Several weeks in with MaxxFusion, my observations on batteries and juice....

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namuch

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This is a compilation on my experiences with the MaxxFusion over the course of several weeks now. I'm pretty sure I got my first kit shortly after they debuted.

I use only blank MaxxFusion cartos filled with my own juices, so I won't talk about the pre-filleds. I've so far used 25 of the first run cartos, and am currently making my way through 50 of the second run that Leaford has assured elsewhere, are in a more consistent resistance range.

I have so far, had no problems with any of the cartos, except as where noted that I abused them by using them on something they weren't designed for, or at a voltage that is above or below what they are designed to operate at. I even have 10 from my first batch of 25 that are still in my rotation today, and are tasting just as good as the day I pulled them out of the bubble.


batteries.


Using the MaxxFusion batteries on the MaxxFusion cartos for whatever reason seems to provide the most consistent vape. I believe it is a combination of perfect airflow plus voltage that makes these click so well. Probably due to the fact that the MaxxFusion batteries are machined to match the cartos from the factory rather than being a 3rd party design or having an adapter as an intermediary.

I've used the MaxxFusion cartos on the following batteries/mods with various results:

1) My big batt mods, single battery 4.2v - 3.7v (Silver Bullet, Mako, Buzz), using adapters obviously. I noticed that on the bigger mods the taste is usually off. It's not something I can put my finger on, but I have noticed that if I continue to push the issue, they soon start to taste burnt, and will quickly hit a state that makes them unrecoverable. I have other mods as well, including loads of box mods I built myself last year when I was into that kind of thing, but the end result was always the same.

2) I have a stash of Kr808 manual batteries that I've accumulated over the years. Fresh off the charger, these are too much, and I quickly had a burned or "off" taste. However, once the battery has dropped into it's "nominal" run voltage, they usually work pretty well. Although the airflow seems different from the Bloog batts, and I think the flavor is muted compared to the Bloog batts.

3) eGo, Riva, etc. Using an adapter with these (and the cone in place), these work quite well. And if all 4 of my Bloog batts suddenly died, these would work until I got replacements. The Riva runs a bit hotter at 3.7v and tends to give me the same flavor weirdness that I get from the fresh Kr808 batteries, but has not burnt a carto yet. The eGo, on the other hand, runs at a much lower voltage (I think it is 3.2 - 3.4), and aside from having to take a longer drag to get a good hit from it, works acceptably without burning (but the vapor is too cool for my taste).

4) Elegant. I had high hopes for this, as it is essentially an eGo type shell with a Kr808 connection and (according to my meter) clocks in at ~4.1v. However, the airflow problem comes back to haunt here again I think. It just doesn't taste quite right, the flavor is muted. I've tried it with and without the cone, no difference for me.



Juices.

These are the juices I currently have in my rotation (I go through a lot of different flavors, which is why cartos work better for me). But it also keeps me from even having an inkling of an urge to smoke.. :)

The following juices work flawlessly for me, and I can chain vape them until the carto is dry (I'll note the PG/VG percentages where the vendor provides an option, or if i know it):

Backwoods Brew (70/30): Maple Tobacco, Hunters Blend, 555, Applewood, Maxboro, Ry4, Casablanca.
Vapor Station: Phoenix, Tampa, Frisco, Seattle, Texas, and VS4.
Halo: Bella Valente
DIY Flavorshack (90/10): Black & Mild
FSUSA (90/10): Hypnotic Mist
My custom blend of 80% Dekang RY4 and 20% EcoPure Rich.


The following liquids refuse to work for me in the Bloog cartos (and actually don't work for me in my eGo tanks, Boge cartos, or anything else that relies on wicking), I can only drip using these liquids on regular atomizers:

Alien Visions (0/100): Boba's Bounty, Blend 4, 555
Vaperite: Organic Tobacco, Organic RY4
Want2Vape: Acid Blondie, Alcazar, Red Pirate

With all of the above, I can usually get 1-5 good drags, then they get dry with no flavor. They'll burn if I continue to press the issue. It doesn't surprise me really since they are so thick, I don't see how they can wick effectively to keep up. As I noted, I can only drip these on LR atty's anyway. They have unique flavors (I'm a tobacco nut), which is the only reason I tolerate them anyway, since I'm not a big fan of high VG juices (flavor and throat hit is way too muted for my taste on normal voltage equipment).


