Update:ny child dies of nicotine poisoning.
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I agree. But I will also make a Prediction.
And that is If the Official cause of Death is listed as from Nicotine Poisoning or from Chocking do to Ingesting Nicotine from an e-liquid, that there will be Some who consider it to be a big Conspiracy Theory orchestrated by ANTZ.
the case is still under investigation.
i have been checking local media sources daily.
no additional information other than the initial reports
has been released to the public to my knowledge.
i intend to try and contact the coroner of record
before the week is out.
regards
mike
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You're right about the batteries/chargers - candlepower forums are a good resource. Here we've had techies attempt to blow up ecig batts and they found some they simply couldn't blow up - namely Joyetech eGo-c batts - no matter what they did - so there is some specified ecig testing here that you won't find elsewhere.
As to you question - what would you chose? This pinpoints why the decentralized product/service information moves much more swiftly and efficiently as well as less costly in a free market than in some centralized planning of those who know best for us - government agency. (See FA Hayek - "Road to Serfdom" and 'Fatal Conceit' as well as Mises "Human Action") A free market moves so fast that no amount of 'overseeing big brotherism' even with super computers can keep pace with what's going on, let alone deal out their 'wisdom' of how things 'should' be. lol.
Yeah, really - it was the first derail of many on this thread. CRP was not involved and has no relation to this actual incident at all. Maybe in some others involving 3, 4, 5 yr olds and up, but not this one.
Not me, and there will be some who make eliquid manufactures and bottles the focus rather than the parent/partner, baby sitter - iow the "Adult", who was ultimately responsible for both the eliquid and the child. And it doesn't take a 'Conspiracy theory' to see how the ANTZ have and will continue to make this a prime feature of their Anti-ecig programs and studies. By pointing out that 'some' make it into a conspiracy when they don't - just adds to the ANTZ propaganda as if you are in 'conspiracy with them' - a 'theory' that's becoming easier to make, btw.
I am sorry the parents lost their child because they chose to have an incompetent babysitter.
It is the fault of the person that should have had eyes on that baby. Period.
It wasn't an accident. It was the tragic result of NEGLECT.
It is the fault of the person that should have had eyes on that baby. Period.
It wasn't an accident. It was the tragic result of NEGLECT.
I agree ... this sounds like a case of criminal negligence causing death.
No real baby sitter involved - despite some early accounts.
"Every night, Brenda Hotaling relives the accidental death of her 18-month-old son."
""I tried to save him and I couldn't," Hotaling said..."
Brenda considered Eli 'her son' but she is not the birth mother - her partner, Alyssa Hotaling, is the boy's birth mother. Even though Eli was dropped off at an aunt's house, Brenda was there at the time it happened.
Lethal side of liquid nicotine - Times Union
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So there is No Room in this Discussion as to Whether or Not CRP may have Prevented this Accident?
Or if the Pending or Future Legislation will be Effected by this Child's Death?
Or if Voluntary or No-Existing Packaging should or Shouldn't be the way e-Liquids are Sold?
zoiDman:So there is No Room in this Discussion as to Whether or Not CRP may have Prevented this Accident?
No. It wouldn't have.
Or if the Pending or Future Legislation will be Effected by this Child's Death?
It shouldn't. It was not a factor.
Or if Voluntary or No-Existing Packaging should or Shouldn't be the way e-Liquids are Sold?
Again, not because of this incident. It was not a factor and discussing whether any of the above should or shouldn't be, is as off-top as the EPA or greedy businesses is. None has anything to do with what happened here and wouldn't have prevented this death. Maybe others, but not this one.
And this will be my last post to you on this thread. see the Mark Twain quote.
No. It wouldn't have.
Or if the Pending or Future Legislation will be Effected by this Child's Death?
It shouldn't. It was not a factor.
Or if Voluntary or No-Existing Packaging should or Shouldn't be the way e-Liquids are Sold?
Again, not because of this incident. It was not a factor and discussing whether any of the above should or shouldn't be, is as off-top as the EPA or greedy businesses is. None has anything to do with what happened here and wouldn't have prevented this death. Maybe others, but not this one.
And this will be my last post to you on this thread. see the Mark Twain quote.
