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Tank vs. Cartomizer Tank vs. Clearomizers - confused!

Discussion in 'New Members Forum' started by love coffee, Sep 27, 2013.

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  1. love coffee

    love coffee Super Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Sep 11, 2013
    Charlotte, NC
    I have been vaping exclusively for about 2 months now. At first, I tasted the different flavors and was enjoying vaping very much. Then, the high PG content in my juices was really irritating my lungs, so I've switched to 50/50 PG/VG. But, even before reducing the PG content, flavor seems to have disappeared. I've read about Vaper's Tongue, but this has been going on for at least 3 weeks.

    I'm using eGo-C twist with iclear 16 clearomizers. I've also tried Vivi Nova clearo's, and a kanger one.

    So, I've been reading here about the various mods, tanks, etc. and my head is swimming. Seems that the consensus is that clearo's mute the flavors significantly. Just recently read another thread that recommended the Kanger Protank 2 to a fellow vaper that was giving up on vaping because of unsatisfying experiences. I've also read about the tanks that you put a cartomizer in too. I'm very confused.

    I'm not mechanically inclined, so not into all of these mods and rebuild kits, etc. I'm sure I can change out a head, but that's about as technical as I want to get.

    So, can anyone advise me on how to get the FLAVOR back from vaping? Do I need to move away from clearo's to some kind of tank system? I'm almost ready to give up. :( Thanks in advance for any help!
     
  2. TruckDrivinMama

    TruckDrivinMama Senior Member ECF Veteran

    Sep 18, 2013
    CA, USA
    Well my experience so far is this. Ive tried the carto tanks and i honestly got the most flavour out of those. My problem was when switching flavours in them, id had to switch a new one in or wash the centre carto and wait for it to dry. When i was at work, i ran out of one juice and filled it with another and the old juice flavour lingered for some time before i could taste the new juice. It was green apple.... 5 min later, ahh there goes my cherry cola.

    Yes the flavour is a bit muted in the PT2s if you compare it to the carto tanks but when it comes to flavour switch, it was just a quick rinse and bam! I got the flavour i wanted. And IMO the disassembly and refill process was a tad easier. My atty heads come in a little cheaper too vs the carto attys for the cart tanks. And ive encountered too many quality control problems with the carto tank attys before. For me it was a tradeoff using the PT2 tanks vs carto tanks i was willing to do since im always on the run.

    If you are seeking flavour, then i believe you are better off with carto tanks.
     
  3. since96

    since96 Full Member Verified Member

    Sep 25, 2013
    USA
    Rebuilding a coil/head with cotton wick will do you wonders for flavor, take a look into it.. not nearly as complicated as it seems.
     
  4. since96

    since96 Full Member Verified Member

    Sep 25, 2013
    USA
    Forgot to add that PT2 heads are easily rebuildable, so that may sway your decision to try out the PT
     
  5. RoseB

    RoseB Ultra Member ECF Veteran

    Sep 3, 2012
    Washington
    Hello :) Congrats on the 2 months. Clearomizers usually put out the flavor. Cartomizers and cartomizer tanks put out more vapor. Both options work great with a 50/50 mix. If you prefer high or 100% VG - then cartomizers and cartomizer tanks are your best bet.
    The protank is a popular glass clearomizer. You replace the atomizer head (part with wicks). You don't have to buy wire & wick materials and all of that. It is an option though. With cartomizer tanks you fill the cartomizer, put it in the tank, and then fill the tank.
     
  6. love coffee

    love coffee Super Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Sep 11, 2013
    Charlotte, NC
    So you're saying the Clearo's are supposed to deliver the most flavor??? Now I'm very confused. I thought Clearo's delivered the LEAST flavor???
     
  7. love coffee

    love coffee Super Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Sep 11, 2013
    Charlotte, NC
    Thanks everyone for the replies. I'm still a little confused, tho. :confused: What will deliver the best flavor? Or, is it possible that my reaction to the higher PG juices have just deadened my vaping taste forever???
     
