Mech Mods and neww vapers?

[Coolsiggy]

I understand Ohms law and as I am new to vaping I have become somewhat concerned over the use of Mech mods. I have read that while some Mech mods have current limitation this is not uniform and that current through the battery is controlled by coil or mesh resistance using Ohms law.
Question, are Mech Mods available without current safety limits that have a 510 connector which permits the use of various Atty heads?

 

[Shawn Hoefer]

I understand Ohms law and as I am new to vaping I have become somewhat concerned over the use of Mech Mods. I have read that while some Mech Mods have current limitation this is not uniform and that current through the battery is controlled by coil or mesh resistance using Ohms law.
Question, are Mech Mods available without current safety limits that have a 510 connector which permits the use of various Atty heads?

If a mod has any kind of safety, it's not a truly a mech. A mech is a battery, a coil, and a switch. That is all. The power is derived by calculating the voltage (known from the battery... generally between 3.2 volts and 4.2 volts, not accounting for voltage drop across the mod/switch/atty). A mod with some sort of safety is considered unregulated. The new Fush is an unregulated (although some will call them semi-mech or half mechs).

The current limitation comes from the battery's rating. A Samsung 25R has a Continuous Drain Rating (CDR) or 20 Amps, an LG HG2 has a CDR of 20A, a Samsung 20S has a CDR of 30A, a Sony VTC5A has a CDR of 25A, and so on. Search for Battery Mooch here on ECF or on Facebook. He routinely tests batteries and produces charts showing recommended batteries and their CDR. The age of the battery in use can also play a factor because as a battery gets older, the CDR is reduced.

There are many mech mods with 510 connectors. A fine example is the Broadside. Another example is the Nato. Most older (as in 2014 vintage) mech mods came with 510 connectors. The "hybrid" top cap craze did not start until later on. Using a mod with a 510 does not mean that is is safer than a mod with a "hybrid" topcap. It only means that the center (pos) pin on the atty need not protrude as far as it is making contact with the 510 connector's center pin rather than the battery's positive terminal. Using a drop in coil tank on any mech can be dangerous as, without first testing every coil, there's no way of knowing if the coil is in good working order. It is generally preferable, then, to use a RBA/RDA/RTA/RDTA on a mech mod as it should have been tested on a deck or regulated mod to ensure that the resistance was in the correct range for the battery used in the mech, and that no shorts were present.

There are also fuses and regulators (kicks) and safety toppers that can be attached or installed into mech mods to make them something else. I used to have a Dovpo Vape Safe attachment that would display battery voltage when no atty was attached, and would display voltage again when an atomizer was attached, and would limit the vaping time and the resistance used by shutting down the device when the button was held too long or the resistance was too low... kind of like training wheels for mechs. The Dovpo model is long gone, but I saw a new version the other day on FastTech.

I'm sure there are others that can add to this line of thought...

ETA: I freely admit to not having memorized Ohm's Law. But I have a handy dandy calculator on my Android that I use religiously when building or installing prebuilt coils. For simple round wire builds, MicroCoil Pro (Swiss) is very simple to use and easy to understand. For more complex builds, VapeTool Pro is indispensible.

 

[Coolsiggy]

The current limitation comes from the battery's rating. A Samsung 25R has a Continuous Drain Rating (CDR) or 20 Amps, an LG HG2 has a CDR of 20A, a Samsung 20S has a CDR of 30A, a Sony VTC5A has a CDR of 25A, and so on. Search for Battery Mooch here on ECF or on Facebook. He routinely tests batteries and produces charts showing recommended batteries and their CDR. The age of the battery in use can also play a factor because as a battery gets older, the CDR is reduced.

This is a bit scary for me and your info has more or less confirmed what I have read else where. I suspect that it would be all to easy to switch or swap Attys around which could create a unsafe situation. New vapers should be extremely careful when using a true Mech as you have described. A Atty with a coil or mesh element of less then 0.2 ohms (at 4V nominal) will reach the max CDR of a 20amp rated battery very quickly and this would assume that they know the CDR rating of the batteries in the Mech let alone the Atty resistance.
I thinking now of all those cheap overrated batteries available on Ebay.

