Pbusardo wants match for battery that reads, "26650 3.7V 60A L**M"?

[peraspera]

Phil Busardo took a photo of a piece of the battery that caused an explosion at vape Blast. He is trying to find out what battery it is. People seem to be sending him guesses willy-nilly so I was hoping that we might help him in narrowing things down to realistic possibilities.


I poked through Google for anything that might match and the only thing I could find that matched the wording is the Imren 3600 mAh 60 amp. To get an accurate graphic match I had to reduce the height of the lettering to 60%. Also, the color of the wrapper in Phil's photo is nearly totally washed out but bright orange for a new Imren battery. These inconsistencies could possibly be explained by the heat of the explosion and the chemicals released from the battery but closer matches would be most welcome.

If you have a 60 amp 26650 battery that matches Phil's photo could you please post a photo? Also, if you have a 60 amp 26650 that does not match and isn't on the reject list below could you post that information as well. Pictures and/or links would be helpful.

At this point all the 60 amp batteries I have found have been IMRs which are not supposed to explode when they go into thermal runaway. That means that the mod that exploded had insufficient venting, an IMR battery manufacturer is just joshing about their battery being IMR chemistry or there is some sort of 60 amp battery that I did not find that is not an IMR.

 

[roosterado]

Is there Any chance someone did this on purpose?

 

[Rossum]

At this point all the 60 amp batteries I have found have been IMRs which are not supposed to explode when they go into thermal runaway. That means that the mod that exploded had insufficient venting, an IMR battery manufacturer is just joshing about their battery being IMR chemistry or there is some sort of 60 amp battery that I did not find that is not an IMR.

Correct me if I'm wrong here, but aren't most batteries designed to vent from the positive end? And don't most tube mods have their vent hole(s) at the bottom? (I don't use tube mods -- the form factor never appealed to me). Now picture a battery in thermal runaway. It probably swells some before it starts to vent. This plugs the tube. It when it starts venting out of the top, the gasses cannot get past the swollen battery to the vent holes at the bottom. Now pressure builds in the top of the mod until something lets go. Thus the mod acts like a pipe bomb despite having vent holes and despite the battery not having "exploded".

 

[Rossum]

Is there Any chance someone did this on purpose?

Hanlon's razor

 

[DavidOck]

Sure. Stupid is on purpose.

Apparently the culprit modified the switch on his mech. And probably doesn't have a DMM, or doesn't know how to use it.

And apparently "knows" all about clouds, so doesn't need to do any research or homework on how to vape safely...

"The bystander in question was said to have had a modified switch on a Mutant Clone, which is a 26650 mechanical mod." from Vape Blast Event Turns Into Actual Blast | Ecig Advanced News

 

[peraspera]

Is there Any chance someone did this on purpose?

Absent hard evidence, one can't rule anything out completely. However, it seems highly unlikely given that the perpetrator would run a high risk of losing body parts.

Correct me if I'm wrong here, but aren't most batteries designed to vent from the positive end? And don't most tube mods have their vent hole(s) at the bottom? (I don't use tube mods -- the form factor never appealed to me). Now picture a battery in thermal runaway. It probably swells some before it starts to vent. This plugs the tube. It when it starts venting out of the top, the gasses cannot get past the swollen battery to the vent holes at the bottom. Now pressure builds in the top of the mod until something lets go. Thus the mod acts like a pipe bomb despite having vent holes and despite the battery not having "exploded".

Other than I've heard that batteries can sometimes, but rarely, vent at the bottom my understanding matches yours but I would defer to those who have experience with designing correct venting. I hope the people who are experts will focus their attention on the issue.

I used the phrase, "insufficient venting," because we don't have facts as to what type of venting the mod had, if any, and the unfortunate results do prove that the venting was insufficient.

 

[Baditude]

At this point all the 60 amp batteries I have found have been IMRs which are not supposed to explode when they go into thermal runaway. That means that the mod that exploded had insufficient venting, an IMR battery manufacturer is just joshing about their battery being IMR chemistry or there is some sort of 60 amp battery that I did not find that is not an IMR.

Below is an authentic AW 18490 IMR battery, considered to be one of the safest and better batteries on the market. Would you say it merely vented, or exploded? Imagine that in a metal tube mod. Probably wouldn't have mattered much if there was adequate venting in the mod or not. Any battery (or mod) has the potential to explode under the right circumstances.

