Nicotine Concentration Accuracy

[AzPlumber]

In light of the recent discovery of inaccurate nicotine concentrations on unflavored nicotine liquid from a intermediate supplier, I would like to know if you have policies and procedures in place and what they are to insure that a listed nicotine concentration is accurate. We (wife and I) have bought your liquid and haven't noticed any issues although we still have a couple of unopened bottles.

Knowing your policies and procedures regarding nicotine concentration accuracy from a couple of months ago and any changes since would put our minds at ease that we are using the amount of nicotine we think we are.

Thank you in advance for any info you can provide.

 

[mauisun]

nothing has changed. we are far from an intermediate supplier and buy only from regulated industry. Rest at ease...

 

[AzPlumber]

Because you are far from an intermediate supplier and buy from a regulated industry, does that mean you are immune to buying PG or VG base with an inaccurate nicotine concentration? Does that mean mistakes are impossible within your facility?

Extremely dangerous levels of nicotine have been found in nicotine base sold by an intermediate supplier. I want to be comfortable in knowing that any place I buy liquid from has procedures in place that prevent dangerous liquid from leaving your facility.

 

[ab357]

The nicotine supplier you refer to has sent out an email saying he will refund all nic juice returned and he will temporarily suspend selling nic juice.

I'm sure all the vendors that used him as their nic supplier are returning unused nic juice and will purchase from suppliers that can stand behind their measurement procedures. Although FSUSA has stated they get their nic juice from this company in the past, I'm sure they have returned unused juice for a refund and have switched to a more reliable supplier IF they were still using this company for their nic juice.

I think most domestic juice makers were using this company so it is not a FSUSA specific problem and no one should imply differently. It has always been known that any company selling nic juice should be able to verify the accuracy of their product. I believe even this week, this supplier was still claiming his measurement methods were accurate. Someone apparently proved them wrong.

This issue can be the same with any nic company or even any juice supplier whether premixed or DIY. It's not some company or FSUSA that this question should be directed to, but all juice vendors.

Your comments or concerns should be posted in a general section instead of a vendor's section. All juice ingredients such as nic juice and Flavorant come from a relatively small number of source companies. Anything affecting one company actually effects many.

Not trying to be a fanboy. Just posting reality. Even if you DIY all your juice, you still have to buy your base, nic, and Flavorants from the same sources as the juice vendors.

 

[mauisun]

actually we never purchased from that company, personally I don't even know who they are.
We take our fluids seriously and have been inspected by all the regulatory agencies, who also did testing of our nicotine. Pamela and I have regularly done testing of random samples of our nic and have never had a problem. I understand anyone's concern over that issue for sure. I am a vaper too.
I concur with ab357 though.

 

[AzPlumber]

To ab357

My post was made here because I have liquid from this supplier. Posting in a general forum will not give me any answers on the liquid in my home. I will let the customers of the other suppliers seek their own answers.

This situation has raised serious concerns about the safety of the liquid we all use. For you to jump in and try to shield my questions with out intimate knowledge is a disservice to this supplier and its customers. If my questions seem harsh and to the point, so be it. Maybe questions like mine could have prevented all this in the first place, maybe not but I have a right to ask.

A end suppliers source is not my concern, only the product I buy. Knowing that a supplier has policies and procedures in place that would prevent a product with a dangerous level of nicotine from leaving its facility is the reason for my post.

According to the response this supplier feels their product is safe and accurate based on their random testing and testing done by an outside regulatory agent. As a customer it is up to me to decide if they are doing enough.

 

[BigJohnJ]

Maybe a proactive approch to this from a long time favorite supplier. I forsee a lot of consumers asking these same questions very soon.

 

[Elphaba13]

I think they already take a proactive approach. As David said, they test regularly. I don't have any concerns. Not many suppliers bother to do that. If they did, there wouldn't be the problems in the industry there are.

 

[BigJohnJ]

Elphaba13,
That was what I was implying. That they have taken a proactive approach to this. I remember a thread sometime back on something close to this same subject and David explained How test are performed on all product they sell. I believe it might have been an inspection that was done prior to opening the lounge.

Sorry if you took my comment above the wrong way.

John

 

[Elphaba13]

No probs BigJohn! I did take it the wrong way, and I apologise. We redheads - don't always think before posting. Ooops.

 

[BigJohnJ]

I understand I too am a redhead. no worries.

 

[Anaconda]

I've purchases my juices here for nearly a year. The main reason I keep coming back is because of the quality control, and how serious FSUSA takes their juices. I've never had a bottle of juice which has seemed off when it comes to nic levels, and I'm very proud to say that.

Good Job Team, keep it up. You set the bar a long time ago, let's see if the rest of the industry can do the same.