 

[Shawn Hoefer]

This is a bit scary for me and your info has more or less confirmed what I have read else where. I suspect that it would be all to easy to switch or swap Attys around which could create a unsafe situation. New vapers should be extremely careful when using a true Mech as you have described. A Atty with a coil or mesh element of less then 0.2 ohms (at 4V nominal) will reach the max CDR of a 20amp rated battery very quickly and this would assume that they know the CDR rating of the batteries in the Mech let alone the Atty resistance.
I thinking now of all those cheap overrated batteries available on Ebay.

The four rules of vaping with a mech:

1. Know your battery. Get authentic cells from reputable dealers. Ebay IS NOT a reputable dealer. Neither is Amazon. I use Ilumn or LiIonWholesale or IMRbatteries. Before selecting those authentic cells, compare them with Mooch's chart so you KNOW what battery your getting. An authentic Samsung 30Q (3000 mAh, 15 A) is great up to about 45 watts in a regulated device, but not so good in a mech with anything below a 0.28Ω build. A Samsung 20S (2000 mAh, 30 A) would be acceptable with a most any build north of 0.14Ω (but I would not personally build that low). This also means taking care of your batteries. Tears in the wrapper and missing insulators are a no no. Further, this means knowing how to transport your batteries. Tossing a live LiIon cell into your pocket with all your change and keys is also a no no. Always carry your batteries in a decent case or sleeve.
2. Know your ohm's law. As I said earlier you don't have to memorize it and carry a slide rule, pencil, and scrap paper. Get a calculator on your phone (or slap a sticker on the back of a regular calculator if you don't [gasp] have a smartphone).
3. Know your build. Different builds will ramp up differently depending on the mass and metal used. A 0.5Ω round wire KA1 build and a 0.5Ω SS316L alien are two VERY different beasts despite having the same resistance. This means you also need to check your build on a decent ohm meter or accurate regulated mod. This also means knowing your atty. Installing an RDA with a perfectly adequate build but no protruding center (pos) pin on a "hybrid" mech is bad. The atty should be inspected to endure that all the insulators are in good condition (not melted or missing), and that there are no burrs or wire scraps that could accidentally create a short.
4. Know your mod. Getting a quality mechanical mod with adequate venting and battery rattle adjustments is quite important. Knowing which way to install the battery is important. If there is a lock, know how to use the lock. Make sure that you inspect the mod just as closely as you do your build, atty, and batteries... any burrs of metal or wire scraps rattling around the interior can be just as bad there as they would be inside the atomizer.

I did not add "take care of your device by keeping it clean and un-dented" because I figured that's common sense. In this day and age, though, common sense ain't so common any more...

Yeah, it requires a bit of work and knowledge and care and for a lot of people, it's just not worth it. That's fine. I happen to like mechs and own about 60 of them which I use on a fairly regular basis interspersed with the use of my regulated devices. Once the info is known and the rules are followed, I do not feel afraid of my mechs...

I do still, on every build, hold the mech at arms length and hit the fire button the first time away from my pretty mug... just to be certain I didn't miss anything

 

[Falconeer]

Hello and thanks for starting an interesting thread.

Firstly in answer to you question - yes there are mech mods with 510 connectors which do enable the use of drop in tanks various. I have one - a Vaping Outlaws "Enforcer." It is heavy, well made, has vent holes done at the factory and comes with fused magnet as built in safety features. It can also be locked off when being carried.

I does come with it's own RDA which has a good protruding pin; that said I never build coils lower than 1.0 Ohms and only use single coils in a mech mod. Before using any coil in an RDA it is only sensible to check the Ohms before firing up, and I do ... always.

I do also run it with my Nautilus Mini and Triton Mini Tanks, all, of which have protruding pins and all of which run on 1.6 or 1.8 Ohm coils ( and yes I check them with a regulated mod before firing up too.

Most of the accidents which seem to have happened with mech mods appear to have involved the use of very low resistence coils, the use of substandard batteries, hybrid connections and possibly continuous overuse/abuse.

When I was a boy, in the countryside the narrow winding roads with bad visibilty on the bends used to have a sign before the curve which read "A little care..." and after the curve "...gets you there!"

I keep that in mind with mech mods but I don't get paranoid about using them.

 

[Coolsiggy]

I have been vaping only 5 months and my work was in electronics. I posted this on new members when I read about a recent mech problem. Vaping I assume is also a young persons fad...and knowing the young and partying ....well it is a bit scary. New vapers without good ohms understanding should leave the mechs to the more expeirenced vaper and use regulated mods.

 

[Burn_notice_fan_NY]

So you don't consider a REO a mech? Collapsing springs make a mod not a mech?

