Yet another Tobacco Absolute question..

[Chris77]

Hi all, I've been trying to research how to properly dilute TA. I purchased this:

http://www.ecigexpress.com/diy-supp...tarter-kit-no-nicotine-menthol-crystals-p-988

It comes with "6ml of tobacco Absolute (Diluted 50% in Pure Grain Alcohol)" though the label reads "30ml" for some odd reason.

I've read numerous methods now for dilution. Everything from just add one drop at a time to your mixture, to 1 drop per 4ml of PG/VG solution, to 2 drops per 5ml PGA.

Can anyone inform me as to the best way to dilute this? Will PG+VG work, or is PGA a necessity? Either is fine, I'm just looking for the best solution - no pun intended

Any help is greatly appreciated!

 

[kenetix]

I think it is pretty much up to personal taste. Undiluted tobacco absolute is very very very very very strong. Once it is diluted from the vendor it is stil very strong. Most people that I have read say to put 1 drop per 4-6 ml of base. This again is based on your taste. I have some sitting here that I haven't gotten to yet. My plan is to make about 20 ml as I usually do (vg and ni with distilled water) and then add 4 drops to it and go from there. If it is too strong after steeping (another thing I read tobacco absolute needs at least 1-2 weeks of steep time no less) I will add more base. If it is to weak I will add another drop.

 

[k3vin]

If it I'd diluted you should be ok to use it at a drop per 10 ml or so.
I got the undiluted and I diluted 1/1 everclear ta. Only start with 1 drop or so per 10 ml and work your way up.

 

[markfm]

I don't use the ta diluted as the sole tobacco in a mix. Rather I use it as a tobacco flavor strengthener.

For a strong tobacco I'll use 12 - 15% seedman commercial cigarette concentrate, then add 4 drops of the ta diluted per 10 ml of final eliquid volume. A mellower tobacco would add 2 - 3% of a hazelnut flavoring, and cut the ta diluted to two drops per 10 ml.

The exception is for a couple of mild flavored tobaccos. I use what tpa sells as tobacco blend, which is a ta/ethyl maltol mix. 8 - 10% tobacco blend and 8 - 10% natures flavors vanilla or a fruit.

 

[k3vin]

What mark said, I didn't make myself clear after reading what mark put.
I don't think anyone that I know of uses it as the primary flavor, only an additive.

 

[Chris77]

Thanks for your input, everyone! Very much appreciated!

For a strong tobacco I'll use 12 - 15% seedman commercial cigarette concentrate, then add 4 drops of the ta diluted per 10 ml of final eliquid volume. A mellower tobacco would add 2 - 3% of a hazelnut flavoring, and cut the ta diluted to two drops per 10 ml.

How is your TA diluted? Are you adding 4 drops of 50/50 (TA/PGA) to your e-liquid mixture?

Or, are you diluting down even more from 50/50 before adding to your e-liquid?

I guess that's my basic question- should I store a separate bottle of TA diluted down even further and use that as my flavoring?

 

[markfm]

I user the ta diluted as received from tpa, no further dilution before adding the drops to my mixes.

 

[Chris77]

Thanks!

I think I'm on the right track then, but was unaware that most people used it as a secondary additive - looks like mix #3 will require some additional work!

 

[markfm]

If you have ethyl maltol you can get by without any other tobacco flavoring, since that is what tpa tobacco blend is. The mix proportions are probably listed here somewhere, scubabatdan may have been the person who actually came up with

 

[Chris77]

I do have Ethyl Maltol, and a couple different cotton candy flavors.

My third mix is my first attempt at discovering what TA tastes like. I added 2 drops TA and 3 drops DIYFS cotton candy to a 5ml 60/40 mixture at 18mg. Before continuing, I'll try to find the link you just mentioned and dilute it down to 10ml with that proportion.

My first goal is to find a nice tobacco base before playing with the nuts, caramel, vanilla and such.

I'm on a quest to create a coconut/almond fortune cookie blend with a mild tobacco base

 

[kenetix]

The thing I have noticed about tobacco extracts weather it be TA or just extract is the flavor. Might as well go pick up a hand full of grass out of your yard and stick it in your mouth. Most people have said this to some degree. There is no tobacco taste like combustion of a cigarette. It is just an earthy background flavor. So the best thing now as a vapor to disassociate tobacco and cigarette taste because it will never happen.

