Question on battery safety

[jacqolive]

Hi Guys

I am new to the forum as well as vaping so go easy on me .

My wife and I have both been smoking a pack of 20 a day for more than 15 years, we have recently moved to New Zealand and the cost smoking is just crazy compared to back in Africa. Due to this as well as concerns for our health(sad that this is second) we have been trying to quit smoking. I have quit 3 times before but that only seems to last about 7-8 months then I start again, my wife has not been able to quit and starts to get grumpy about 2 hours after having her last smoke. We both feel that it is something we enjoy and we don't want to stop.

Last week we spoke about vaping and decided to buy a starter kit to try it out. We both felt that we will be able to stop smoking and start vaping and as time goes on we should be able to lower the nicotine intake until we are using 0mg, at that point we can decide if we want to stop vaping or not.

After buying the starter kit we went to another shop the next day and I bought an Innokin CLK! for myself and we got 2 Aspire K1 tanks to use as well as some other flavours to try out.

All was well and we enjoyed it until we started seeing the stuff on the internet about batteries exploding. Now I have done some reasearch and from my understanding there are 3 types of incidents where this happens.

1. While charging cheap vape pen/ego type batteries
2. Carrying/transporting 18650/18350 batteries incorrectly(lose) like in your pocket/bag with keys/change.
3. Using mechanical mods and building your own coils when you don't know what you are doing.

After seeing this we both got a bit scared. I am not sure if my wife battery is a cheap clone as I cant find a web site for the manufacturer(royale evod) and my Innokin came with just the battery(no packaging, charger, manual or verification code) so I am not even sure if it is real or clone. This makes me a bit scared to charge them incase they explode but I feel this can be overcome by buying new batteries.

My main concern is with the devices exploding during use, from my research these cases are only linked to mec hybrid mods but it is still scary when you look at those images and it is putting me of vaping.

So after all the rambling I guess my question is - Should I be concerned about this?

If I went and bought an Innokin cool fire 4/mvp3 pro/Innokincell Vaping Power System and stuck a isub tank with 0.5 or 2ohm coil on it, will I be safe. I understand that there is a change the electronics can fail just like it could on my iphone, but what are the chances of these listed devices causing injury to my wife or me?

Thanks for reading the long post.

 

[K_Tech]

So after all the rambling I guess my question is - Should I be concerned about this?

Personally, I don't like "no-name" kits, or those with internal batteries that don't come with their own charging setups. AFAIK, Ego-style vapes don't internally regulated their charging current (hopefully someone will be able to correct me if I'm wrong) and you really need to pay attention to how much current you're throwing into them. It's not uncommon to run across "wall wart" USB chargers capable of charging rates over 2 amps, and that sort of current could very well damage the e-cig.
That being said, check the chargers you already own - those with a maximum current rate of 500 mA (milliamps) or LESS should be perfectly safe to use. Don't charge them unattended (like overnight or leave them at home during the day), charge them on as fire-resistant a surface as you have, like on the kitchen or bathroom counter, and as far away from flammable materials as you can realistically accomplish in your home.
As to the questions you had about the Innokin products. Innokin is generally thought of as a responsible manufacturer with a good reputation. Many people here use and love their products. I've got an MVP 2 that's over two years old that still works (although I don't use it except to reminisce, lol).
I don't prefer devices with non-removable batteries simply because once the battery is at its end of life, the device has to go to the recycling bin and you need to buy another one rather than replace the battery. However, with a cycle life of 300+ charge/discharge cycles, a moderate vaper is probably looking at well over a year of use before needing to replace the device.

 

[jacqolive]

Thanks for the reply.

Personally, I don't like "no-name" kits, or those with internal batteries that don't come with their own charging setups.

This is what I keep reading about, that people are charging with chargers that was not supplied with the kit. The battery my wife has only came with a USB charger and my battery came with nothing(the guy at the store just said use like a phone charger). Besides ipad/iphone chargers we don't have any USB wall plugs so I was just going to use my macbook, but then realized that my macbook only has USB3(i think that is 5v 900mA). Thats when I started getting worried and looking into this.

Innokin is generally thought of as a responsible manufacturer with a good reputation.

