option for millions, I hope their success won't trigger more actions that would limit choices that can save lives.

Yeah to be fair I was just mouthing off without having thought about my argument, and having done some research most of the 'negative' social media stuff was not on their official account but teens being teens. So I pretty much take back most of what I was blethering on about yesterday.

Responsibility was probably the wrong word as well

 

[United States]

Juul shoulda known better.

Now being a couple of folks who started it and their product becoming a near overnight success, the founders may have become blinded by the money falling from the sky like rain. They probably hired experts to get the word out and sat back on a yacht while sipping on mai tai's enjoying the success.

At some point the lavish lifestyle can become as addictive as the products they sell and concience gets replaced with an insatiable appetite for more.
Fame caught up and ran them over.

And as others have said, this did not start with Juul. To me the irony is it began in a city that bans smoking in public and that's why I say "Juul shoulda known better".

 

[stols001]

Restriction tends to lead to more restriction over time. I don't care which vape product it is, it sucks.

So, once the gas stations are taken care of, well the teens will move on to other methods. Hence, the cycle will continue.

As a teen, I had access to ANYTHING I wanted, even the harder stuff to get like the "legal" drugs, alcohol or tobacco, The ONLY thing you need is a homeless desperate person and enough cash to throw in whatever number of 40s he desires to purchase along with your order.

It is crazy stupid how people are buying into the age verification thing.

Do you know how EASY IT IS to find a desperate homeless person, willing to do WHATEVER you want for a few bucks? It is CRAZY easy, is what it is. I get approached ALL THE TIME by the homeless, asking me for change for the bus. I am 100% convinced that I could say to said homeless person, "I will pretend you ARE looking for bus money, not liquor or whatnot, and I will give you five dollars if you go in and buy me a Juul."

The FDA needs to work on the homeless problem in my opinion, and then they could work on their little "bans." Only it's NOT about ACCESS it is about restriction.

By the way, I was not the ONLY teen I knew who used this method. We were ALL doing it, because well, one's parent's liquor cabinet can only be watered down so far.

The harder stuff, well, that was way easier to get, I mean, it was black market already. I can guarantee you my dealers of "insert whatever substance" were not checking my AGE. They might have been a bit worried about whether I was an underage "plant" but once over THAT hump, all you need is money and a meeting place.

Anna