Just Say'n Kent that if Somehow this Thread was kept to the Strictest Adherence to the OP's first post, there wouldn't be much to Talk About.
Because the ONLY thing I know for Sure about what happened is that there is a Child that is Dead.
So if we are just going to talk about "What Happened", it is going to be a Very Short conversation.
all topics on this end up in that same place.
I've watched a lot of married couples who never learned how to have a "healthy" argument/debate.....after they back each other into corners and ultimatums (which should never happen in the first place) they are left to lash out with justifications, which become increasingly illogical, desperate, and jerry springer-esque.
There are no consumer products that I know of, for human consumption, that have not been overseen and somewhat regulated.
Can you think of any? It's a pipe dream that eliquids aren't going to be regulated in some way, certainly starting with caps and certainly age limits.
I personally can tell the difference between somebody lightly stepping on my toes in the grocery store, and being run over in the parking lot by a tour bus.
I think over-reacting is rampant as vapers perceive they are being singled out yet so many other industries have gone thru this and survived just fine, like supplements, herbs, etc. As a matter of fact, the latter are multi billion $$ industries, showing no signs of distress. all topics on this end up in that same place.
I've watched a lot of married couples who never learned how to have a "healthy" argument/debate.....after they back each other into corners and ultimatums (which should never happen in the first place) they are left to lash out with justifications, which become increasingly illogical, desperate, and jerry springer-esque.
There are no consumer products that I know of, for human consumption, that have not been overseen and somewhat regulated.
Can you think of any? It's a pipe dream that eliquids aren't going to be regulated in some way, certainly starting with caps and certainly age limits.
I personally can tell the difference between somebody lightly stepping on my toes in the grocery store, and being run over in the parking lot by a tour bus.
It is a Shame I can Only put 1 Like on this Post.
I personally don't care if CRP is required or not, I may in the future when my hands are arthritic, but for now I don't. I think the argument being made though is that it's not necessary, and wouldn't have helped in this situation. There are plenty of potentially harmful products that do not have CRP, even some meant for human consumption like medication and vitamins/supplements. Some of them do have CRP, but that seems to be left up to the manufacturer/retailer/pharmacy, which is how it should be. Incidents like this don't tell us that CRP needs to be mandatory, it just makes some people feel that way.
i get the child safety cap thing. i have no qualms with it as there are work around's if needed.
its not worth arguing the merits of them because the children argument trumps every thing else
for the soccer moms.
someone mentioned criminal neglect which i also discount because when you read the stories
so far the time line doesn't make any sense.who's ever toxicology graph you use there is no
way for even a toddler to drink and ingest into the bloodstream a high enough dosage to go
into convulsions and coma in less than a minute.
i could be wrong but things don't add up.
i'll keep on it.
regards
mike
its not worth arguing the merits of them because the children argument trumps every thing else
for the soccer moms.
someone mentioned criminal neglect which i also discount because when you read the stories
so far the time line doesn't make any sense.who's ever toxicology graph you use there is no
way for even a toddler to drink and ingest into the bloodstream a high enough dosage to go
into convulsions and coma in less than a minute.
i could be wrong but things don't add up.
i'll keep on it.
regards
mike
Other Parent, Mom's gf, babysitter, aunt the frickin trash collecter whoever... The liquid was left by an adult somewhere the unwatched baby could get it. That's not an accident it's neglect.
You underlined 'incompetent babysitter' - I just wanted to set the record straight... but you're right - neglect not 'accident'.
I agree, but I'm not convinced yet that nicotine was really even involved. We haven't heard anything beyond the initial statements.
Back to the topic.
http://thehill. com/regulation/229398-ny-toddlers-death-revives-push-for-e-cigarette-regulation
Sen. Nelson (D-Fla.) revived calls for regulations on e-cigarettes following the death a toddler in upstate New York last week. He reintroduces the Child Nicotine Poisoning Prevention Act in the Senate today.
http://thehill. com/regulation/229398-ny-toddlers-death-revives-push-for-e-cigarette-regulation
Sen. Nelson (D-Fla.) revived calls for regulations on e-cigarettes following the death a toddler in upstate New York last week. He reintroduces the Child Nicotine Poisoning Prevention Act in the Senate today.
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