Recent confrontation in a parking lot

[danfinger]

We all write to our representatives too. The ANTZ dont need ammunition to bit*h and moan they are going to do it anyway regardless of if they see us vaping or not. People have a choice to walk through vapor and make a fuss, or avoid it.

The numbers are not on our side friend. If Joe GeneralPublic is out with his wife and kids and sees some guy across the restaurant just eating his dinner, the odds that he's going to write is rep and get his ANTZ on is pretty low.

Now take that same Mr. GeneralPublic and he sees some dude at that restaurant hitting his PV and breathing into his shirt- I can guarantee the odds that he's going to get his keyboard out when he gets home have just gone up by a lot.

My point is this whole 'stealth' vaping thing is not doing us any favors. Nothing to do with OP, who since he was outdoors was totally within his right.

Theaters? Stores? Restaurants?!? Whether you *think* anyone notices or not. You are not helping.

 

[Anjaffm]

That would be my response exactly -- "blow it out your ___!" Which was also my response to being assaulted about my smoking in public. I may have changed my desired nic-delivery tool, but my attitude to confrontational asshats hasn't changed one iota.

Bingo!

And I do wonder why some people consider it rude to take a drag off your PV in public while going about your business - but they do not consider it rude to accost and insult strangers.

Thankfully, in my country, the second behavior is considered rude and completely unacceptable. Only people who are very drunk and .. misbehaving .. teenagers ever engage in such rude, antisocial behavior.

I am completely shocked that I have now read of such behavior repeatedly. And my mother - a 83-year-old lady who grew up in the Baltic states - would be absolutely horrified. There are things in our culture that are simply not done.

No offense intended, but I have no idea why people in the US engage in such rude, antisocial behavior. And yes, of course no decent person is obliged to tolerate such horrible rudeness. Not for a moment.

 

[AndriaD]

Bingo!

And I do wonder why some people consider it rude to take a drag off your PV in public while going about your business - but they do not consider it rude to accost and insult strangers.

Thankfully, in my country, the second behavior is considered rude and completely unacceptable. Only people who are very drunk and .. misbehaving .. teenagers ever engage in such rude, antisocial behavior.

I am completely shocked that I have now read of such behavior repeatedly. And my mother - a 83-year-old lady who grew up in the Baltic states - would be absolutely horrified. There are things in our culture that are simply not done.

No offense intended, but I have no idea why people in the US engage in such rude, antisocial behavior. And yes, of course no decent person is obliged to tolerate such horrible rudeness. Not for a moment.

I completely agree; the other day we were in a store where a woman was just TERRORIZING her son, maybe 8 or 9 yrs old, with the "DID I HEAR A YES MA'AM???" malarkey, and I just shook my head as I walked by them, because COERCION is NOT the way to get your kids to respect you -- but I wouldn't have dreamed of actually SAYING THAT to the stupid woman, that would just be rude. But I bet she'd be one of the first ones to get in someone's face about THEIR behavior, considering how she was treating HER OWN CHILD!

Andria

 

[wv2win]

I don't see it happening, I've heard and in 2 cases seen disputes over vaping on private property but in a public parking lot out in the open?

Only thing I can think of is either you were stealth vaping inside the restaurant then came outside and was confronted there, or you just made this up to get attention.

I just don't see anyone coming up to someone in a parking lot for no reason and harass them in an open area (especially a parking lot), too much to lose, it's dangerous.

Wow, a guy tells us what happened to him and all you can do is call him a liar. And this from one of the "act like vaping is smoking" crowd.

 

[wv2win]

My encounters are usually positive, but then I am told that I am intimidating. Don't get that all all as I am kinda a big dork.

Sorry you had to deal with aggro, lots of weird press out there lately that may be driving it. I keep CASAA.org cards on me and pass them out when the questions get hostel and talk about how it really saved my life. If anything I have more converts then aggro.

Good suggestion. I also always have CASAA cards on me for both vapers and non-vapers. Unfortunately, we can't even get some vapers on ECF to support CASAA.

 

[wv2win]

But then:



At your table in a restaurant? In a store? I'm curious how you rationalize this activity as being 'respectful'?