Quick background: Been using vaporizers since July 2009 when I bought an NJOY kit from a local truck stop on a whim, I was blown away that after 20 years of smoking, I went totally cold turkey on that same day. I moved from the NJOY (4081's), to KR808's from V4L, to 510's, 901's, 801's, big battery mods, box mods I built myself, eGo's, you name it... I've been happy with eGo's for about a year now, but the Bloog MaxxFusion has really impressed me with it's mini-size, and "big battery" hit. I find myself going for the Bloog over anything else, even at home.
 

nycsublimegirl

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i am sure you can cross post...i have no issue with it here...even tho you mention other products/vendors...i like open discussions and comparisons... the other vendors may mind though....i am not sure on the forum official rules regarding the subject tho...
I'm wondering if this thread would have been more appropriate for the Reviews forums. My original intention was to help those who have had burning problems with the MaxxFusion cartos, but as I started typing, more came out than I intended.. :)
 

RB37

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I don't mean to thread jack, but that review hits a nerve of mine namuch, complain about 90$? Seriously? If one can afford to smoke, then one can afford a 90$ set that will last a whole lot longer than 90$ worth of cigarettes. Or buy a single batt, cartomizer pack, and charger, and deal with it until its normally time to buy another 50$ carton of cigarettes, then buy a second battery and more cartomizers. It's not rocket science for goodness sake.
I was into the big mod's and such at one time as well, got caught up in all the vape mumbo jumbo, but then realized, hey, I am doing this to QUIT smoking, not move on to another habit. I hope by this time next year I have vanished from the forum because I am smoke free, nicotine free, and vape free.

Sorry again to threadjack. namuch very nice review you did.
 

Steeldragon

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I want to stick my 2 cents in, what of the people who keep buying those cigs while trying to find that 1 product to where they can throw away all the bs excuses that we have been using. The ones that look for that flavor or that hit where they can let go of the security blanket that they have used for so long. They try to switch flavors of that analog just to come up with 1 with more bs excuse. The ones that say they are attempting to quit just to placate there mate or spouse while all they are doing is cutting down but they lie to themselves every morning saying this is going to be the day and its not. They see that gain in the flavor changes or the hit seems to change but once again it the bs excuse and you wind spending more money to try find that thing where you feel comfortable again. People are not quitting in droves because of the health benefits but because they can't afford it anymore. The government has dictated that it is not healthy and that people shouldn't do it but in the meantime we are going to tax your habit to death till you do quit and we need money in our budgets. I can just see if this lasts that long somebody will try to tax this too. and for those that are wondering yes I am still smoking analogs and lieing to myself everyday. I will apoligise for this post. It just kind of slipped out i am sorry to bother everyone
 

leaford

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yeah, I hope they do not make any changes to the cartomizers or batteries, the combination is excellent. If they make a change, I will cry cry cry!

Sorry RB, no change means no improvement,stagnation, and death.

OK, sadly that describes my romantic life with bullseye accuracy, but all the more reason I won't ever let MaxxFusion suffer that fate!! ;)
 

leaford

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This is a compilation on my experiences with the MaxxFusion over the course of several weeks now. I'm pretty sure I got my first kit shortly after they debuted.

I use only blank MaxxFusion cartos filled with my own juices, so I won't talk about the pre-filleds. I've so far used 25 of the first run cartos, and am currently making my way through 50 of the second run that Leaford has assured elsewhere, are in a more consistent resistance range.

I have so far, had no problems with any of the cartos, except as where noted that I abused them by using them on something they weren't designed for, or at a voltage that is above or below what they are designed to operate at. I even have 10 from my first batch of 25 that are still in my rotation today, and are tasting just as good as the day I pulled them out of the bubble.


