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Massively stupid question here....

Discussion in 'M-401/402 "Mini" & M403 Super Mini' started by lorikay13, Mar 17, 2010.

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  1. lorikay13

    lorikay13 Supplier Associate ECF Veteran

    Dec 13, 2009
    Oregon
    okay...like many others I have read I am ready to throw in the towel completely on this e-cig thing. Cartomisers....worse than cigarettes in my opinion. I have wasted $100's testing and autopsying and there is simply NO WAY to use one without having it burn through. So,.....I switch to 401...like the idea of dipping and having an atty exposed so it can be worked with. (tried the 901 and the 801 also). So far I have not been able to get more than 2-3 hits off this thing and then it's the burnt atty taste. I bought 4 attys....good ones.....so it is not a defective part. I know there is another thread like this but I did not find the answer to my specific massively stupid question. Which is:
    Is the atomizer supposed to actually touch the cart filling?????

    And if I want to try using the Blue Foam is the atty supposed to touch the foam??? I tried it both ways...touching....melts the foam....not touching.....3 hits and then dry atty.

    Thanks for any help regarding the 401. I will assume the answer will be the same for the 901 and 801 since I have the same problem with them.
     
  2. River

    River Super Member ECF Veteran

    Nov 11, 2009
    Independence, KY USA
    One of my big challenges with my 510s was finding the right cart mod then doing it enough times to get it right. I was always using too much fill and the cart did the same thing every time. 3 or 4 good vapes then dry because it was packed too tight to wick properly.

    Try less filler to start with.
     
  3. Blaro

    Blaro Full Member ECF Veteran

    Dec 9, 2009
    New York
    pls disregard previous irrelevant post! (mine, that is)
     
  4. Col. Gaunt

    Col. Gaunt Vaping Master Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Supporting member
    Aug 6, 2009
    Chicago, IL

    Why after 2-3 hits you are getting a burnt atty taste makes no sense. When you use fresh atomizers are you blowing out the primer before you use them?

    The answer to your main question, no, the filler material is not supposed to touch the atty.

    3 hits on blue foam then dry? I have used blue foam and not have this happen.

    Somthing strange is going on.
     
  5. WatZ

    WatZ Full Member

    Sep 8, 2009
    NJ
    510 user here as well. After purchasing about 5 full 901 PV's and even 2 screwdrivers, I gave up on it after I got my 510.

    I've been dripping for about 5 months and just started using the ZFM mod which is rather nice for when I am driving or can't drip habitually.

    Thanks to the rules, I can't post you a link until I get 15 posts. At this rate, I'll be a member here for a year before I can.

    At 35 shipped for a 510 kit for 2 full PV's, it's worth a try. Shipping is the same regardless so take your time and see if it's right for you. After all, some people still do prefer the 901 for taste or the 801 for throat hit.
     
  6. lorikay13

    lorikay13 Supplier Associate ECF Veteran

    Dec 13, 2009
    Oregon
    Hey River :)
    So do you say the same thing....the atty is NOT supposed to touch the filler??? And if that is the case then is there a measurment for the gap ???
     
  7. voltaire

    voltaire Super Member ECF Veteran

    Dec 4, 2009
    Florida
    Ummm, what? Yes, the filler material IS supposed touch the bridge inside of the atty - that's how it wicks the liquid.
     
  8. shanobi187

    shanobi187 Senior Member ECF Veteran

    Jan 19, 2010
    Portland Oregon
    I have a 510 and I use the PTB as filler. I don't use the straw mod or anything fancy, just a pyramid teabag cut in half and put in the cart. I drip around ten drops in the filler and one or two on the atty and I vape for quite awhile on that. Something seems odd about what you're describing. I'm sorry to hear you're having problems with your 510.
    I hope it gets figured out soon.
     
  9. KarrMcDebt

    KarrMcDebt Super Member ECF Veteran

    If the attomizer does not touch the polyfill/bluefoam/etc.... then the juice can not wick from the cart to the atty. You'll be smoking on dry attys.
    If your atomizer is melting your polyfill, you MAY be having a battery problem. That sounds like its getting to hot, or the pollyfill isn't wet enough. (Like posted earlier, maybe to much filler keeping it from wicking properly, then the top is dry but the bottom wet.)
    If you have a meter, test the voltage coming from the battery. It should read 4.2v or less on a new charge. Then test the resistance on the attomizer. Joye510 run about 2.2 ohms, 901's run arround 3.2 ohms. If the resistance is less than 2 ohms there is a problem and thats why your cooking your carts.

    Think of the resistance (ohms) as a valve on a sink, and your atty like a watter baloon;

    The lower the resistance, the higher the water preasure. The higher the ohms, the lower the water preasure.

    At arround 2.2 - 3.2 ohms you have a good water flow into your water balloon to fill it without bursting it. At less than 2.2 ohms, the water preasure is too great and it breaks the balloon, (in your case, melting the filler/burning out wick/burning out the coil, probably in that order.)

    At more than 4 or so ohms, the water is trickling so slowly that you can't fill the balloon, (in this case you don't have enough power going through the atty for it to heat up to vapeing temp.)

    If your voltage reads good (4.2V or less) and your resistance reads good (2.2 - ?4? ohms) then I'm at a loss.

    Is the juice high in VG? That would make it thicker and wick slower.
    How many drops are you getting into the carts when you fill? (wondering about air bubbles at the bottom of the cart)
    Does the fill actualy melt, or does it just taste burnt?

    Hope this helps.
     