While those sales people may not have lambasted you, what impression do you think they come away with after witnessing you doing this? Do you think they see someone who is being respectful?

I think we need to be mindful at this stage of the game in managing people's perceptions of vaping. Stealth vaping anywhere smoking is not permitted will only hinder our cause. Let's remind ourselves that we're vaping because it is better for us, NOT because we can 'Get away with it' in places where we couldnt' smoke.

That is your "opinion" which many vapers do not agree with. Many of us have the exact opposite experience when vaping respectfully most places. We have gotten many positive remarks, especially about the difference between smoking and vaping and how many were glad to get a first hand experience and better understand the difference.

And there is no evidence that how anyone has vaped has anything to do with proposed vaping bans. Your posting that it hinders the cause and never supporting that statement with evidence, does not make it true.

But I have talked to a number of people who have told me that when they see people vaping with smokers, they assumed it was just another way to smoke and just as bad for them and everyone around them.

That is the perception that acting like vaping and smoking are the same thing, leads to.

 

[AndriaD]

Bingo!

And I do wonder why some people consider it rude to take a drag off your PV in public while going about your business - but they do not consider it rude to accost and insult strangers.

Thankfully, in my country, the second behavior is considered rude and completely unacceptable. Only people who are very drunk and .. misbehaving .. teenagers ever engage in such rude, antisocial behavior.

I am completely shocked that I have now read of such behavior repeatedly. And my mother - a 83-year-old lady who grew up in the Baltic states - would be absolutely horrified. There are things in our culture that are simply not done.

No offense intended, but I have no idea why people in the US engage in such rude, antisocial behavior. And yes, of course no decent person is obliged to tolerate such horrible rudeness. Not for a moment.

I meant to add -- you might find it more tolerable in the southern US states; there is still at least a modicum of courtesy and gracious behavior -- unless you happen upon some drunk good-ol-boys, and then all bets are off. I noticed this particularly in Charleston, SC; I'm from Atlanta, born and raised here, so I'm used to "southern niceness" but they've got it all over Atlanta, in Charleston. Even the fast-food workers smiled and welcomed you and nothing was too much trouble. Just the most incredibly pleasant, welcoming manners.

Andria

 

[Zealous]

>I've never seen anyone vape and then had no vapor coming out of their mouth. Not once (unless their battery was dead or something). If they're taking a puff which is so lean on vapor, why bother? At a table in a restaurant? Come on! Show some self control and wait. You won't die if you can't vape for 2 hours for frelling out loud.

>Those people who have weird issues DO deal with it. They write their representatives, they talk others into writing their reps. The join ANTZ groups. And that is exactly why we DO need to be concerned... and respectful.

Stealth vaping is not 100% stealth 100% of the time. We don't need to give those who oppose vaping any ammunition.

Well....respectfully....I will not be vaping the way you think I should. I will use my own common sense to determine what is respectful to those around me & what is not. And if I want to have a puff off my pv at the pizza place I will do that & if the tiniest bit of vapor comes out I will deal with whatever repercussions might come with that.

The thing is, if I do not vape just because I'm scared of being the cause of us vapers losing our "rights" then I don't deserve to have those rights anyway. If I choose to forfeit my opportunity to use my own best judgement in when & how & where I should vape then someone else will do it for me. That's not ok with me.

 

[CMD-Ky]

You don't understand? I have read some posts in this thread that this confrontation situation is a new vaper problem probably of their own creation. This could not possibly be the problem of a control freak who has to be confrontational and who just passed their assertiveness training class, it is the vaper's problem. Like you, I am confused but not by the buffoons who are offended by open air vaping in a parking lot [these probably hate movie popcorn and ban it]; I am confused by members of this forum who easily find fault with the vaper.

I can understand someone having a problem if you were vaping in a restaurant or even in a bar .... But in a PARKING LOT OUTSIDE ? ? ?

How the heck would vaping outside in a parking lot offend anyone ? ?

Confused ...

 

[CMD-Ky]

Can't educate the fools, vape on silently without a response. Drives the fools crazy.

And some do, and others could not care less. It almost sounds like you're suggesting that if anyone doesn't want to be around something then no one should do it. Not a bad idea. Let's extend it a bit. Some folks don't want to be around stupid people, so the stupid people should stay home.

