Moving to sub-ohm - recommended recipe change?

[Texass]

Ex-smoker (definite Mouth to Lung) looking to try out the sub-ohm tanks - just because. Been vaping almost 5 years now & have absolutely no interest in going back.

My problem is that I make my own juice & most need to steep. I'm pretty hooked on 4 or 5 of them & do a constant rotation throughout the day, although I do have my ADV.

My new ebay venture will be here in about a week & I'd like to get some flavors ready to test out the 0.25 ohm coil the tank comes with. Currently I'm using the Nautilus Mini w/ 1.6 ohm coils. Most of my flavors hover around 24%, 10% NIC with an 85/15 PG/VG mix. I'm thinking of cutting the NIC to around 2% and leaving the flavors as is.

Just curious what other folks did when they made the switch. To be honest I haven't done any research - this was my 1st thought for finding an answer.

I'm open to any & all suggestions,

 

[Letitia]

Ex-smoker (definite Mouth to Lung) looking to try out the sub-ohm tanks - just because. Been vaping almost 5 years now & have absolutely no interest in going back.

My problem is that I make my own juice & most need to steep. I'm pretty hooked on 4 or 5 of them & do a constant rotation throughout the day, although I do have my ADV.

My new ebay venture will be here in about a week & I'd like to get some flavors ready to test out the 0.25 ohm coil the tank comes with. Currently I'm using the Nautilus Mini w/ 1.6 ohm coils. Most of my flavors hover around 24%, 10% NIC with an 85/15 PG/VG mix. I'm thinking of cutting the NIC to around 2% and leaving the flavors as is.

Just curious what other folks did when they made the switch. To be honest I haven't done any research - this was my 1st thought for finding an answer.

I'm open to any & all suggestions,

Trial and error there with flavors. I would make 2 snv of the same recipe; one with the normal flavor % and one with 20% less flavor.

 

[PJReid]

You don't have to take the nic down that low unless it is just something you want to do. You could try 6mgs first and take it down if you need to do that after. I started sub ohm with 12mgs of nic and couldn't figure out why I was sick and dizzy. Try your juice with the flavor % as it is now, and then cut to taste. 24% is high for me, but it might not be for you. That is all a matter of taste.

 

[bombastinator]

6mg and 3 mg are common standard levels. People claim 18mg in mtl is about the same as 6mg DL, but personally I find it’s more like 10mg. Ymmv of course. You can add nicotine later to a steeped juice with little I’ll effect, so perhaps the 2mg wouldn’t hurt. You can just boost it later if needed.

 

[Texass]

Appreciate the replies.

I really don't know much about the differences as I haven't hit vape shops in years now. I've just seen a few mentions that anything above 6% NIC will give a burnt taste. Was thinking the 6% was probably higher than 18% MTL to give the burnt syndrome. And I haven't seen anything about the flavor %.

Thanks a bunch. I think I'll start off making some 10ml bottles with 3% Nic on a simple recipe. One full flavor & maybe 15 & 20% flavor. Like you said I can easily add a bit more NIC.

 

[Texass]

Well darn it, I just read the rules. I tried to edit the original post, but it's probably too old.

OK a quick & simple recipe that I call Danish Caravan:
4% Danish
4% Caramel (Original)
18% Vanilla Bean

All flavors are TFA

 

[bombastinator]

Appreciate the replies.

I really don't know much about the differences as I haven't hit vape shops in years now. I've just seen a few mentions that anything above 6% NIC will give a burnt taste. Was thinking the 6% was probably higher than 18% MTL to give the burnt syndrome. And I haven't seen anything about the flavor %.

Thanks a bunch. I think I'll start off making some 10ml bottles with 3% Nic on a simple recipe. One full flavor & maybe 15 & 20% flavor. Like you said I can easily add a bit more NIC.

It might be. You’re talking percentages, while I’m talking milligrams per milliliter

 

[ShamrockPat]

I still have my big Nautilus and Mini. Started like you with the 1.6 @12mg/ml nic. Moved on to the Triton and Triton2 with the sub ohm coils, dropped my nic to 10. I also DIY my own juice. Over a period of 2.5 years, I kept dropping my nic down by 2mg/ml each time (all sub ohm) while keeping the length of time for me to be 'nic satisfied' the same. I'm still @4, and from here on down I'll drop by 1mg/ml at a time.
I mix all my juices at 3mg/ml, as that's the wife's level. I increase by 1mg/ml for my regular setups, and much higher for my BB. I just got some nic salts and am planning to make them all nic free, so I'm free to nic for whatever atty/setup I use.