  8. Converterjoe

    Converterjoe New Member

    Aug 18, 2013
    United States
    Try vaping unflavored 50/50 for a couple days with or without nic. I do this once a month or so. Brings my 'buds back to life. Don't give up! Just say no.....to analogs:)

    Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2
     
  9. The Ocelot

    The Ocelot Psychopomp Verified Member ECF Veteran

    {Waves to Baditude! Go getem'!}

    I smoked for a very long time and it took about 2-3 months of vaping before I could taste anything other than menthol, mints and cinnamon. There are still some lighter or more complex flavors I can't taste or taste like plastic. My sense of taste is still changing, sometimes due to food or drink, sometimes for no discernible reason. However, when I can taste flavors well, my preference for vaping are:

    1) Dripping/Bottom-Feeders
    2) Carto Tanks
    Everything else. I often use Protanks, but that's for convenience, not flavor.
     
  10. Baditude

    Baditude ECF Guru ECF Veteran

    Apr 8, 2012
    Ridgeway, Ohio
    People will prefer one juice attachment over another. Preference in juice flavors is subjective, and so is their choice in delivery devices. My suggestion is to try as many different attachments as you can, over a period of time, and see which ones YOU prefer with your juices and battery devices. We are fortunate to have choices, otherwise everyone would be stuck with the same thing.

    I used to believe clearomizers sucked. And 1.5 years ago they did for the most part. They leaked, were fussy and inconsistant. Once I had a clearomizer literally melt in my hands after filling it with some strawberry lemonade, I was finished with clearomizers.

    I went with pyrex cartotanks, and I immediately discovered more flavor and more consistant/dependable results. They have been MY primary delivery attachment for well over a year. They have a slight learning curve and take a little longer to set up initially, but to me they are well worth it.

    When my daughter began vaping this summer, I revisited the more contemporary clearomizers and found that they have improved markedly from over a year ago. Their flavor is still not up to par with my cartomizers, but their ease of use can not be denied. Recently I have been using the iClear 30 clearomizers and find them to be a nice vape and my favorite clearo. I've also tried and liked the Protanks 1 & 2. The Kanger Evod and iClear 15 also aren't bad, but they use an eGo connection and I use 510-threaded mods. For some reason I've just never cared for the Vivi Nova or the Kanger T's.

    But these have been MY experiences. Yours may vary from mine.


    Proper Terminology: Is it a carto, a tank, or what?

    Baditude's Cartotank Setup Guide

    Cartotank Help for a Noob

    IBTanked pyrex cartotank: Review

    Something Safe for Cinnamon & Citrus Flavors?
     
  11. OlDogNewTricks

    OlDogNewTricks Ultra Member ECF Veteran

    Aug 21, 2013
    Venice, FL
    Welcome, Congradulations. Please check out Baditude's links, he changed my vaping sooooo much for the better. Way to go Baditude. Thank you.
     
  12. Taylor7617

    Taylor7617 Super Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Also, I hadn't seen mentioned is that higher PG carries the flavor and VG gets the plumes of vapor many are chasing. Going down to a 50/50 you lose a bit of that flavor punch and from there to 100 VG, many start adding flavor shots to get all that back (dependant on vendor so YMMV). So....puttting all the blame on the device isn't entirely fair. I've gone from and eGo with Kanger T2's to a VV/VW mod and ProTank 2's. Currently loving the flavor from my setup but I've also ventured into making my own coils and using cotton wicks which has been an improvement over stock heads (stock was good but this is now better).

    Additionally, for the OP, you've just recently quit smoking and it will take some time for your taste buds to recover. You'll notice changes for quite awhile and this will be compounded by various eLiquids (diff vendors make juice differently) and delivery devices (build quality, clean wicks or carto's, etc). Eventually you'll settle in and find the right juice(s), battery and delivery device that'll work for you. It can be a bit costly on the front end but it's all still better than puffing on the analogs!
     