 

[vaporgalinfla]

Truly, I'm not concerned. I've been ordering from FSUSA for a long time and entirely trust the company. I'm not just saying this because I'm a supplier associate. Actually, I wouldn't be one of FSUSA's supplier associates if I didn't trust David, Pam, and employees.

 

[Elphaba13]

What she said. Her. The chick before me.

 

[ab357]

I'm afraid I may have added fuel to the fire. Chalk it up to being a former supplier associate. I "thought" David had indicated this was his nice supplier. I know a lot of DIYers are under the impression this is where he gets his nic juice which led to their decision to buy theirs from the supplier also. So I guess I and them have the wrong information. LOL

Wasn't trying to start a flame war with the OP. Accurate verification of the nic level is the single most potential dangerous aspect of vaping as it is lethal in high doses.

All of this is just one more incident that demonstrates why if the industry doesn't come up with universal verification quality control measures that are open, the FDA will take it as an excuse to step in we know what will happen then.

All vendors should realize they just can't say they have accurate inspection and QC measures in place, they have to prove it. Or they will become their own undoing. All it takes is one lawyer to step in covertly support by big tobacco and begin a class action suit regarding the safety procedures of juice vendors and the industry will go bankrupt. So a true proactive approach has to become common or vendors will commit slow suicide.

Even the vendors that show pics of their production facilities and equipment is a positive step. After all, the equipment used isn't proprietary. Showing good QC practices isn't company secrets. LOL

There are already third party vendors and nic, pg, vg, and flavorant companies sending out emails naming companies that are providing open documentation of their quality products, facilities and production procedures. By naming specific vendors, it implies those not named are not honest with the spin they are giving their customers. All companies have loyal customers that take vendors at their word. It will likely be one of those loyal customers that learn the hard way the hazards of nicotine poisoning, etc.

So I'm not just acting as a FSUSA fanboy. Everything I've written should be applied across they board. How ironic would it be for someone to survive decades of smoking only to be killed by an overdose of nicotine in juice labeled as 12 mg or something?

 

[Anaconda]

I agree with ab357, vendors do need to have QC, and tests must be done regularly to ensure that what's being sold is accurate.

Simply testing the unflavoured nic will ensure what's mixed is at the correct levels as long as the math is done right. We as consumers must know that this is being done, and from my understanding has been done with FSUSA juices.

David, correct me if I'm wrong.

It would be nice to know that a 3rd party is verifying the Nic levels, and had a list of companies who submit thier nic for testing regularly. I'm sure this is where the maket is going and has to go to stay open and Safe. Much like in England.

 

[ab357]

Looking around to check out different vendors' Black Friday sales I noticed something new with some.

They are starting to prominently listing who they buy their nic juice from.

I think that is a great way to reassure loyal customers. I bet if David listed his nic supplier on his home page, it would quash the rumors he gets it from the nic supplier that is at the center of the current mis calculation controversy.

It would be a win-win. It proves that FSUSA is committed to providing its customers accurate verifiable information. At the same time it will shut down those that are running campaigns saying David does use nic juice from that supplier.

So just list your nic supplier on your home page. It would be no different than how you proudly display you use FlavourArt flavorant.

Win-win just as many are about to decide who to buy their holiday juice from.


Sent from my ADR6400L using Tapatalk

 

[mauisun]

Pamela and I have always purchased from the best. and always will. We are the finest e-juices anywhere and we firmly stand behind our products we sell both on the internet and in our lounge. Thank you everyone for your support now and in the future. We have never purchased from any inferior suppliers and we never will. We are an osha inspected facility. Our PG/VG is certified kosher which very few can say. We sell only usda/fda approved ingredients, we have our nicotine tested before it arrives, and random test it after it arrives. OSHA has also inspected our ingredients, all of them. and we sell to our family and friends. We are probably the only, if one of the few, e-juice companies around with a walk-in vape lounge where customers can see us face to face. We are now opening 2 more lounges here and have plans for more around the country. We feel that speaks for itself. It's not about the money, it's about changing people's lives for the better. We will always be at the forefront of concerns about our customers, and will always be lightyears ahead of upcoming regulations which will someday be a huge part of this industry.
Those who spread rumors, innuendo and gossip are usually those who are more concerned about how their competition is killing their business. People always have some kind of agenda. We at FSUSA are used to that and we understand customers concerns behind it. We will never purchase, or sell, any product that would be harmful to a customer. We were the first to openly allow an OSHA inspection of our facilities. The whole idea of "take pics of your blending facilities to appease all of us" is frankly ludicrous. This is a proprietary business and always will be. Try our juices, you will love them as so many thousands do worldwide.
Thank you all for sticking with Pam and I and all of the FSUSA crew...