Batteries.


Using the MaxxFusion batteries on the MaxxFusion cartos for whatever reason seems to provide the most consistent vape. I believe it is a combination of perfect airflow plus voltage that makes these click so well. Probably due to the fact that the MaxxFusion batteries are machined to match the cartos from the factory rather than being a 3rd party design or having an adapter as an intermediary.

I've used the MaxxFusion cartos on the following batteries/mods with various results:

1) My big batt mods, single battery 4.2v - 3.7v (Silver Bullet, Mako, Buzz), using adapters obviously. I noticed that on the bigger mods the taste is usually off. It's not something I can put my finger on, but I have noticed that if I continue to push the issue, they soon start to taste burnt, and will quickly hit a state that makes them unrecoverable. I have other mods as well, including loads of box mods I built myself last year when I was into that kind of thing, but the end result was always the same.

2) I have a stash of Kr808 manual batteries that I've accumulated over the years. Fresh off the charger, these are too much, and I quickly had a burned or "off" taste. However, once the battery has dropped into it's "nominal" run voltage, they usually work pretty well. Although the airflow seems different from the Bloog batts, and I think the flavor is muted compared to the Bloog batts.

3) eGo, Riva, etc. Using an adapter with these (and the cone in place), these work quite well. And if all 4 of my Bloog batts suddenly died, these would work until I got replacements. The Riva runs a bit hotter at 3.7v and tends to give me the same flavor weirdness that I get from the fresh Kr808 batteries, but has not burnt a carto yet. The eGo, on the other hand, runs at a much lower voltage (I think it is 3.2 - 3.4), and aside from having to take a longer drag to get a good hit from it, works acceptably without burning (but the vapor is too cool for my taste).

4) Elegant. I had high hopes for this, as it is essentially an eGo type shell with a Kr808 connection and (according to my meter) clocks in at ~4.1v. However, the airflow problem comes back to haunt here again I think. It just doesn't taste quite right, the flavor is muted. I've tried it with and without the cone, no difference for me.



Juices.

These are the juices I currently have in my rotation (I go through a lot of different flavors, which is why cartos work better for me). But it also keeps me from even having an inkling of an urge to smoke.. :)

The following juices work flawlessly for me, and I can chain vape them until the carto is dry (I'll note the PG/VG percentages where the vendor provides an option, or if i know it):

Backwoods Brew (70/30): Maple Tobacco, Hunters Blend, 555, Applewood, Maxboro, Ry4, Casablanca.
Vapor Station: Phoenix, Tampa, Frisco, Seattle, Texas, and VS4.
Halo: Bella Valente
DIY Flavorshack (90/10): Black & Mild
FSUSA (90/10): Hypnotic Mist
My custom blend of 80% Dekang RY4 and 20% EcoPure Rich.


The following liquids refuse to work for me in the Bloog cartos (and actually don't work for me in my eGo tanks, Boge cartos, or anything else that relies on wicking), I can only drip using these liquids on regular atomizers:

Alien Visions (0/100): Boba's Bounty, Blend 4, 555
Vaperite: Organic Tobacco, Organic RY4
Want2Vape: Acid Blondie, Alcazar, Red Pirate

With all of the above, I can usually get 1-5 good drags, then they get dry with no flavor. They'll burn if I continue to press the issue. It doesn't surprise me really since they are so thick, I don't see how they can wick effectively to keep up. As I noted, I can only drip these on LR atty's anyway. They have unique flavors (I'm a tobacco nut), which is the only reason I tolerate them anyway, since I'm not a big fan of high VG juices (flavor and throat hit is way too muted for my taste on normal voltage equipment).


