Overcharging Batteries

[orson]

With much of the recent discussions about the safety of batteries and potential problems with over-charging I thought I would post a link to a simple solution:

Plug your e-cig charger into a timer that you can set and forget. The one listed here is pre-set for 30min, 3 hour and 6 hour intervals.

An easy $8 solution for increased charging safety available on Amazon:

Amazon.com: Belkin Conserve Socket F7C009q Energy-Saving Outlet: Electronics

 

[Pav]

Pretty good idea. I always have my charger on a power strip to protect from surges too.

 

[zoiDman]

With much of the recent discussions about the safety of batteries and potential problems with over-charging I thought I would post a link to a simple solution:

Plug your e-cig charger into a timer that you can set and forget. The one listed here is pre-set for 30min, 3 hour and 6 hour intervals.

An easy $8 solution for increased charging safety available on Amazon:

Amazon.com: Belkin Conserve Socket F7C009q Energy-Saving Outlet: Electronics

Not a bad idea.

I saw they have others that can be set for different time lengths.

 

[orson]

Not a bad idea.

I saw they have others that can be set for different time lengths.

Post em up!

It's difficult to weed through all the programmable ones that come up on a google search.

 

[mwa102464]

It is a good Idea, I have 2 of these = Coralife Day-Night Timer with 8 Outlets - Free Shipping

these look better though = http://www.amazon.com/Belkin-CNS08-...DM/ref=sr_1_12?ie=UTF8&qid=1329780003&sr=8-12

 

[markfm]

Neat idea

Does anyone know if/how fast the battery will drain if sitting in a charger with the power cut off, or do they actually read as very high impedance? I can check tr001, ands have an xtar wp2 II on the way, no idea on other chargers.

 

[zoiDman]

Post em up!

It's difficult to weed through all the programmable ones that come up on a google search.

Actually, the more I looked, there isn't a lot of Countdown type Power Timers.

It would be nice to have one like the Old Kitchen Timers where you just spun the Dial to whatever you wanted time wise.

 

[markfm]

The jasco 15112 apparently has presets for 2, 4, 6, & 8 hours, only costs about $15.

 

[speedemon]

I've never had to worry with the trusfire tr001 when charged it goes in standbuy never had a overcharged battery or any other issue.

 

[orson]

It is a good Idea, I have 2 of these = Coralife Day-Night Timer with 8 Outlets - Free Shipping

these look better though = http://www.amazon.com/Belkin-CNS08-...DM/ref=sr_1_12?ie=UTF8&qid=1329780003&sr=8-12

Problem with both of those timers and most of the timers I saw online is they are pre-set/programmable types. Unless you charge your batts at the same time every day they wouldn't be very useful.

 

[orson]

The jasco 15112 apparently has presets for 2, 4, 6, & 8 hours, only costs about $15.

That one looks great, more selection of time settings, mechanical timer, and it has two plugs!

Found it on sale for $12.12

Bad Review though:

The fine print on the back of the box (that you will not see until it is delivered to you) includes: "Do not install or use this product for more than a 90 day period per year" Say wha'?
Note: It is a GE product, made in China.

 

[markfm]

I wouldn't sweat the 90 day note. Its design is as an outdoor unit, the base warning, in the manual, is that it isn't supposed to be a permanent device for outdoor timing. If you are doing long term/permanent outdoor use you should switch to an alternate.

 

[washvap]

You can also get yourself a smart charger like the WF-188 or Pila. They have plenty of safety features in them that prevent overcharging. Such as the trickle-charge feature that prevents the battery from discharging but, at the same time keeping them charged to their optimal levels.

 

[ITPython]

While this could limit how much overcharging is done, it it still far from a decent solution. As the time it takes to charge a battery is dependent on how low it's voltage has gotten, it's mAh capacity and the chargers mA charging rate. You may set it for the 6 hour time interval, but say the battery only needed to charge for 1 hour, then you would be overcharging and trickle charging it for 5 solid hours!


It might not be convenient, but the best thing you can do with a charger that has potential to overcharge li-ions is to keep an eye on it and pull the battery off as soon as you see that green light. Either that or buy a charger that has true charge termination once the battery is charged to 4.15/4.20v.

 

[ITPython]

You can also get yourself a smart charger like the WF-188 or Pila. They have plenty of safety features in them that prevent overcharging. Such as the trickle-charge feature that prevents the battery from discharging but, at the same time keeping them charged to their optimal levels.

