Would an FDA ban halt PS production?

[j4g3rb0mb3d]

Steve and Co.,

I keep sensing that the FDA banhammer will be dropping soon. Should the ban occur, will you continue to make and sell the Prodigy and PT? Would this affect the Protege? Would the looming ban encourage PureSmoker to start production on the Protege sooner?

I do have my eye on the Protege. It will probably be the be all - end all for me. I wont have to haul around five 510 batteries with me anymore, nor will I have to have 2-3 different e-cigs with me. It would be a great product for my e-smoking needs.

I dunno, I'm just starting to get a tad paranoid seeing that companies like PayPal are starting to drop e-cig retailers. The hyper-inflated FDA lab reports seem to be garnishing plenty of negative press, and all of us e-smokers are starting to fear the worst.

 

[Walrus]

Realistically, it shouldn't. Even if Steve had to go so far as to not include atomizers, the Prodigy/Protege itself should be safe. They'd have to ban flashlights as well. Hey... there's an idea. Make a flashlight attachment, and sell it that way. It really is "just" a battery case when you think about it.

 

[Sar]

The problem is that if the ban takes place, the market for PVs is basically gone. Paypal will stop service for the sellers, which may be followed by credit card companies doing the same. Advertising will not be possible or at least very difficult. China manufacturers will scale down production which will also push prices up. Of course there will be some type of underground market where hardware and liquid will be available for premium but I think that will mostly be used by existing vapers. Cigarette smokers are the primary market for PVs and most of them will not go through the hassle of getting a PV knowing that it will be difficult/expensive to get supplies for it. I know I would have used that excuse as a smoker to continue smoking.

 

[Nikko Daniels]

Sar, what you are saying is true to a point, but the FDA has no jurisdiction over the entire world, only the US.

 

[Cayman]

The problem is that if the ban takes place, the market for PVs is basically gone. Paypal will stop service for the sellers, which may be followed by credit card companies doing the same. Advertising will not be possible or at least very difficult. China manufacturers will scale down production which will also push prices up. Of course there will be some type of underground market where hardware and liquid will be available for premium but I think that will mostly be used by existing vapers. Cigarette smokers are the primary market for PVs and most of them will not go through the hassle of getting a PV knowing that it will be difficult/expensive to get supplies for it. I know I would have used that excuse as a smoker to continue smoking.

I would have to disagree with this. The market will not be gone, just the US market. These were in China long before the US. It would just lower their sales a little but China and the UK will till run strong because of their demand.

As far as PayPal goes, they can not stop service unless they can verify what is being sold. PayPal and EBay are one in the same... EBay has already prohibited the listing of them as both companies do not allow their services to be used for tobacco related products. As I have told a few suppliers, I do not recommend them, or their customers, putting anything related to e-cig, e-cigarette, electronic cigarette, etc. anywhere within the PayPal system. For all PayPal knows, you are selling jelly beans.

Lastly, if we do foresee a ban coming, I am sure many of the users and supplies will bulk up on product, mainly atomizers. But there will come a time where someone in the US will start making them if need be. I know several people who are already bulking up on liquid and attys.

Just my opinion on this. J

 

[Sar]

Sar, what you are saying is true to a point, but the FDA has no jurisdiction over the entire world, only the US.

True, but some countries are already banning them and the world listens to the FDA. There are reports of bans being considered now in number of countries because of FDA "findings." Even places like Saudi Arabia made an announcement yesterday: Saudi Arabia to curb ?e-cigarettes? | Qatar Living

FDA has the power to seriously harm or even destroy the industry. If you are, for example, an investor you would probably hesitate putting money into research and development of a better atomizer. If your market is shrinking and you manufacture PVs you will probably not go out of your way to devise better quality control.

Nobody is making serious money from e-cigs in US, so outside of relatively small group of vapers, there is not much concern about any type of financial or political fallout should the ban take place.

Unfortunately China didn't plan this right and I don't think they fully considered the consequences of possible FDA ban.

 

[Sar]

... As far as PayPal goes, they can not stop service unless they can verify what is being sold. PayPal and EBay are one in the same... EBay has already prohibited the listing of them as both companies do not allow their services to be used for tobacco related products. ...

Paypal/ebay are private companies that can create and change their business rules as they see fit. Unfortunately, there is not much protection for a small business to force Paypal to agree to do business with them.

 

[Cayman]

Paypal/ebay are private companies that can create and change their business rules as they see fit. Unfortunately, there is not much protection for a small business to force Paypal to agree to do business with them.