Quick background: Been using vaporizers since July 2009 when I bought an NJOY kit from a local truck stop on a whim, I was blown away that after 20 years of smoking, I went totally cold turkey on that same day. I moved from the NJOY (4081's), to KR808's from V4L, to 510's, 901's, 801's, big battery mods, box mods I built myself, eGo's, you name it... I've been happy with eGo's for about a year now, but the Bloog MaxxFusion has really impressed me with it's mini-size, and "big battery" hit. I find myself going for the Bloog over anything else, even at home.

Namuch, thanks for the fantastic review! I mean it, I love the thoroughness and comprehensiveness, the detail, the pros and the cons. It's exactly the kind of feedback I love. And it fits so well with what I learned about the MaxxFusion recently, that the batts are regulated for 3.6v outupt. They have the usual KR808D-1 cells, that peak at 4.2 volts at full charge, and settle to 3.7 for most of their life, but the IC regulates the output voltage at 3.6v. So at higher voltages, like the 4.2v from a freshly charged regular KR8, or 5V from a passthrough, and especially with lower resistance cartos, and/or liquid with higher sugar or VG content, the sugars and/or Vg can carmalize more easily due to the higher temperatures and the speed at which the temperature rises.

I am of course testing my hypothesis. Right now on my own, and the R&D department owes me their testing plan by Monday. But your data agrees with mine. The voltage seems to be the largest contributing factor, with the cartomizer resistance second, and the VG content affects it too, but the least. SO the challenge now is to find a way to make it work better with higher voltage batts and passthroughs, but without sacrificing the performance we experience with the optimal voltage of 3.6.

I'm not actually entirely certain that will be possible. I may have to explore other alternatives, like carrying a second line of high resistance carts, retaining the key advantages but sacrificing a bit of vapor and throat hit, for those who prefer higher voltage batts, mods, and passthroughs.

And speaking of passthroughs, I may have to have the MaxxFusion passthroughs regulated at 3.6v to match the batts. They should provide the same optimized experience as the batts do, and the main reason people like the higher voltage is the higher vapor and TH, which MF provides anyway. But there again, we could still offer both options, so you could choose your preference.

Anyway, thanks for the great and detailed review, and I hope you won't mind if I repost it on my blog. I really need to get back to posting there, and your review would be a great start. :thumb:
 

leaford

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I was into the big mod's and such at one time as well, got caught up in all the vape mumbo jumbo, but then realized, hey, I am doing this to QUIT smoking, not move on to another habit. I hope by this time next year I have vanished from the forum because I am smoke free, nicotine free, and vape free.

...and for those that are wondering yes I am still smoking analogs and lieing to myself everyday. I will apoligise for this post. It just kind of slipped out i am sorry to bother everyone

These two posts together bring up kind of a divide within the vaping community. Does it have to be about total absitinance? RB, I know that's not what you were saying. If that's your goal, good for you and I wish you success. There's no scientific or clinical evidence that e-cigs are an effective tool for a step-down nicotine cessation program. I have to point that out both legally, and as a matter of intellectual honesty. ;) But although I am not a scientist I personally don't see any scientific or biological reason it would be any less effective than recognized NRT programs. It uses the same mechanisim, just a different delivery method.

Anyway, I wasn't bothered by you stating that as a goal, I just want to point out that for many of us the goal is just the opposite. I personally have no intention of ever "freeing" myself from nicotine any more than I intend to free myself from caffine. I don't see caffine addiction as a problem because although it carries some long term health risks, I enjoy the effects and benefit enough from them I feel the long-term risks are worth the short-term benefits. And I feel the same about nicotine now that I have found a way to consume it without the vastly greater, more serious, and more certain risks of tobacco smoke.

