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VIDEO: Disruptive Technologies: Vaping and Ride-Sharing

Discussion in 'General Vaping Discussion' started by Tommy-Chi, Feb 8, 2016.

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  1. Tommy-Chi

    Tommy-Chi Ultra Member ECF Veteran

    Sep 9, 2015
    Chitown
    Disruptive Technologies: Vaping and Ride-Sharing

    A presentation by the CCF to the government, lawyers and doctors of Canada. An argument with regard to vaping as it is a disruptive technology that could save lives.

    The video starts with vaping, then on to disruptive technology of ride-sharing, and concludes with a question and answer period for both speakers.

    The Canadian Constitution Foundation (CCF) is a registered charity, independent and non-partisan. We act as a voice for freedom in Canada's courtrooms and court of public opinion. We depend on the generous and voluntary contributions of hundreds of Canadians who value their constitutional freedoms. We issue official tax receipts for donations received. The CCF is also registered as a 501(c)(3) public charity with the IRS.
     
    • Like Like x 10
  2. pdib

    pdib Registered Supplier - Offline ECF Veteran

    Nov 23, 2012
    this is so ding-danged interesting! . . . and edifying! I'm only about 40 min. into it; but wow! This guy has a lot of insight, not only into the positive aspects of vaping; but insight into why we're facing such opposition, why (culturally, historically) people who feel they are fighting in the interest of public health want to decimate vaping tech. And I think these valuable bits of knowledge* might help those smarter than I to better guide our course in "the fight".

    . . . or something to that effect. :blush:

    * 37:50 min.→, as a fer example
     
    • Like Like x 5
  3. LilWhiteClouder

    LilWhiteClouder Ultra Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Apr 1, 2015
    Raleigh, NC
    :pop:"Self financing, public health revolution"

    I like that. This is very interesting!:pop:
    Thanks for sharing
     
    • Like Like x 2
  4. Mazinny

    Mazinny Vaping Master Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Jul 25, 2013
    NY
    Thank you for posting this. I am thoroughly enjoying listening to this.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  5. Bad Ninja

    Bad Ninja Vaping Master ECF Veteran

    Jun 26, 2013
    God's Country
    As some members obviously can't watch a two hour YouTube video, could you summarize the video and outline the important parts?
     
  6. coolerat

    coolerat Ultra Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Mar 20, 2015
    Verona,NY
    I actually watched the first guy which was about vaping and took 40 minutes.

    He's a very good if somewhat monotone speaker.

    Pick a subject and remove all the emotion and politics. Reduce it to just the facts.

    Now apply that to vaping.

    Thats the video.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  7. Bad Ninja

    Bad Ninja Vaping Master ECF Veteran

    Jun 26, 2013
    God's Country
    :)
    Thanks for the detailed summary, and for pointing out the important parts, and key points of the presentation.

    That sounds quite compelling but if
    The video isn't worthy of a decent summary it's obviously not worth the time it takes to watch it.
     
  8. coolerat

    coolerat Ultra Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Mar 20, 2015
    Verona,NY
    Smoking is bad for you because of combustion. People who live in smoke filled yurts deep in the Himalayas suffer the same trouble.

    Not smoking is the best thing for you.

    Some people can look death right in the face of death and ask for a smoke.

    For people who for any number of reason can not or will not quit smoking vaping is a less harmful way to take nicotine in.

    These people, nicotine addicts, will never be stopped from taking it in.

    Allowing them to use harm reduction makes sense.

    He didn't reinvent the wheel. He gave a thoughtful presentation about something we all understand completely to a group of people who may not understand.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  9. Bad Ninja

    Bad Ninja Vaping Master ECF Veteran

    Jun 26, 2013
    God's Country
    Thank you.
    It's a personal peeve of mine to see threads started with a video link and no summary.
    Without a summary, it feels like an advertisement.


    It's interesting to learn how we are represented to government, and who does the representing.


    The topic is relevant because many times, the groups that want to support us weren't asked to get involved, and do so to promote their own agenda off the back of a popular trend.

    Honestly the vaping community really doesn't have an organization that lobbies for us.
     
  10. coolerat

    coolerat Ultra Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Mar 20, 2015
    Verona,NY
    I'm not sure what this guys thing is.

    He's a lawyer not a doctor so its from that angle.

    I'd let him represent me.

    Seen a woman on TV once here in NY. State government type. Democrat outta the city. Quit smoking with vaping. Prolly couldn't agree with her on a single subject except vaping.

    Go figger right??
     
    • Like Like x 3
  11. choochoogranny

    choochoogranny Vaping Master ECF Veteran

    Oct 21, 2013
    chattanooga, tn, usa
    Wonderful post, Tommy Chi. :) The attorney also gave us a bit of a history lesson re lung and stomach cancer. In the beginning of the 1900's lung cancer very rare, but stomach cancer prevalent. Now the opposite is true. Why? Refrigerators in homes to keep foods fresh and one didn't have to eat so much pickled and salted foods. Tobacco companies discovered a way to manufacture cigarettes so people didn't have to chew, use a pipe or smoke a cigar. Didn't know that.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  12. pennysmalls

    pennysmalls Squonkmeister Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Jul 26, 2013
    Indiana
    Great video Tommy. I really liked how the speaker mentioned, over and over again, that ideology is such a huge part of the drive to kill vaping, that we smokers are sinners and must repent by abstinence only, no cheating by using harm reduction methods. That mindset is so prevalent in society and needs to be addressed. One day I'd like to see an eloquent speaker address the issues smokers face from society in terms of being seen as weak and/or lacking in intelligence because they can't quit smoking, as well as being seen as junkies. I see so much of that attitude from non smokers/previous smokers in the comment sections of articles that I read and post to.
     