 

[ShamrockPat]

Most of my flavors hover around 24%, 10% NIC with an 85/15 PG/VG mix

So, at final mix, you're close to 50/50 ratio, not that there's anything wrong with that.

Personally, I've never used VBIC higher than 8%, but all our taste buds are different. In MY beginning, I followed the TFA thread, where High Intensity Mixing was promoted, causing me to bump into that +20% range, always. Now with steeping and other concentrates it's much lower, and some concentrates are both inherently strong and weak

 

[stols001]

You can certainly cut your nic and leave the flavoring alone, although keep in mind that VG is more of a cloud producer and PG is more of a flavor producer, so if you are changing your PG/VG ratio, that may change flavoring (to what degree, I'm unsure) but it may be something to consider as you flavor. It's equally possible that the difference may not be enough to really notice.

Best of luck,

Anna

 

[Texass]

Looks like I picked the right venue for answers.

I know I mix my flavors a bit strong. My wife has me drop hers down considerably.

I still have a couple of the original Nautilus tanks laying around. Went to the mini because the larger tank clogs up pretty quickly on some of my flavors - especially that Danish Caravan. Which is pretty weird since they us the same coils. I remember when the Evods first came out, I was putting tape over one of the holes because I thought it was way too airy of a hit.

 

[IDJoel]

It might be. You’re talking percentages, while I’m talking milligrams per milliliter

Hi @Texass; and welcome to ECF! Glad you chose to join the community!!

@bombastinator makes an important distinction (quoted above) that confuses some who are new to the forums.

When speaking of nicotine in percentages; it is "total nicotine (expressed as a percentage) to total volume." Pure nicotine is 1,000mg/mL. Therefore, if you are referring to an e-liquid that has 6% nicotine, you are speaking about an e-liquid with 60mg/mL ( 6% of 1,000mg/mL is 60mg/mL; and extremely potent!), and should not be confused with 6mg/mL.

If one is referring to anything less than 1,000mg/mL, it must be defined first, or the nicotine percentage has no clear meaning. This is why recipe calculators require a potency (mg/mL) for nic before a "percent to recipe" value can be given.

Because "mg/mL" always means the same thing... regardless of the starting nicotine concentrate potency; you will see most of us describe (and ECF staff encourages describing), nicotine content in terms of "mg/mL," and not percentage, to avoid confusion.

And since I seem to be in tutorial mode (sorry ):

Well darn it, I just read the rules. I tried to edit the original post, but it's probably too old.

There are two ways to make changes to your own posts. Both can be found near the bottom left corner of every one of your posts. Here is an example taken from one of my recent posts:

The first one (the "Edit" feature) does have fairly short availability (I am not sure how long ). But, if you see it, you can click on it and make any changes, deletions, or additions, to your existing text... save, and you are good to go. (Though we can't completely remove a post.)

Even when the Edit option dissapears; the second method (the "Report" feature) remains (indefinitely as far as I can tell). Clicking this option will bring up a dialog box (direct to staff) with which you can ask the ECF staff to make changes for you. This is especially useful, for making changes that we, as regular members can't do on our own... such as when I realize I have posted in the wrong forum. Instead of having to delete the text (I can't completely remove the thread), and retype everything in the correct forum; I simply "report" myself and ask staff to move the thread to the more appropriate one.
I hope that helps. And again; Welcome!

 

[Texass]

Thanks,

I'm not quite sure I got my head wrapped around the % vs mg/mL, but I think I get it.

I've always used a calculator that asks what % I want. This is for both the NIC & the flavorings. Now I do enter in what strength my bottle of nicotine mix is on the calculator (12mg, 36mg 48mg, etc.) I think this is what you are talking about or at least where the confusion can come into play.

 

[Letitia]

Thanks,

I'm not quite sure I got my head wrapped around the % vs mg/mL, but I think I get it.

I've always used a calculator that asks what % I want. This is for both the NIC & the flavorings. Now I do enter in what strength my bottle of nicotine mix is on the calculator (12mg, 36mg 48mg, etc.) I think this is what you are talking about or at least where the confusion can come into play.