But back to the original topic, I would welcome such a confrontation as the OP had. A chance to educate.

 

[zoiDman]

That is your "opinion" which many vapers do not agree with. Many of us have the exact opposite experience when vaping respectfully most places. We have gotten many positive remarks, especially about the difference between smoking and vaping and how many were glad to get a first hand experience and better understand the difference.

And there is no evidence that how anyone has vaped has anything to do with proposed vaping bans. Your posting that it hinders the cause and never supporting that statement with evidence, does not make it true.

But I have talked to a number of people who have told me that when they see people vaping with smokers, they assumed it was just another way to smoke and just as bad for them and everyone around them.

That is the perception that acting like vaping and smoking are the same thing, leads to.

I noticed you Never Replied to this Post.

I have an MN lawmaker as a regular customer, showed him this post, and all he said was "If most people did this, I doubt vaping would come up in our legislation in such a bad manner as it has." I would poke so far as to say that, yes, that statement from a lawmaker does prove, at least in this guys case, that how we treat them DOES effect how lawmakers look at us.

It seems many of you are a little irked that I am treating this as Vaping = Smoking. Im not. At all. I vape like no other in walmart, but I also don't do it at high noon while the store is packed. I get pretty ballsy with where I vape sometimes, but things like restaurants where people are eating and places with high concentrations of children are just not cool with me personally. I've lost my appetite because of other vapers in perkins before, and that SUCKS to be nicked by one of your own brethren.

I'll rewrite the whole thing in first person if you really truly want, but it won't change much of anything. I write in second person all the time for the simple fact that it's easy to write like I am talking to myself or someone else. I'm not attempting to tell you what to do, it just tends to be easier for myself to write and others to understand like that. Apparently, it also has the added perk of starting one helluva interesting flame war. The internet would be SO BORING if people didn't get upset with other people's views.

I'm thinking this is the last time I pipe up on this thread. Mod's, close 'er down if you like. I said my bit, got my little rant off my chest, and even found a couple in agreement. I thank you ALL for everything you've put in to it, and I even would personally like to think @Jman08 and @wv2win for the interesting time. Maybe you guys can PM me or vice versa and we can work out our view differences there. Peace all, I'll be in other sections

 

[CMD-Ky]

We have a self-centered society in the good old USA. If one is offended then it is their right to shut down the offending behavior. Here you best not say, "Merry Christmas". You will offend someone and be subject to ostracism.

Bingo!

And I do wonder why some people consider it rude to take a drag off your PV in public while going about your business - but they do not consider it rude to accost and insult strangers.

Thankfully, in my country, the second behavior is considered rude and completely unacceptable. Only people who are very drunk and .. misbehaving .. teenagers ever engage in such rude, antisocial behavior.

I am completely shocked that I have now read of such behavior repeatedly. And my mother - a 83-year-old lady who grew up in the Baltic states - would be absolutely horrified. There are things in our culture that are simply not done.

No offense intended, but I have no idea why people in the US engage in such rude, antisocial behavior. And yes, of course no decent person is obliged to tolerate such horrible rudeness. Not for a moment.

 

[Chelonian]

Strange how so many confrontational events always seem to happen to newer members of the forum.

It wad a confrontation that brought me to this website. I was looking for health information on vaping and ECF popped up.
It could've easily triggered my first post

Sent from my SCH-S720C using Tapatalk 2

 

[amolson]

I meant to add -- you might find it more tolerable in the southern US states; there is still at least a modicum of courtesy and gracious behavior -- unless you happen upon some drunk good-ol-boys, and then all bets are off.

Andria

Even in Maryland, which is barely the south. You just don't do certain things, not because of laws, but because it isn't done. Took me a while to get the hang of it, but now it's one of the things I miss. Very small rural towns tend to end up polite as well. The rude buggers get shunned and generally leave pretty quickly. And if you must say something derogatory, you dress it up. "She's such a nice person." for example, translates to "She's such a total @*&^ I can't come up with a single good thing to say about anything she's ever done."

It's like I wouldn't vape in a good restaurant, not because of the ANTZ, fear of repercussions or setting off someone's visual allergies*, but because it would be rude to the chef to be doing something else with my olfactory senses than appreciating his or her work.