    • Like Like x 4
  13. pdib

    pdib Registered Supplier - Offline ECF Veteran

    Nov 23, 2012

    In some ways, this speaker did. And/or, perhaps, I connected some dots with his points. People who "can't quit smoking" may be weak, IDK, it's kind of irrelevant. Most likely, many people who wouldn't stop smoking (until vape tech came along) were/are self medicating. This "weakness" labeling is most likely an easy way to under-carpet some rather complex and hard to understand stuff. Nicotine is a drug, and is observed to have the effect of both quieting/calming the mind, as well as focusing it and perhaps enhancing performance. Many people may well be employing these qualities to compensate for everything from supermild schizophrenia to some form of A.D.D., or perhaps an inefficient dopamine system.

    Weakness or no (regardless) his examples per human rights (as laid out in the Canadian Constitution, in the instance of his point) drew from needle exchange programs for junkies and legal medicinal green-flower power. These "conditions" (addiction and illness) could both be tagged as "weakness", and yet that weakness has no bearing on our human rights. He says that our government (Canadian, American . . . tomato/tomàhto) doesn't have the right to ban us from self-medicating in a less harmful way when such an opportunity/tech/service is available. (i.e. forcing people to use dirty needles by banning needle exchanges, or forcing people to combust/inhale greens when there's no medical or genuine ethical reason to do so.)

    ↑this, in relation to the point he touches on: wherein you can tell someone to stop doing something that's bad (unhealthy) for them 1000x; but if they are getting something valuable (nay, perhaps indispensable → self medicating for indetectably mild schizophrenia, say) AND no viable, reduced-harm, alternative is presented to them (his fire → exit example) . . . .. they ain't gonna stop.

    In short, the viable and powerful legal stance here is that (regardless of how all this came about, this vape tech, regardless of how it is defined by regulation: i.e. "tobacco product" or "nicotine cessation product"/medicine) there is a viable means of harm reduction available to those who (choose to?) self medicate with nicotine, and it is illegal/"un-lawful" for the government to force us to harm ourselves by depriving us of the tech, or the ability to employ it.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  14. Tommy-Chi

    Tommy-Chi Ultra Member ECF Veteran

    Sep 9, 2015
    Chitown

    In summary the video is an argument for vaping, to those who would abolish it.
     
  15. pennysmalls

    pennysmalls Squonkmeister Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Jul 26, 2013
    Indiana
    I think you connected more to the legal/scientific nuances he pointed to and I got caught up more in the religious ideological aspect. Your post is a great synopsis of the video from the legal/scientific point of view. I liked how he pointed out that we are all trying to alter our consciousness by self medicating, coffee in the morning and alcohol in the evening, sex, jogging etc. Not many people have thought about it all in that context and none of that is governments business.

    I think the weak/unintelligent/junkie image is one that has been enforced by public health and the ideology that the speaker talks about. It's so much easier to go after a group of people who are so lowly, heck public health doesn't have to go after us much anymore, the general public, through brainwashing, does it for them. It's so ingrained in so many people to see smokers as the dregs of society, right along with the hardcore users of what-have-you. And when the dregs of society want something, vaping, then it has to be bad because it's the dregs that want it. So in the minds of those who know better than us smokers, us self medicating with safer alternatives will not be seen as a step forward but just more of the same. Weak junkies still trying to get their fix.

    I know not everyone is as bad as I'm making it all sound, but some are worse.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  16. Hans Wermhat

    Hans Wermhat Vaping Master

    Jun 9, 2015
    Texas
    CCF? That acronym has a different meaning where I'm from. Lol!
     
  17. pdib

    pdib Registered Supplier - Offline ECF Veteran

    Nov 23, 2012

    absolutely. He made some really important points about the cultural and social judgement aspects of this; the "witch hunt" (not his words). He attributed much of the current social attitude to the tactics employed by various legal & health organizations in fighting BT over the years.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  18. pennysmalls

    pennysmalls Squonkmeister Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Jul 26, 2013
    Indiana
    Funny how you mention witch hunt because that's how I see it all. We humans think we're so evolved socially/religiously/philosophically but we aren't. We all think we completely think for ourselves but we don't. *walks off to look in the mirror*
     
    • Like Like x 1
  19. Tommy-Chi

    Tommy-Chi Ultra Member ECF Veteran

    Sep 9, 2015
    Chitown

    I read a lot of news while on Twitter through the application TweetDeck. Whenever I read stories about "medical" I look to see when they think the technology will be implemented. It's always either undefined, unknown, or a decade down the road. We have come a long way over 2000 yrs, but we are still in the Dark Ages in so many ways. One reason why I'm glad I vape now is b/c I do like to have good health, and going under the knife or receiving chemo due to smoking proves just what I'm saying....Dark Ages. These technologies we have for medicine are garbage. Anything I can do to stay out of a hospital or Drs office, I'll take.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  20. Tommy-Chi

    Tommy-Chi Ultra Member ECF Veteran

    Sep 9, 2015
    Chitown

    The first two sentences of my entry are a summary.

    //QUOTE
    A presentation by the CCF to the government, lawyers and doctors of Canada. An argument with regard to vaping as it is a disruptive technology that could save lives.

    The video starts with vaping, then on to disruptive technology of ride-sharing, and concludes with a question and answer period for both speakers.
    //END QUOTE
     
    • Like Like x 1
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