For example: I use 100mg pg base nic, there is a line for that. I mix 8mg juice, there is a line for that. The calculator tells me how many mls of the 100mg I need for an 8mg juice. You aren't entering % for nic, just for flavors.

 

[Frenchfry1942]

A Nautilus Mini 1.6 to a sub-ohm .25, huh. You going to wear a parachute for that drop?...

Anyway, a bit of math and considerations, wish you luck.

 

[IDJoel]

I'm not quite sure I got my head wrapped around the % vs mg/mL, but I think I get it.

I've always used a calculator that asks what % I want. This is for both the NIC & the flavorings. Now I do enter in what strength my bottle of nicotine mix is on the calculator (12mg, 36mg 48mg, etc.) I think this is what you are talking about or at least where the confusion can come into play.

Yep; you basically have it... with one error (and where I think most of the confusion may be coming from):

I've always used a calculator that asks what % I want.

This is incorrect (I think?). Every calculator I have come across asks you what milligrams (per milliliter) nic you are using, and what milligrams (per milliliter) you want your finished recipe to be. Based on the information you plug in, the calculator tells you what percentage to use. Here are just a couple of popular calculator examples:
from ELR:

From ecigvape:

From JuiceCalculator (also similar to E-JuiceMeUp and JuiceGrinder):

Just like you have to tell your calculator what strength of nicotine concentrate you are wanting to use; you also need to define that same strength, if you are going to describe you recipes using nicotine percentages (like you did in your opening post:

Most of my flavors hover around 24%, 10% NIC with an 85/15 PG/VG mix.

)
With no additional information, nobody understands 10% of what nic concentration.

ECF is a global forum. It is not common practice here in the U.S., but elsewhere in the world, some manufactures state their nicotine as percent to volume. This is always referencing just the nic (pure, 100% uncut/undiluted nicotine; regardless of whatever nic base they use). In other words; 1,000mg/mL nic. So, if I see a bottle of U.K. nic base being listed as 7.2%, I know it has 72mg/mL. Or, a bottle of U.K. e-liquid labeled as 1.8% nic to volume, I understand it has 18mg/mL. I understand this because it is always based on 1,000mg/mL.

When you say "I usually vape 10% nic" we are reading that you are vaping 100mg/mL (and wondering how you are still alive!). Or when yo say "I've just seen a few mentions that anything above 6% NIC will give a burnt taste."; we are reading 60mg/mL... and wondering who, if anybody, has even tried vaping nic that high. If you said "I am vaping 10% of 100mg/mL nic base" (or 12mg/mL nic base, 36mg/mL nic base, 48mg/mL nic base, etc.); that would be much clearer. But that is a pain in the keister to write out. So, simplify it to describing nicotine content as "mg/mL." That way, regardless of what nic concentration you are using, we know exactly what you mean.

 

[bover907]

Very simple. by "6% nic", I'm sure the OP meant .6% nic. I have seen vape shops that sell their juices as % instead of mg/ml. 18mg/ml is the same as 1.8% nic. Most likely just a matter of a misplaced decimal point.

when I switch from MTL to Sub-ohm vaping, I had already stepped my mtl nic level from 18mg to 12mg, so when I got my first sub-ohm tank I went to 3mg/ml with no problem.

 

[ShamrockPat]

I'm not being argumentative at all, but just reinforcing the need for clarity as @IDJoel pointed out

by "6% nic", I'm sure the OP meant .6% nic

And then you have another well regarded Manufacturer, JUUL who describes their pods as 5% nic by weight. Like WHAT does that mean ? Sure, we all get it, right? MTL, fast acting, like a cigarette. Must be 50 mg/ml, why don't they just say that and follow the industry norm

If ya go hunt on their site, they actually reveal it's 59mg/ml. Who woulda thunk that , ... yet still in line value with the pod world.

 

[Texass]

Well who'd a thunk it? Yep my calculator does have mg for the NIC. All this time I thought it was %.

BTW I got my new tank & battery today. Made my mix at 3mg NIC & dropped the flavors 20%.

My parachute never deployed. Holy Mac this is WAY too strong. Luckily (I thought) I'd only filled the tank about 1/3 of the way. Topped it up with pure VG, but it's still too strong. I had to bump my other flavors in the minis up a couple of watts before I could even taste them after trying that.

Hopefully I'll recover!!!

 

[rjeatkrconley]

Did you recover??

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