Yes, but I think you are missing my point.... how would they know what you are selling unless you told them? I could open a company up called "Tasty Treats" an sell liquid... how would PayPal know any different? I don't think they would unless they ordere from me.

 

[Sar]

Yes, but I think you are missing my point.... how would they know what you are selling unless you told them? I could open a company up called "Tasty Treats" an sell liquid... how would PayPal know any different? I don't think they would unless they ordere from me.

I am not really sure. I would think that they have some kind of policy compliance department that does monitoring, but that is just a guess. They may not actively go after sellers, but I would say that a business named "Happy Vaper" would be flagged. All this would create just additional level of insecurity in the PV market.

 

[gjrhine]

Yes, but I think you are missing my point.... how would they know what you are selling unless you told them? I could open a company up called "Tasty Treats" an sell liquid... how would PayPal know any different? I don't think they would unless they ordere from me.

They would order from you.

More likely they would just ask you. You give a fraudulent answer at your peril.

 

[titanflyer]

I for one am stocking up now.. not waiting till its too late. I ordered 35 attys and that will be added to my current stockpile of 20 901 and 510 attys I currently have. Liquid is the least of my concern (can make our own with or without nic if we wanted to), followed by batterys because we can certainly get or build those anywhere, and I have a whack of mods like screwdrivers and someday (lol) I will get my PS PassThru...etc. I am not normally paranoid like this, but in this circumstance, my desire to not return to smoking analogs is so strong that money is not an object any more....

I am just about done with this freaking government, all of it... how is it that stupidity floats to the top.

 

[GrimmGreen]

people still make and sell bongs right? i think Steve would be fine.

 

[SharonLM]

I for one am stocking up now.. not waiting till its too late. I ordered 35 attys and that will be added to my current stockpile of 20 901 and 510 attys I currently have. Liquid is the least of my concern (can make our own with or without nic if we wanted to), followed by batterys because we can certainly get or build those anywhere, and I have a whack of mods like screwdrivers and someday (lol) I will get my PS PassThru...etc. I am not normally paranoid like this, but in this circumstance, my desire to not return to smoking analogs is so strong that money is not an object any more....

I am just about done with this freaking government, all of it... how is it that stupidity floats to the top.

LOL, how well I understand this! I have just over 100 901 attys and 26 RN4081 attys and as soon as I get the Copper and decide if I like it (should be coming any day) I'll order more of the RN4081.

I never, never, never want to go back to analogs. Am I paranoid? Not sure. I've been told when someone is chasing you it doesn't mean you're paranoid, you may just be taking cover.

 

[Cayman]

as soon as I get the Copper and decide if I like it (should be coming any day) I'll order more of the RN4081.

Copper???

 

[SharonLM]

Copper???

LOL, yes, it's yet another new mod that's come out. Kind of neat looking and the price is great! Do a search on it and you should find it.

I just went to an overseas dealer and went to the very end of paypal before you click the "pay now" button and had no problems, wonder why? Didn't want to click the pay now button, but it looks OK.

 

[j4g3rb0mb3d]

Realistically, it shouldn't. Even if Steve had to go so far as to not include atomizers, the Prodigy/Protege itself should be safe. They'd have to ban flashlights as well. Hey... there's an idea. Make a flashlight attachment, and sell it that way. It really is "just" a battery case when you think about it.

A flashlight adapter, now that would be ingenious way to get around the ban.

 

[gep]

The Passthrough is just a USB power source isn't it? Nothing Illegal about that....

 

[thenoser]

people still make and sell bongs right? i think Steve would be fine.

this is my thinking as well. i think the law (in california at least) allows the sale of marijuana paraphernalia, but it is technically illegal to own them.

i am hedging that there will be a ban on the nicotine liquid, so that is what i am stocking up on.

 

[CaSHMeRe]

Realistically, it shouldn't. Even if Steve had to go so far as to not include atomizers, the Prodigy/Protege itself should be safe. They'd have to ban flashlights as well. Hey... there's an idea. Make a flashlight attachment, and sell it that way. It really is "just" a battery case when you think about it.

A flashlight adapter, now that would be ingenious way to get around the ban.

Already have flashlight adapters for the USB and Prod ... Its how we test in shop -- Light Turns on -- Good to go. No Light = No power ...

 

[Walrus]

Already have flashlight adapters for the USB and Prod ... Its how we test in shop -- Light Turns on -- Good to go. No Light = No power ...

Well there you go... you list the Prodigy/Protege as is, and list a flashlight attachment separately. If no one orders the actual light, it's not your fault, right? Too bad it's always out of stock