That is the feeling that I get but they also only supply a USB cable. If I buy there kit can I just get a 5v 500mA USB wall plug and plug the USB cable into that?

I don't prefer devices with non-removable batteries simply because once the battery is at its end of life, the device has to go to the recycling bin and you need to buy another one rather than replace the battery. However, with a cycle life of 300+ charge/discharge cycles, a moderate vaper is probably looking at well over a year of use before needing to replace the device.

I understand the reasoning behind this but I dont mind having to replace the mod(perhaps after doing it I might change my mind ). My question would be is the internal battery in the cool fire 4/mvp3 pro as reliable as say a samsung/lg 18650? Should I be worried using the non replaceable mods due to questionable internal batteries?

 

[sofarsogood]

Priority one is to quit smoking, right? Minimize the variables in the beginning. Stay away from mechs for now (or forever as far as I'm concerned). A mod with a built in battery from one of the prominent manufacturers means you don't have to calculate Watts law to see if you've got the right battery and you don't have to worry about fake batteries, etc. I started a brother of mine vaping on Christmas day 2014 with an iStick 20 watt set to 8 watts and a Nautilus mini with 1.8 ohm coil heads. It took some months but he stopped smoking. Today the only thing that's changed is his power is set to 12 watts. You don't have to join the vaper's arms race.

All lithium ion batteries get nasty if they are abused, including the one in your phone. It's wise to charge most any batteries when you are nearby and able to intervene. Your chargers should be quality devices that deliver the correct voltage reliably. Batteries like being recharged slower rather than faster. Just the same they like being discharged at lower rates instead of higher rates. They like being discharged when they are near full charge instead of almost depleated.

Nearly all the injury accidents you read about are either mishandled mech mods or loose batteries with unprotected terminals.

If the money matters here's the prize. A carton a week cost me $3,000 a year in Michigan. A year supply of e liquid mixed at home cost me $30, which is 8 cents a day. One cigarette was costing me 30 cents.

 

[daviedog]

I charge my isticks with a Samsung Griffin fast charger. 2.1 amps. For over a year. I would not use a computer usb port as they are designed for data transfer not battery charging.(although they do!).
I would not use any generic pen device due to unknown build quality &possible failure..

 

[djsvapour]

Now I have done some reasearch and from my understanding there are 3 types of incidents where this happens.

1. While charging cheap vape pen/ego type batteries
2. Carrying/transporting 18650/18350 batteries incorrectly(lose) like in your pocket/bag with keys/change.
3. Using mechanical mods and building your own coils when you don't know what you are doing.

Welcome! That is good research. I can think of a couple more worrying things but those are 3 of the most important.

I'm going to work backwards on this,

3. Mechanical mods... yes, probably avoidable these days. I have some in the collection and/or spares for the future.
2. Just don't transport batteries unless in the suitable container/battery condom.
1. Cheap can be dangerous, but so can be the best makes on the market charging a basically safe battery in an unsafe way. The infamous exploding UK battery story (with y.t. video) was caused by a lady charging a good quality battery with a good quality charging usb cable. She was charging in an unsafe way.

I mostly use a 2.1amp quality (certified UK standard) dual usb wall adapter. It can charge a mod and a mobile at the same time. I wouldn't use it for a standard vape pen, for that I would put the usb cable into a 500mAh wall adapter.
I would only use it to charge an independent battery mod in emergency. My 18650s go into the Nitecore/Xtar charger and they are never left unattended.

- - -

My pet hate (in the UK) is people calling cables, chargers and wall adapters, chargers.
You cannot charge an e-cig with an apple charger and it's 'lightening' interface, you can only use the wall adapter and attach the relevant usb cable. I don't use apple wall adapters for anything other than apple. I do however use samsung, sony, motorola wall adapters for many applications. Again, I would not use a 1.35a Nokia/Windows wall adapter with an eGo cable/eGo pen. I would maybe use it with a mod, if I could sit with it.

The most infamous UK explosion was an iStick left overnight. That poor man has to live with the knowledge that he scarred himself by avoiding all the recommendations to not leave Li-ion batteries charging overnight. Things go wrong rarely but never unnecessary take risks.

 

[jacqolive]

Priority one is to quit smoking, right?