But SteelDragon, your comments concern me much more. Not that I am faulting you for how you feel, but I want to reassure you you shouldn't feel that way at all. It's about vaping instead of smoking, true, but it really doesn't have to be about abstinence. Every cigarette you haven't smoked is a victory. If your goal is tobacco abstinence, good for you. I think that's the best goal. But do NOT beat yourself up if you're not there yet, or even if you don't really want to get there. If you are smoking a handfull of analogs, but you used to smoke a PACK, that's success. That's victory. Build on that, don't retreat or quit or blame yourself because you don't win every battle. You're winning the war. And I'm proud of you for that. :thumbs:
 

leaford

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I think this biggest lie I told myself on every attempt to quit was " I just want one" I realize now that It can never be just one, that one turns in to a life time of them. I'm going on week #7 of being smoke free and I'm still struggling with that "just one more"

Like alcoholism, that may be true for some. And if that's you, good for you to recognize that and admit it honestly. And congratulations on your success in sticking to that. I just want to reiterate for those who haven't reached that point, or who feel that they can and are handling moderate tobacco use, that's ok, and is success worthy of pride and congratulations too.
 
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Goldenkobold

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I have to disagree with you on voltage being the determining factor over design when it comes to VG, Mr Leaflord sir.

I base this off of my experience with a variety of different cartomizers on a variety of different devices. It seems that the less wicking a device needs the better VG will perform on it. That is to say that a boge cartomizer, which is a very simple polyfill wrapped around a heating element design, will vape 100% vg much better than a ce2r4 which is much more dependent on its wick. If you vape VG too fast on a wick dependent cartomizer...it will not wick fast enough and it will get a burnt taste. One thing you could do with a ce2 is vape 4 puffs...sit it down for 10 minutes vape 4 puffs...and so on and it would not get that burnt taste. This is true at 5v or 3.3v or more importantly at 6-8.5 watts.

I think you would have to find a chemist however to explain the difference in capillary action between pg and vg based liquids or what effects if any, the different viscosity would have, all I know about is actual testing in devices.

That being said, there are some great 30% or less vg juices out there, BWB for the tobacco lovers, Mrs T for the sweet vapes. Most Dekangs are PG and I add 10% VG to it for vapor.

I envy you, your R&D department however hopefully they find something out
 

leaford

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I have to disagree with you on voltage being the determining factor over design when it comes to VG, Mr Leaflord sir.
Oh, please do, good Mr. Goldenkobold sir. THe last thing I ever want to do is set myself up as an indisputable authority, sir. Knowledge does not proceed well in that environment, sir, and rarely does true certainty result. ;)

I base this off of my experience with a variety of different cartomizers on a variety of different devices. It seems that the less wicking a device needs the better VG will perform on it. That is to say that a boge cartomizer, which is a very simple polyfill wrapped around a heating element design, will vape 100% vg much better than a ce2r4 which is much more dependent on its wick. If you vape VG too fast on a wick dependent cartomizer...it will not wick fast enough and it will get a burnt taste. One thing you could do with a ce2 is vape 4 puffs...sit it down for 10 minutes vape 4 puffs...and so on and it would not get that burnt taste. This is true at 5v or 3.3v or more importantly at 6-8.5 watts.

I think you would have to find a chemist however to explain the difference in capillary action between pg and vg based liquids or what effects if any, the different viscosity would have, all I know about is actual testing in devices.

That being said, there are some great 30% or less vg juices out there, BWB for the tobacco lovers, Mrs T for the sweet vapes. Most Dekangs are PG and I add 10% VG to it for vapor.

I envy you, your R&D department however hopefully they find something out

I agree with you about the wicking properties of VG playing a role. We've discussed that here before, and I included that in my discussion with the chief engineer. I should have mentioned it here too, but I did mention it in the other thread about this. He did tests using different PG/VG ratios, and doesn't think that is the problem. I am not just taking his word on that, of course. I'm including that in the testing variables. And I think it is part of the picture.

But knowing that the voltage is controlled on our batts but variable on other batts explains why the same cartomizer with the same liquid will get the burnt taste on another batt but not on ours. It explains why passthroughs and fresh non-MF batts are more likely to cause it. And it still makes perfect sense that the wicking characteristics of VG make high VG liquids more prone still to it, and that lower resistance cartomizers also make it more likely, and the combination more likely still.

It is consistent with the data, and inherently plausible. But of course, we will see what the data shows, and go from there.
 
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