  10. Col. Gaunt

    Col. Gaunt Vaping Master Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Supporting member
    Aug 6, 2009
    Chicago, IL

    Sorry, I was wrong, you are right, it is suppose to touch.
     
  11. lorikay13

    lorikay13 Supplier Associate ECF Veteran

    Dec 13, 2009
    Oregon
    trust me....I do know there is something wrong with what I am doing and not the device :) I've been vaping with cartos/KR8 since I started so I'm clueless about attys and all such. One thing I just realized is that you can't vape on these little tiny things the way you do with a XL KR8....
    So I'm trying the pen spring with blue foam right now and it seems to be working so far. I understand what your saying, River about the wicking. My foam is cut exactly 11mmX15. So if this doesn't work I'll try trimming it a mm at a time.

    As for teabags...any reason it must be the pyramid? I have some nice unbleached organic teabags but they are rectangles. Do you just roll them up or ???

    Thanks everyone!!! I was getting so frustrated and I just don't have the time or patience to sit and read through 1000's of posts! (hint to mods....we need a better search engine :) )
     
  12. lorikay13

    lorikay13 Supplier Associate ECF Veteran

    Dec 13, 2009
    Oregon
    Hey Karr...I should have just PM'd you to begin with :) But since I've seen other people with the same problems maybe this thread will help them too.

    Here's the breakdown:
    XL KR8 battery sealed/manual
    901/401 thread adapter
    401 atty

    Also have a Joye 510 PT (manual/inline battery) with 510/KR8 thread adapter AND then the 901/401 adapter to 401 atty
    oh yeah...PT plugged into AC powered usb adapter which is plugged into a surge suppressor/voltage conditioner
     
  13. Col. Gaunt

    Col. Gaunt Vaping Master Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Supporting member
    Aug 6, 2009
    Chicago, IL
    I just recently learned a method that works well for me with carts, but I cannot remember the name of it. But this is what it entails, so far I have only done it with a 801 cart.

    Take out the filler, cut off a piece that is 1/4 the size, fill the cart 3/4 of the way up with juice and put the 1/4 piece of filler back in so that it gets wet, then vape away like a bandit.

    I have been doing it this way for five days and have never got a mouthful of liquid, no leaks and tons of vapor.

    When you start getting less vapor and it drys out pull the cart out and you will find that the 1/4 piece of filler is all the way at the bottom of the cart. It works like a plunger action, as the fluid level lowers the piece of filler stays with it and constantly stays wet.

    If you try it please let me know if it worked for you and if you liked it.
     
  14. lorikay13

    lorikay13 Supplier Associate ECF Veteran

    Dec 13, 2009
    Oregon
    Sounds good but...the difference between an 801 and a 401 is like your big toe compared to your pinkie finger. And the filler is just this little wisp of threads. However...I am going to try it just for the heck of it and use a tiny piece of Fluval/blue foam instead of filler...and I'll let you know.
    I am also obcessing on the concept of the ZFM mod...but with this tiny little thing I just don't see it working...plus....the biggest difference in case you have never seen a 401....is that the atty is actually exposed...meaning the bridge itself protrudes part the cylinder that houses it...which is the exact opposite of an 801.

    The good news...thanks to all your advice I dug out my 801 adapter and atty and I think I finally got it!!!! Wet....wet....wet....that's the key! I think I'm happy! I never had any intention of smoking analogs but I really didn't want to have to give up the e-cigs. And I really needed to find something to replace the cartomizers for my hubby....truck driver...sit on butt and smoke and eat all day.....I'm lucky he agreed to the e-cigs! So once again...thank you to everyone who took the time to post and help me out. :)
     
  15. Col. Gaunt

    Col. Gaunt Vaping Master Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Supporting member
    Aug 6, 2009
    Chicago, IL

    Sorry, I am not familiar at all with the 401:oops:

    But that's great, an 801 will work wonderfully for you!

    Oh a truck driver? Well then, I have another piece of advice for you, you can get him a USB Cigarette Plug, it needs to be 1.5 to 2.0 amps in power
    like this

    Amazon.com: Belkin Dual USB Car Charger for iPod (Black): Electronics

    Then get him a 5v pass through and all he would have to do is plug the adapter into the cig lighter, plug the pass through into the plug and he can vape to his hearts content at 5v using the trucks electricity! You can also get usb adapters that will plug into a wall socket.
     
  16. Mammal

    Mammal Senior Member ECF Veteran

    Feb 25, 2010
    Connecticut, USA
    I'm going to put in a word for the 'buff puff'/Walgreens Facial Scrubber thing here, too. It's simple, cheap, requires basically no thought (make it look just like the polyfill but a fraction less dense and you're done), and was a massive improvement.

    I have yet to encounter a piece of blue foam in person, though.
     
  17. nomochokes

    nomochokes Senior Member ECF Veteran

    Mar 4, 2009
    USA
    I have tried a lot of different things and most worked ok but I started dripping exclusivley about 6 months ago and it's the only way to go in my opinion. Don't need to clean out the cart, mess with the filler, etc. Just drip and go.

    I use the 510 during the day and the 801 on my 5v PT at night. I drip 4 drops in the 510 and 6 drops in the 801. I usually wait about a minute or so to let the juice settle and I get between 10 to 12 good hits before I need to drip again. This works out to be about what I use to get on an anolog in the day.

    Everyone figures out what works best for them eventually and for me it's dripping all the way!
     
  18. joe555

    joe555 Senior Member ECF Veteran

    Mar 27, 2010
    europe
    how many drops does a 401 atty take (dripping)? and if i don't use it straight away, how fast does it evaporate?
     
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