Thats correct.

Minimize the variables in the beginning. Stay away from mechs for now (or forever as far as I'm concerned).

I have absolutely no interest in ever using a mechanical mod.

Welcome! That is good research.

Thanks, its a problem I have I research things so much it annoying. I am in this case happy that I did take the time to educate myself.

3. Mechanical mods... yes, probably avoidable these days. I have some in the collection and/or spares for the future.

I don't have any intention of using a mechanical mod.

2. Just don't transport batteries unless in the suitable container/battery condom.

I am not intending(for now) to get a mod that uses replaceable batteries. I will most likely get the cool fire 4/mvp3 pro for my wife and my self. Is their any concerns with the batteries in these mods? Is there any precaution that needs to be taken when transporting/carrying these or can I treat them like a phone and just stick it in my pocket?

1. Cheap can be dangerous, but so can be the best makes on the market charging a basically safe battery in an unsafe way. The infamous exploding UK battery story (with y.t. video) was caused by a lady charging a good quality battery with a good quality charging usb cable. She was charging in an unsafe way.

I appreciate that it can still happen with a good make just like it can happen with my iPhone but I think I will feel better knowing its not a clone from a company that does not do any quality control at all.

I mostly use a 2.1amp quality (certified UK standard) dual usb wall adapter. It can charge a mod and a mobile at the same time. I wouldn't use it for a standard vape pen, for that I would put the usb cable into a 500mAh wall adapter.
I would only use it to charge an independent battery mod in emergency. My 18650s go into the Nitecore/Xtar charger and they are never left unattended.

After looking at the cool fire 4/mvp3 pro I noticed that they only have a USB cable, I assume the charge controller is in the mod. Their documentation states you can plug it into a PC USB port but I will rather get a 5v 500mA USB wall adapter.

 

[djsvapour]

After looking at the cool fire 4/mvp3 pro I noticed that they only have a USB cable, I assume the charge controller is in the mod. Their documentation states you can plug it into a PC USB port but I will rather get a 5v 500mA USB wall adapter.

Both the CF4 and MVP3 are renowned for safety and lack of malfunction (generally). I don't personally charge anything off a computer usb (agreed on that) but would happily use them with a 2amp wall adapter.
One of the CF4 Innokins is designed for 2a charging i.i.r.c. (maybe the 'plus' model?)

 

[djsvapour]

I appreciate that it can still happen with a good make just like it can happen with my iPhone but I think I will feel better knowing its not a clone from a company that does not do any quality control at all.

You are right. The top brands have made many mistakes and are a far more proactive.
Big firms (apple, samsung, sony) can't afford endless rumors or bad press.
It's early days for this tech (e-cigs) and Innokin are out front as far as I can tell.

 

[suprtrkr]

Hi and welcome. You're research is correct, but you've already made the first step. Battery trouble usually results from operator error, and you are aware of the problem and watching out. Innokin is a fine brand name, and I feel sure their Distuptor mod with the innokin Cell, or either of the Cool Fire mods, would serve you well and be quite safe. They are all good gear and I recommend them all the time. That said, for best possible safety, I prefer round cell IMR batteries to LiPos as they are slightly more stable. I don't want to frighten you about LiPos; there are tens of millions of them in service and very few of them ever go south. But IMRs are a bit better.

I'm not certain what would be available to you in NZ, but do look at a Kanger Topbox or Subox kit. They will make 60-75 watts, depending on which one, and this is plenty for most vapers. They are also bundled with the Toptank or Subtank; a solid piece of gear, if not completely top drawer, and best of all they have a wide variety of coils commonly available, easing the supply situation, and allowing a new vaper to try various values to determine what they like best. Another good choice in a removable battery mod would be an Evic VTC, but the bundled tank is not as well thought of as the Kanger part.

Moving to a subohm tank from a K1 will be an adjustment. You'll be getting a lot more vapor, and will probably have to cut your nic level.

 

[USMCotaku]

Thanks for the reply.



This is what I keep reading about, that people are charging with chargers that was not supplied with the kit. The battery my wife has only came with a USB charger and my battery came with nothing(the guy at the store just said use like a phone charger). Besides ipad/iphone chargers we don't have any USB wall plugs so I was just going to use my macbook, but then realized that my macbook only has USB3(i think that is 5v 900mA). Thats when I started getting worried and looking into this.