  13. Bill's Magic Vapor

    Bill's Magic Vapor Vaping Master Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Feb 8, 2013
    USA
    Vapor tongue is real. As others mentioned, taste buds take time, sometimes a long time, to recover, but improvement is noticeable over time.

    One trick I learned from some of the flavorists that mix our flavorings is that they will inhale some freshly ground coffee to "reset" their sense of taste between batches and testings. I was skeptical, but tried this and it works for me. After a good oral cleaning in the morning, a good dose of freshly ground coffee, and a good delivery device, the taste is substantially improved.

    Other pieces affect flavor, as well. clearomizers like the Protank have a great vape, flavor and vapor, compared with most other clearos, and the PTII may be the best clearo on the market at the moment, imho. Another issue is the wick material, silica sucks to me now, after rewicking with cotton. Even the type of cotton makes a huge difference. I ordered and fell in love with some organic cotton balls that I found on Amazon. The are cleaned and bleached with hydrogen peroxide, so they don't get any more organic than that, though I still see videos where they recommend boiling the cotton. I don't, and don't need to as I cannot taste any other "flavor" with the cotton balls I now use.

    Clearo's do mute the flavor compared with other devices. Carto tanks are a huge improvement in taste and vapor over clearos, imho, and after six months of evods and Protanks, became my ADV. Some people claim they can taste the filler material in cartos, and don't use them. Sorry for them as cartos are my favorite, but also glad for them if they can taste that well.

    Recently, in the last few months, I have working with RDA/RBA's quite a bit. At first, I didn't notice any difference between them and most clearos, but since I upgraded to the best cottons with good kanthal wire (not nichrome - bad taste to me), and began experimenting with different coil setups for the Ithaka, RSST (genny) and the Kayfun (my favorite), changing resistances, I finally discovered a huge difference in flavor improvement over the cartos. I've heard, but haven't yet tried the HH357 atomizer is great, and my drippers have taken a magnitude better flavor for me. The lower Ohms, say 1.3 - 1.5 seem to give me the best flavor. I can taste juices and ingredients that I never could before, even with my cartos. Airflow can affect the flavor greatly. I recently added the Kayfun 3.1 to my Kayfun Lite and with a tighter draw (my preference), I get the best vape of my life. Part of this is likely my evolving/improving taste buds.

    The other thing is that finding an all-day-vape (ADV) is very difficult. I DIY and find a new ADV about once every two months, and I experiment with juice every weekend, and steep like crazy. The more complex flavors can take literally weeks for the flavor bonds to fully form, and the very subtle ingredients to be perceivable. Like many others, chasing the best vape is a passion. The more things I try, the more discoveries, and sometimes, the better my vape gets. Also, a well-known maxim is the PG/VG ratio. I use a 60/40 mix (60 PG) and that is my sweet spot with cotton. This is my RDA/RBA coil setup/juice. I use cartos, though, still on a daily basis, primarily for the quality of vape and ease of use. I haven't use a carto longer than three days in months, as I don't like any diminishment in the quality of my vape, not even a little. So, in summary:

    FACTORS AFFECTING FLAVOR

    1. Device type (clearo top coil, clearo bottom coil, carto, dripper/RBA - in that order [worst to best], imho)
    2. Wick material (cotton is the bomb, organic cotton preferred). Not going to discuss mesh, diapers and what have you on this post. Go cotton!
    3. PG/VG ratio (PG carries more flavor, VG more vapor - I prefer a 60 PG/40 VG ratio)
    4. Air flow is critical. An air flow controller for a clearo makes the Protank variable and better ($3-$4)
    5. Atomizer resistance
    6. Juice and steeping time
    7. Clean and clear the palate (hygiene and "reset" with aroma of freshly ground coffee)
    8. Change juices. This can reset the palate. If I vape a Danish all day, I switch to a fruit, and my buds come to life
    9. Coil temperature, closely related with Ohms. Every juice and coil assembly has its own "sweet spot". Experiment. You must have variable voltage/wattage to get the most out of any vape
    10. As Bad suggested, try different juices and toppers until you find what works for you. VapeQuest is just that, an evolutionary process to find what works best for you, and this changes as your taste buds change. Watch lots of device specific videos and learn how to get the most from your toppers and juice.
    11. Change coils frequently. Cleaning and dry burning helps, but a fresh coil is always better, imho. I never used clearo coils or cartos after three days. YMMV. This keeps it good for me.
    12. Topper materials - I prefer stainless over most other metals. I prefer pyrex glasses over most plastics in tanks. Experiment and find what works best for your juices.
    13. Taste buds do come back to life over time, and improvements in taste, smell and flavor does improve over time and does become noticeable. Be patient. It may have taken years to "kill" these senses. It will be a while before they fully recover.

    Good luck, happy JuiceQuest, happy VapeQuest, Power up and Vape On! Welcome to the Forum. Best to you!
     
  14. footbag

    footbag Super Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Aug 28, 2010
    NEPA
    In my recent experience of going from Kangers to Clearo tanks to carto tanks, each has slight nuances.

    Kangers have great flavor when I put them on my Vamo, but on a normal 510, not so much. Initially I liked them, but they seems to lose flavor quickly. Throat hit is about normal.

    Clearo tanks have good flavor when they are working properly, but they do require hands on maintenance. I got two from Fastech which barely worked out of the box. Then I got a vision dual coil which worked much better, but is also a bit finicky.

    Carto Tanks, I'm using the AGR v2 with Boge cartos. It has the best and most consistent flavor. Throat hit isn't as strong as the others, but flavor makes up for it. Changing the juice or carto is tougher. But not as hard as rewrapping a coil.
     
  15. love coffee

    love coffee Super Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Sep 11, 2013
    Charlotte, NC
    Thanks everyone for your additional information and very helpful posts. I may look into getting a carto tank - that seems to deliver the best flavor, based on posts I see here.

    However, from another thread, I read about technique, and to not "draw on your vape" like a cigarette. It has taken some practice, but I've discovered that if I barely put the tip in my mouth and draw the vapor in with a slightly open mouth, OMG - the flavor is sooooooo much more pronounced! I think the directions in that other thread talked about letting the vapor draw slowly over your tongue. I think part of my problem has been vaping like I smoked - hard and deep draws. I think most of the juice was bypassing most of my tongue and hitting directly in my throat.

    I'm learning...:vapor:
     
  16. Bauk

    Bauk Full Member

    Oct 16, 2013
    Belgrade, Serbia
    Hi love coffee! Congratulations on 2 months vaping, hang in there it only gets better!

    Now for your question/confusion. I am also only few months into vaping and don't have experience of many people here but I went into vaping fanatically, went in on a quest really to find what suits me in fastest possible way. So in few months, I tried lot of different things. So far, best flavor gives HH.357 long barrel atomizer. Great flavor, great vapor production, easy maintenance - you just put it under warm water for 30seconds and dry it with paper towels. Only problem is dripping, it can get annoying to some people...

    So, since I liked the device so much I started some research and discovered bottom feeders that Ocelot mentioned. That way you keep all the good things and get rid of dripping in case it annoys you :)

    On the pictures below you see how whole device looks. I was joking that I am starting to vape Lightsaber! On the other picture, you see all main parts. And that is all technical that is expected from you. To put that together. From left to right, Provari Mini device, Aurora bottom feeder main body and above that it is little plastic tank that goes in it, then we have HH.357 long barrel atomizer and extra long drip tip.

    [​IMG][​IMG]

    Depends on the device you are using you might need to purchase 501 - ego adapter that goes between your vaping device and aurora and you are all set! Give it a try, it's awesome!

    Best regards!
     
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