If a mod has any kind of safety, it's not a truly a mech. A mech is a battery, a coil, and a switch. That is all. The power is derived by calculating the voltage (known from the battery... generally between 3.2 volts and 4.2 volts, not accounting for voltage drop across the mod/switch/atty). A mod with some sort of safety is considered unregulated. The new Fush is an unregulated (although some will call them semi-mech or half mechs).

The current limitation comes from the battery's rating. A Samsung 25R has a Continuous Drain Rating (CDR) or 20 Amps, an LG HG2 has a CDR of 20A, a Samsung 20S has a CDR of 30A, a Sony VTC5A has a CDR of 25A, and so on. Search for Battery Mooch here on ECF or on Facebook. He routinely tests batteries and produces charts showing recommended batteries and their CDR. The age of the battery in use can also play a factor because as a battery gets older, the CDR is reduced.

There are many mech mods with 510 connectors. A fine example is the Broadside. Another example is the Nato. Most older (as in 2014 vintage) mech mods came with 510 connectors. The "hybrid" top cap craze did not start until later on. Using a mod with a 510 does not mean that is is safer than a mod with a "hybrid" topcap. It only means that the center (pos) pin on the atty need not protrude as far as it is making contact with the 510 connector's center pin rather than the battery's positive terminal. Using a drop in coil tank on any mech can be dangerous as, without first testing every coil, there's no way of knowing if the coil is in good working order. It is generally preferable, then, to use a RBA/RDA/RTA/RDTA on a mech mod as it should have been tested on a deck or regulated mod to ensure that the resistance was in the correct range for the battery used in the mech, and that no shorts were present.

There are also fuses and regulators (kicks) and safety toppers that can be attached or installed into mech mods to make them something else. I used to have a Dovpo Vape Safe attachment that would display battery voltage when no atty was attached, and would display voltage again when an atomizer was attached, and would limit the vaping time and the resistance used by shutting down the device when the button was held too long or the resistance was too low... kind of like training wheels for mechs. The Dovpo model is long gone, but I saw a new version the other day on FastTech.

I'm sure there are others that can add to this line of thought...

ETA: I freely admit to not having memorized Ohm's Law. But I have a handy dandy calculator on my Android that I use religiously when building or installing prebuilt coils. For simple round wire builds, MicroCoil Pro (Swiss) is very simple to use and easy to understand. For more complex builds, VapeTool Pro is indispensible.

 

[suprtrkr]

Hi and welcome to the board.

I'm late to the thread, but you're getting the straight word from @Shawn Hoefer

1) Yes, many mechs are available with 510 threaded connectors; most of them are
2) Yes, it's possible to use a drop-in coil tank on a mech
3) No, drop-in coils are not recommended for mech usage; use built coils, and test them before firing on a mech
4) if you have a faux-hybrid top cap on your mech, be very careful about the atomizer positive pin. If it doesn't stick out far enough, or if your battery's positive connector is dented, it's super easy to get a hard short at the positive pole. You don't want to go there. Believe.

Vape safe.

 

[bombastinator]

Question, are Mech Mods available without current safety limits that have a 510 connector which permits the use of various Atty heads?

Yes, though not at all commonly anymore. There are various safety features that can but are not always incorporated into mechanical mods.

The most common and basic safety feature is a non airtight battery case. Finding a currently sold mod without this feature is nearly impossible in the United States. Generally it has to be a device with a very old design that predates the introduction of newer more powerful battery chemistries. Such devices were reasonably safe when they were made. The complication is that the batteries they were designed for are no longer made. They are effectively antiques.

The addition of a mechanical fuse in the circuit is another safety feature. This one is common in box mods, mostly because it requires additional space.

There are also mechanical devices that actually have an electronic circuit board and multiple safety features.

Another option is drop in safety devices. There are many of these such as fuses, breakers, and other systems. They are generally designed for tube style mods and fit inside the battery case along with the battery. These are particularly useful for those rare antique mods.

 

[Shawn Hoefer]

So you don't consider a REO a mech? Collapsing springs make a mod not a mech?

No, the REO is a much. That is not circuitry. The Mech Pro from Geekvape has reverse battery protection, but it's still a mech because it's implemented, well, mechanically.

 

[greek mule]

Read this: Baditude's guide for your first mech mod

 

[Baditude]

Good advice given so far, especially the Baditude's guide for your first mech mod.