That is the feeling that I get but they also only supply a USB cable. If I buy there kit can I just get a 5v 500mA USB wall plug and plug the USB cable into that?



I understand the reasoning behind this but I dont mind having to replace the mod(perhaps after doing it I might change my mind ). My question would be is the internal battery in the cool fire 4/mvp3 pro as reliable as say a samsung/lg 18650? Should I be worried using the non replaceable mods due to questionable internal batteries?

The innokin mods, and other box mod types, that only supply a usb cable...they regulate the input current, only drawing what they need, so it only matters that your "wall wart" can supply ENOUGH mAh (if not, it will just charge slower, so no real harm), but don't worry about using an adaptor that supplies too much current...the mod won't use it.
So, assuming your innokin mod is authentic (I have yet to see a cloned innokin on the market), that one will be fine to charge off of your mac....but for your wifes ego pen, deffinately use the adapter that came with it.

 

[sofarsogood]

I believe onboard charging circuits rely on the wall charger to be operating at the correct voltage, too high is not good. I'm phasing out my inexpensive no name USB chargers in favor of an Amazon brand called Anker which I believe, hope, are made to higher standards and maintain correct voltage. Others may have more experience with this. I hope they chime in.

 

[jacqolive]

Both the CF4 and MVP3 are renowned for safety and lack of malfunction (generally).

That is good to know, I have read about some malfunctions where they won't fire but no serious issues.

Moving to a subohm tank from a K1 will be an adjustment. You'll be getting a lot more vapor, and will probably have to cut your nic level.

I will most likely keep using the K1, the CF4 and MVP3 come with an ego adapter is this a good idea?, or get a isub and use a 2.0ohm coil to start with before moving to the 0.5omh coils.

So, assuming your innokin mod is authentic (I have yet to see a cloned innokin on the market), that one will be fine to charge off of your mac....but for your wifes ego pen, deffinately use the adapter that came with it.

I did contact Innokin regarding this and they seem to have confirmed that the itaste CLK! that I bought is either a clone or a refurb as they don't sell any products without proper packaging and manuals.

 

[suprtrkr]

I will most likely keep using the K1, the CF4 and MVP3 come with an ego adapter is this a good idea?, or get a isub and use a 2.0ohm coil to start with before moving to the 0.5omh coils.

Nothing wrong with that at all, the MVP is good gear and quite safe. You're also right about the CLK. Innokin products are sold in packaging with a verification code. There is no need to make the jump to subohm at all, unless you just want to try it. Probably more than half of all vapers prefer high value coils and low watts; you may easily be among them. Nothing wrong with that at all. If it's keeping you off the sticks, you're doing it right. I only wanted to warn you, in case you decided to try, subohm is much more powerful than what you are used to.

There's also nothing wrong with the K1s but, IMHO, better +ohm tanks are now available. Take a look at the Nautilus, also made by Adpire like your K1s, or an eLeaf GS Air tank. I think both offer a better vape experience than the K1 in the low watt regimen. It's highly individual, though. The one you like is the one you need.

 

[djsvapour]

I did contact Innokin regarding this and they seem to have confirmed that the itaste CLK! that I bought is either a clone or a refurb as they don't sell any products without proper packaging and manuals.

Not strictly the case. Non-official sources remove manuals all the time.
Innokin do not turn down the offer to sell a few thousand units to a 3rd party.
You have to understand the China way. All the major brands want to protect their prices and reputation but not shoot themselves in the foot making sales.
Joyetech sold millions (I mean millions) of products to vendors and then stabbed them in the back by calling them 'copycat' sellers to increase the perceived 'value' on their products. I once saw a box with 500 Kanger products in with all the manuals removed. They had come from Kanger, but Kanger didn't want to a) stand behind the warranty or b) be associated with a vendor that was underselling more 'official' Kanger outlets on domestic markets.
In fact, there is nothing official about most of the 'official' dealers in domestic markets, they are just the ones prepared to pay the highest wholesale price in return for then charging more and making out they are superior.
It's a truly mad world, but it all fits together in time, if it interests you (as it does me).