 

[Chris77]

True, and good point! Definitely not looking to put together the taste of real cigarette combustion- in fact, only ~7 weeks in and I can tell you I despise both the taste and smell of burning cigarettes.

However, my favorite blends so far (and I've gone crazy trying tons of different flavors from different vendors) are all tobacco based- RY4s, 555s, Boba's, Tobacco Haze, etc. are the ones I really like- that earthy undertone you mention is something I do appreciate, provided it is subdued.

I can't stand fruit flavors!

I'm hoping that when done right, the grassy/hay taste should be quite subdued, and once I've got a good base, I'm looking forward to seeing the effects that nut flavors (Hazelnut for example) along with smoother sweets (Caramel, Vanilla, Toffee, etc..) will have.

I'm here for the journey and totally loving the fact that switching to PVs has become a really great hobby!

 

[panachronic]

I've never understood the comparison between TA and grass. I use TA all the time and I've never tasted grass.

 

[k3vin]

I think the grass opinion comes from the fact that ta has a "green" taste to many people. Like chlorophyl type taste.
I just got some tobacco extract from tpa and it is very gooey and more in my opinion the "dark" taste of the tobacco plant. it is a different type of extraction process from the ta and not bad.
Markfm's recipe as stated above using seedmans commercial concentrate and ta is a really good cig taste.

 

[panachronic]

I think the grass opinion comes from the fact that ta has a "green" taste to many people. Like chlorophyl type taste.
I just got some tobacco extract from tpa and it is very gooey and more in my opinion the "dark" taste of the tobacco plant. it is a different type of extraction process from the ta and not bad.
Markfm's recipe as stated above using seedmans commercial concentrate and ta is a really good cig taste.

I recently tried the TE from TPA as well. I found that I couldn't taste it at all using it at the same concentrations employed with TA. When mixed about 10x stronger, it's pretty good.

 

[Chris77]

One thing that would be nice to approximate is the smell of a freshly opened pack of cigarettes- I think even non-smokers have to appreciate that sweet smell of fresh tobacco. Though, I wonder how much of that is flavor additive when it comes to mass produced analogs...

I've yet to find an e-liquid that provides that aroma. If it did, it would certainly be something to further appeal to smokers looking to kick the habit, and may have a strong psychological effect, even if the taste of the liquid itself was completely different (which would be the case when smoking an analog).

 

[k3vin]

Yes chris and if u haven't tried it yet seedmans tob507 commercial concentrate is what I work with the most and used with just a drop or 2 of ta is a very good fresh opened pack taste.

 

[Chris77]

I put in an order yesterday for TOB506, the 507 (Captain Black) sounds like it would be worth a try. I figured the 507 would have a bit more "spice" to it.

Can anyone explain the difference? Any other seedman's worth having in stock?

 

[k3vin]

Oy I meant 506 I also have the 507, but the 506 is the stuff. I also have the English flavor but forget the
Number.
The 507 black reminds me of my grandpas pipe, but some people say ( and I wouldn't know) that they changed the recipe in it and now it is diff. But I wasn't doing diy then I guess.

I don't really think I have got anything else from seedmans besides those 3 items.. But flavour arts cig flavor I have,and while this is not an all inclusive list, is a good start;
Perique black
Burley
Desert ship
Cowboy

Hope this helps

 

[J**2]

I think the grass opinion comes from the fact that ta has a "green" taste to many people. Like chlorophyl type taste.
I just got some tobacco extract from tpa and it is very gooey and more in my opinion the "dark" taste of the tobacco plant. it is a different type of extraction process from the ta and not bad.
Markfm's recipe as stated above using seedmans commercial concentrate and ta is a really good cig taste.

Ecigexpress.com has tobacco extract that is processed differently and doesn't have the grass flavor.

Below is scubadan's spreadsheet for mixing up tobacco concentrate. Suggested concentration is 10% when used to flavor juice.

Jeff



GG, Provari, iatty2, DIY wannabe chef