Here's another link useful for a new mech user. Explain it to the Vape Noob: Ohm's Law Calculations for a Mechanical Mod

 

[dom qp]

I don't know if anyone else has mentioned it, but I would check out Baditude's guide for your first mech mod.

 

[BrotherBob]

Question,

You have posted in the new members forum, you are limited to the number of post in this forum.
re: New Members - "How many posts do I need to..."
In the future, you might want to post in the ECF forum most closely representing your question. Your subject: Mehs, suggest posting in : Mech Mods
You may receive more knowledgeable/germane information (such as types etc...) from the membership in the above forum.

 

[Ben85]

Mech use doesn’t have to be complicated, or concerning, just respected and understood. In essence, a mech is simpler in use than most regulated mods as there are no settings to play around with.

Once the principles are understood, I personally see mechs being every bit as safe as regulated.

 

[stols001]

Yes,... Except for one thing. Vaping is a whole new "thing." It took me a while to learn to consistently turn off my mod (I guess in this case remove the battery?) and do all that junk consistently on a routine basis.

I am sure if you are super OCD/a fast learner, this may seem like a piece of cake. It wasn't for me, but I am neither of the above things.

Honestly I think it's probably fine for most vapers. But, I had a harder time with those "simple things" than learning Ohm's law, and Ohm's law took me a while.

It takes me time to develop "habits" I am just saying, is all.

Anna

 

[The_Professor_2019]

This is a strange thread to me, as going mech is going home.

We did not have mech as a choice... It was all there was. I remember when someone worked out that vent holes stopped mods from being Pipe-Mod.

In fact 'Vent holes" became a marketing thing rather than an accepted safety feature.

But sometimes a question arrises, or you want a bit of advice... Well that is what the forum is for.

You do not need to treat a mech mod any differently. But simple rules keep you safe.

Use a reputable supplier. Especially for batteries.
If you wonder "can I.......", Pop a post on the forum.
Look at the mod, some have mechanical locks for the switch. Some used to come with cases to prevent pressing the button.
There were also protective rings to go around the switches.

But the main point is a reputable supplier.

 

[Baditude]

Use a reputable supplier. Especially for batteries....But the main point is a reputable supplier.

You do not appear to have as many reputable battery suppliers in the UK compared to the US. Recommended by Battery Mooch:

North America
www.liionwholesale.com
www.imrbatteries.com
www.illumn.com
www.rtdvapor.com
www.batterybro.com
www.orbtronic.com
UK
myepack.co.uk
www.batteriesplus.co.uk
www.fogstar.co.uk
www.nkon.nl
Welcome to Ecolux. The UK's Battery and accessory specialists. Wide range of authentic leading brands in stock ready for immediate dispatch.

 

[DaveP]

Coolsiggy wrote:
I understand Ohms law and as I am new to vaping I have become somewhat concerned over the use of Mech Mods. I have read that while some Mech Mods have current limitation this is not uniform and that current through the battery is controlled by coil or mesh resistance using Ohms law.
Question, are Mech Mods available without current safety limits that have a 510 connector which permits the use of various Atty heads?

A mech mod won't the the best vape for anyone. It has no user protection. It was an upgrade from the early eGo and Joye 510 back in the early days of vaping because you could wind a coil and get a warmer vape compared to a factory coil.

Today, your best bet for a really good vape with safety is an electronic mod. Electronic mods have over-current shutdown electronics, but let you go up into higher wattage vapes without the danger that a short circuit will overheat the battery and cause a runaway condition.

Any electronic mod will allow you to safely wind your own coil or use any atty you want and still be protected from a short circuit or an over-current situation, even at high wattages.

 

[jandrew]

A mech mod won't the the best vape for anyone. It has no user protection. ...

Won't be the best vape for anyone? That's a rather blanket statement to make. Perhaps you meant, won't be the best vape for everyone? (but may be for some).

Any electronic mod will allow you to safely wind your own coil or use any atty you want and still be protected from a short circuit or an over-current situation, even at high wattages.

In the real world, safety critical features/devices are usually recommended to be tested/inspected/replaced at regular intervals (e.g., fire alarms, smoke detectors, CO detectors, safety harnesses, pressure relief valves, GFCIs, and so on).

So, I have to ask, in all honesty, do you regularly (or ever) test the safety features of your mods? Do you regularly test reverse polarity protection? Atomizer short protection? 10-second cutoff? Low voltage? Low ohm cutoff?