 

[DavidOck]

The reports I've seen say he was using a Mutant Clone, and some quick searches show those with NO venting at all...

 

[Rossum]

I would not call that an explosion. It looks like all the solids are still there, in one (elongated) piece.

 

[Baditude]

I would not call that an explosion. It looks like all the solids are still there, in one (elongated) piece.

I respect that opinion. So you are saying unless the battery splits into hundreds of pieces it hasn't exploded?

Point is, what would happen if that had occured in a metal tube mod? It seems to me that the swollen battery contents could have easily blocked any vent holes in the mod.

 

[KurrptSenate]

I don't get how people know the switch was modified, yet cannot locate the person for specifics about the incident

just seems weird

 

[peraspera]

Sure. Stupid is on purpose.

Apparently the culprit modified the switch on his mech. And probably doesn't have a DMM, or doesn't know how to use it.

And apparently "knows" all about clouds, so doesn't need to do any research or homework on how to vape safely...

"The bystander in question was said to have had a modified switch on a Mutant Clone, which is a 26650 mechanical mod." from Vape Blast Event Turns Into Actual Blast | Ecig Advanced News

I would prefer to stick with what we know to be factual. Who saw the mod? Who saw the modified switch? Do the anonymous people reporting on the incident have a dog in the fight? I believe what Phil is reporting but I sure wouldn't bet the ranch on anything else I've read.

Also, I would not agree that it takes stupid for something like this to happen. I've read more than one comment from very intelligent people, keenly aware of battery safety, who have had mods fire in their pocket because they neglected to lock them in a moment of distraction.

Since the mod that exploded seems to be MIA along with its owner we don't even know if it might have been vented but just not well enough. Are we willing to bet our own body parts or those of others on believing we know what adequate ventilation really means?

 

[crxess]

Light a pile of gun powder and it sparks and pops. Load in a bullet and it kills.

Compression makes a huge difference in final results.

 

[Baditude]

Since the mod that exploded seems to be MIA along with its owner we don't even know if it might have been vented but just not well enough. Are we willing to bet our own body parts or those of others on believing we know what adequate ventilation really means?

Someone allegedly got this pic of what was left of the mod/battery before it mysteriously went MIA. Think you'd be able to tell if the switch was altered or if the mod was "adequately" vented from that mess? Where's CSI when you need them?

There Was a Vape Blast at Vape Blast

Unless the owner comes forth and spills his guts, we'll never know the answer to all of these questions. Considering the public ridicule he's already gotten, that's not likely to happen.

 

[Rule62]

The weird part about this whole thing is, everyone seems to know that he modded the switch. I read one post where someone went on to say that he had filed down the magnets. But nobody knows who the guy is? C'mon. Somebody knows. The guy didn't just appear and disappear out of nowhere.

 

[Rossum]

I respect that opinion. So you are saying unless the battery splits into hundreds of pieces it hasn't exploded?

Correct; it doesn't fit the definition of the word 'explosion'.

Point is, what would happen if that had occured in a metal tube mod? It seems to me that the swollen battery contents could have easily blocked any vent holes in the mod.

Agreed. And then the tube mod might explode. I'm glad that tube mods don't appeal to me.

Light a pile of gun powder and it sparks and pops. Load in a bullet and it kills.

Nah, you still need a barrel, which happens to be shaped like a tube. Without that, it's darn near impossible for any component of the cartridge to attain enough velocity to kill.

 

[Asbestos4004]

Rossum....did you, by any chance, ever work for Bill Clinton? Good lord.

 

[Rossum]

No, quite the opposite in fact. The meaning of the word "is" is quite clear, as is the meaning of the word "explosion".

 

[Asbestos4004]

Party at Rossums house! Parking will definitely not be an issue....

 

[JMarca]

At this point all the 60 amp batteries I have found have been IMRs which are not supposed to explode when they go into thermal runaway. That means that the mod that exploded had insufficient venting, an IMR battery manufacturer is just joshing about their battery being IMR chemistry or there is some sort of 60 amp battery that I did not find that is not an IMR.

This is completely incorrect, an IMR battery could explode and rip into small pieces if the housing the battery is in does not vent properly. This is why people call non-venting mods pipe bombs.