OMG! Trickle charging li-ions is extremely bad! That is the main issue and why most chargers 'overcharge', its because they are slowly trickle charging the batteries voltage up, and li-ions will just keep taking that charge and can reach dangerously high voltage tolerances for the battery (especially unprotected ones). Then when you take the battery off the charger and use it... well, you end up like the guy in Florida.

Sure with a protected battery it should have a voltage cut-off of around 4.25v/4.30v due to the protection circuit, but constantly using the batteries own protection circuit to terminate the charge not only will reduce the batteries lifespan due to constantly going over 4.20v, but the protection circuit isn't absolute, and can fail.

Trickle charging is only deemed Ok if it is extremely low (like in the ~100uA range). But anything in the single, double or even (yikes) triple mA range is incredibly dangerous with li-ions!


Although maybe you were talking about the feature that starts charging the battery once it has dropped past a certain voltage after sitting in the charger for long periods of time (I think the Pila tops-off at something like 4.0v). If so then that is Ok, but constantly trickle charging a battery with current after it is full is a big no-no when it comes to li-ions. True charge termination should be valued above all when considering a li-ion charger.

 

[evosil98]

With much of the recent discussions about the safety of batteries and potential problems with over-charging I thought I would post a link to a simple solution:

Plug your e-cig charger into a timer that you can set and forget. The one listed here is pre-set for 30min, 3 hour and 6 hour intervals.

An easy $8 solution for increased charging safety available on Amazon:

Amazon.com: Belkin Conserve Socket F7C009q Energy-Saving Outlet: Electronics

Might get one. Just another level of safety. I have pila charger and constently keep an eye on the green light but just incase if I forget, this device would shut down after three hours. For 8 bucks, it's not a huge investment.

Thanks for the link. Never knew they exist.

 

[orson]

Well a lot of us aren't using mods and our batteries need to thread onto the factory charger that came with our batteries/starter kits.

A timer seems like a better solution than just leaving it plugged in, because there's no way I'm going to hover over my charging battery to pluck it off the moment it's done charging.

 

[ITPython]

Well a lot of us aren't using mods and our batteries need to thread onto the factory charger that came with our batteries/starter kits.

A timer seems like a better solution than just leaving it plugged in, because there's no way I'm going to hover over my charging battery to pluck it off the moment it's done charging.

Well sure, if your plan is to leave it constantly charging either way, the timer would be a better solution as it would actually stop it at some point. But it's still horribly unsafe in the grand scope of things, especially with those propitiatory chargers which no doubt are very low quality. It may be slightly inconvenient checking the battery every 15-30 minuets or so, but in return you get the peace of mind that the battery isn't going to explode in your face the first time you use it off a charge or blow up in the charger catching your house on fire.


In the end it's up to the individual to take the risk and whether or not to ignore that risk, all we can do is warn you of the potentials.

I am going to do some testing on my propitiatory 510 charger that I have laying around to see whether it does trickle charge or not, and at what mA rate. When I do this experiment I will post the information regarding it. For all I know it actually does stop charging when the light goes green, but when we don't know for sure it always best to assume the worst.

 

[Calypso53]

So....for a newbie, the question is to heed the warnings about NEVER using a different charger than the one that came with your kit.......OR the warnings about the fact that proprietary chargers are cheap and shouldn't be used. This is frustratingly confusing. I have several starter kits, as I'm still in the process of figuring out what I like best. All have their own charger. Should I stick with them or buy one of these "Pila" chargers everyone talks about, but then god forbid something goes wrong, I can be blamed for not using the proper kit charger..........see where I'm going with this?

 

[markfm]

The Pila and other chargers we talk about are for separate standalone cylindrical batteries. If you have a PV where the battery is built-in, like a standard Riva, eGo, KR808D-1, etc., then the Pila doesn't apply, you need to use the manufacturer chargers.

You can choose to use one of the lithium charging bags. Instead of sticking a Pila charger in it, you would stick the end of an extension cord, which is connected to a little USB power supply (wall wart), and your PV's specific charger, with the PV attached to it, into the bag.

Likewise, you could use one of the timers like we're talking about, if you want. I just picked up a new charger recently, all of my gear may now be charging in 3 hours or less. If this is true, one of those little Belkin timers is pretty attractive to me. A little 3-way tap attached to the Belkin, my chargers running off the tap (the Belkin is rated for plenty of capacity compared to the tiny loads our chargers place on it). Push the button and I'll be confident that power will stop in 3 hours, even if I forget to check on charge status.

None of these will magically ensure that a battery never has an issue, but they are providing a couple of easy to implement additional safety factors.

The Belkiin unit is $8 at Best Buy online. I picked up a second to use on my tool battery pack chargers in the basement, running a power strip