- - -

A shop in the UK told a 50 year old woman friend of mine that Eleaf products were made in the USA and that anything from China was fake. On this basis, they wanted to charge her $50 for an iStick. I could get the iStick for her for $28. I bought it, and 3 weeks later she refused to take it, saying she was going back to the shop and I was scamming her. (I was letting her have it for the $28.)
We checked the code and it came good.
I gave her the iStick and we put the $28 in an envelope which I kept for 6 months and one day if something went wrong.
She still has it. I am wearing a nice $28 shirt I bought.

 

[jacqolive]

There's also nothing wrong with the K1s but, IMHO, better +ohm tanks are now available. Take a look at the Nautilus, also made by Adpire like your K1s, or an eLeaf GS Air tank. I think both offer a better vape experience than the K1 in the low watt regimen. It's highly individual, though. The one you like is the one you need.

I have looked at the Nautilus and might get one of those, the reason I also like the isub tanks is that they have both 0.5ohm and 2.0ohm coils so I can use the 2.0 for now but use the same tank to try sub ohm to see if I like it. At this point I have spent a lot of money on the gear that I have so unless I can get the shop to refund me on the bases that the CLK! is a clone I will only buy new batteries now and look at tanks when I get paid next week again.

 

[jacqolive]

Not strictly the case. Non-official sources remove manuals all the time.
Innokin do not turn down the offer to sell a few thousand units to a 3rd party.
You have to understand the China way. All the major brands want to protect their prices and reputation but not shoot themselves in the foot making sales.
Joyetech sold millions (I mean millions) of products to vendors and then stabbed them in the back by calling them 'copycat' sellers to increase the perceived 'value' on their products. I once saw a box with 500 Kanger products in with all the manuals removed. They had come from Kanger, but Kanger didn't want to a) stand behind the warranty or b) be associated with a vendor that was underselling more 'official' Kanger outlets on domestic markets.
In fact, there is nothing official about most of the 'official' dealers in domestic markets, they are just the ones prepared to pay the highest wholesale price in return for then charging more and making out they are superior.
It's a truly mad world, but it all fits together in time, if it interests you (as it does me).

- - -

A shop in the UK told a 50 year old woman friend of mine that Eleaf products were made in the USA and that anything from China was fake. On this basis, they wanted to charge her $50 for an iStick. I could get the iStick for her for $28. I bought it, and 3 weeks later she refused to take it, saying she was going back to the shop and I was scamming her. (I was letting her have it for the $28.)
We checked the code and it came good.
I gave her the iStick and we put the $28 in an envelope which I kept for 6 months and one day if something went wrong.
She still has it. I am wearing a nice $28 shirt I bought.

Yeah I do realise things like this happens but what concerns me is that the CLK! I bought was just a loose battery with no box, manual, verification code or anything else, so there is no way for me to be certain. I would rather not take the risk. At the end of the day if the shop won't refund me I will just take the loss and use this as a lesson learnt. I was at the shop today to talk to them about it and saw that they do have clones on the display shelfs for both kanger and aspire.

 

[suprtrkr]

Sound plan. You're moving forward. That iSub is a good tank, and I agree the coil variety can help you determine just how you want to vape. That's a wise decision. If funding is an issue, let me suggest, down the road, you consider rebuildable tanks and DIY juice. I don't recommend this for new vapers, and I caution you both have a learning curve. But both are also much cheaper than buying coils and juice once you learn how. Do, though, get firmly on your feet with vaping before you try something more difficult. You're making progress, and you want to build on it. Good luck, and let us know how you get on.

I have looked at the Nautilus and might get one of those, the reason I also like the isub tanks is that they have both 0.5ohm and 2.0ohm coils so I can use the 2.0 for now but use the same tank to try sub ohm to see if I like it. At this point I have spent a lot of money on the gear that I have so unless I can get the shop to refund me on the bases that the CLK! is a clone I will only buy new batteries now and look at tanks when I get paid next week again.

 

[daviedog]

Nothing more to add, kudos to the above posts.
PS turn your mod off when put in pockets & purses..

 

[BrotherBob]

Welcome and glad you joined.
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