*visual allergies are those things that offend people only if they look. Wearing plaid and prints together, holding hands with someone of the wrong race, age or gender, wearing size 22 hot pants, florescent Crocks and high water pants, etc.

 

[wheelie]

I got the same who cares attitude as I have with my hunting club. Don't give a darn what people do or think of me. I have supplies to last me years no matter what happens. I keep my mouth shut and laugh and walk away. We need jerks in this world because it would be pretty dull if we were all the same.

 

[classwife]

Speaking of respect...

Please remember to be respectful of your fellow members - don't be poking at each other

 

[Anjaffm]

You don't understand? I have read some posts in this thread that this confrontation situation is a new vaper problem probably of their own creation. This could not possibly be the problem of a control freak who has to be confrontational and who just passed their assertiveness training class, it is the vaper's problem. Like you, I am confused but not by the buffoons who are offended by open air vaping in a parking lot [these probably hate movie popcorn and ban it]; I am confused by members of this forum who easily find fault with the vaper.

Excellent, thank you!
And welcome to the club. The club of people who are more than appalled at the open blame and accusations heaped upon, and hostility shown towards, other vapers. By vapers. In a vapers forum. For the "crime" of - you guessed it - vaping.

 

[Susaz]

I live in a country where vaping is banned and everyone selling vaping products is persecuted as a drug dealer. Still people are warm to the idea of vaping, so much so sometimes you can vape indoors done quietly.

I always suggest bringing small equipment with you when going out, people react badly to big things that emit massive amounts of vapor. To some it reminds them of exhausts. Also try to stealth vape as much as you can, because although they might approve, sometimes I'm joked about "too much pot" when I open the car doors and lingering vapor came out.

Last month I had a heart attack. As I was telling my cardiologist (a family friend from a long time) a big grin came to her face. Y'know, this is sometimes a retrograde country. Not only she approved but also endorsed my vaping, and had known for quite some time, my dad had checked it out with her and she loved the idea, putting my father at ease.

Read the signals. People speak with their faces. Educate, not fight. And ALWAYS try to be a fly on the wall when it comes to vaping. Shoving things down people's throats is fiercely fought by many, whether they agree or not.

 

[Jaylah]

Okay, I admit that I didn't read all the posts in this thread. And some of them I did read, I just sort of skimmed.

But I have to admit that this makes me feel like a huge hypocrite.

If we all keep stealth-vaping in public (like in parking lots and walking down the sidewalk, not necessarily in close quarters like in a restaurant), I think it sort of gives people (if they see us doing it) the idea that we're doing something we shouldn't be doing. We're trying to hide what we're doing out of a sense of guilt. So part of me thinks that if we're going to vape in public, vape openly and with pride.

I don't stealth-vape outside in open spaces. I've never had anybody challenge me for doing it, but I think -- if I did -- I'd probably just say something like, "I'm not smoking. This is just water-vapor." Then either walk away or try to be nice and answer their questions if they wanted more information. (And asked in a non-confrontational way.)

But I don't vape at all in places where smoking is prohibited. And vaping isn't smoking. How is that fact ever going to be disseminated if we either don't vape at all, or stealth vape?

 

[Susaz]

But then:



At your table in a restaurant? In a store? I'm curious how you rationalize this activity as being 'respectful'?

While those sales people may not have lambasted you, what impression do you think they come away with after witnessing you doing this? Do you think they see someone who is being respectful?

I think we need to be mindful at this stage of the game in managing people's perceptions of vaping. Stealth vaping anywhere smoking is not permitted will only hinder our cause. Let's remind ourselves that we're vaping because it is better for us, NOT because we can 'Get away with it' in places where we couldnt' smoke.

I vape indoors in places I know. First I sit my ecig on the table, in plain sight. Generally the eVic on the avatar or an ego style. If unsure, I ask the waitress if it's ok to vape. Then, I don't exhale all of my vapor, not to disturb nearby tables.

I vape in medium places, and try to sit as far from the main group as possible. In summer, I do it outside.

EXCLUDE the e-cig term from your vocabulary for good. It's a personal vaporizer, to replace nic patches.