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You've got to be kidding.....Tobacco Affidavit

Discussion in 'Law and the E-Cigarette' started by Zee2006, Nov 10, 2013.

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  1. Zee2006

    Zee2006 Super Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Aug 12, 2013
    Cincinnati, Ohio
    My hubby's company is getting ready for their new yearly insurance crap... yeah it's crap... anyway this is a form we're required to sign........

    Tobacco Affidavit Please read the following statement in its entirety.

    I hereby attest that I am "Tobacco-free" and do not use any form of tobacco regardless of the frequency or method of use including cigarettes, pipes, cigars, and smokeless tobacco. If you are using Nicotine Replacement Therapy products (NRTs) including gum, lozenges and the patch, then you may attest that you are "Tobacco-free". You may not attest to being “Tobacco-free” if you use an Electronic Cigarette or “e-Cigarette.”

    I understand that this affidavit may be provided to my employer. By submitting this form, I Consent to its disclosure.

    I agree to the above statement.
    I am using a Nicotine Replacement Therapy product

  2. mgmrick

    mgmrick Ultra Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Sep 12, 2010
    New York
    I agree this is wrong on every front
  3. patkin

    patkin Vaping Master ECF Veteran

    Nov 6, 2012
    Arizona USA
    This is soooooo wrong! I hope it will be challenged if they refuse to honor an insurance claim. It would take someone with the bucks to hire lawyers to challenge it but I hope it happens. And, btw, how the #3LL a are they going to tell what the source of the nicotine was... either patch, gum or juice? That's why they want you to sign, IMHO, because they CAN'T tell.... so, yeh, I hope there are law suits.

    Edit: This has me so burned! I'm going to rant! This harkens back to the days of extreme racial bigotry dictating laws. Its no different than saying you can be married but only if we approve of your choice of spouses. Now sign an affidavit stating you are not in a mixed race marriage. It just goes to show that they are not concerned about insurance costs impacted by health but using it to control your life to suit their prejudices!!!!! If anyone thinks my analogy is a stretch, its not. It happened informally (but upheld by laws) at one time in this country and took the longest to be eliminated in the military where marriages had to be approved before permitted.
  4. MarkyD

    MarkyD Super Member ECF Veteran

    Sep 26, 2013
    Blue Ridge
    Who said an e-cig had to have anything to do with tobacco? Someone is confusing tobacco with nicotine. If they are anti-nicotine, do they not know that 99% of the population tests positive for at least some amount of nicotine in their bloodstream? Vape only fruits and desserts and attest to being "tobacco free"!
  5. patkin

    patkin Vaping Master ECF Veteran

    Nov 6, 2012
    Arizona USA
    The Affidavit says they're okay with Big Pharmacy nicotine. That's precisely why I would love to see this go to court... blatant discrimination.
  6. John_

    John_ Ultra Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    I'd like to see them prove you were using an ecig instead of a patch or gum, oh wait... they can't...
  7. flowerpots

    flowerpots Ultra Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    May 21, 2013
    my desk
    This is happening across the board with private insurance companies through many (if not most?) employers. Some companies are even asking that you proclaim your nicotine-free status before your benefits start in Jan. 2014. So, for example, you cannot quit tobacco now and skip the the affidavit. It applies to anyone insured on the policy. And companies are allowed to charge more per policy for premium payments for those using any form of nicotine. The only way to avoid the increased premium is to join and complete a nicotine cessation program. I think this is crazy for NRT.
  8. Ipster

    Ipster Ultra Member ECF Veteran

    Supporting member
    Oh...Yeah! They're seriously asking for it!
    Some one, IS going to challenge this..and they will win!
  9. Lessifer

    Lessifer Vaping Master Verified Member ECF Veteran

    What happens if you don't sign?

    My company used to give out a non-smokers insurance premium discount, but this coming year they've switched to a corporate exchange that claims that "due to legislation in the ACA, a non-smoker credit will no longer be offered." Which of course is just a BS excuse to not give the discount anymore since the ACA doesn't say anything about not being able to do that.
  10. flowerpots

    flowerpots Ultra Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    May 21, 2013
    my desk
    There are saliva, urine, and blood tests that detect nicotine and it's byproducts at ppm and are allowed to be used to test someone via their GP at annual physical, for example, to confirm nicotine-free status that the insurance company can require this for continued coverage.
  11. flowerpots

    flowerpots Ultra Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    May 21, 2013
    my desk
    I hope so, but I'm concerned.
  12. Chadastrophic

    Chadastrophic Senior Member

    Oct 13, 2013
    Grand Rapids, MI
    Good thing I use a personal vaporizer and not an e cig.

    Sent from my SCH-I605 using Tapatalk 2
  13. Train2

    Train2 ECF Guru Verified Member ECF Veteran

    May 11, 2013
    CA, USA
    That IS messed up. Why the heck would they single out ONE form of nicotine delivery and throw it in with tobacco?
    Because they can, I guess.
    I WISH I were in a position to fight an insurance company over that.
    Plus, I am not using an "e-cigarette". Right now, I am using a VAMO. It's a rolling pin with a battery in it. It's an inhaler. I just like to suck on my flashlight.
  14. Train2

    Train2 ECF Guru Verified Member ECF Veteran

    May 11, 2013
    CA, USA
    One photo would do it.
  15. Mrs C

    Mrs C Ultra Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Aug 27, 2013
    My Hubs job so far is addressing that only with the employee. They will not discount for current NRT. Complete the approved stop smoking program and still have to wait 6 months and pass a screen to see the $200 a month smoking fee come off.
  16. Virtual Life

    Virtual Life Senior Member ECF Veteran

    Jul 23, 2012
    Miami, FL, USA
    Since it specifies an e-cig is not claimable as tobacco free, and you do make such a claim while vaping, they will hose you if something serious happens. Unlikely to make any difference to most people.

    It is wrong, I am not defending them. I believe this is like any job in the sense that if they want you gone they will find a policy you violated, no matter how "clean" you are. There is always something that can hose you, ALWAYS!

    But since when did being wrong stop the powers that be?

    It is very concerning, but will continue to escalate until proof is supplied, which is unlikely to happen soon.
  17. patkin

    patkin Vaping Master ECF Veteran

    Nov 6, 2012
    Arizona USA
    When you have to deal with such obviously evil crap as this, you have to fight fire with fire. Just tell them you use a patch and should you test positive, that's why. Creeps. Good people with good morals have had to do this kind of thing to protect themselves and others over and over again throughout history when such blatant, malevolent, discrimination raised its ugly head.
  18. Virtual Life

    Virtual Life Senior Member ECF Veteran

    Jul 23, 2012
    Miami, FL, USA
    I would probably risk it, but if caught, they will throw you under the bus.
  19. patkin

    patkin Vaping Master ECF Veteran

    Nov 6, 2012
    Arizona USA
    And just exactly how would they catch you. If you've said you use NRT and later are even caught (which is a long shot) vaping which would have to be a photo taken by a, again malevolent little ANTZ, that doesn't mean you lied as far as an affidavit asking for a current statement but that you lapsed afterward. Its called going underground of course but, again, that's what good people have had to do down through history when dealing with such unsavory, sick, people who gained power.

    A good lawyer would run rings around them. Who's to say there was nic in the ecig? So you can't wear a patch and vape zero nic. Not likely but possible especially if you've signed an affidavit. So what does a picture even prove? Not enough in court.
  20. Credo

    Credo Ultra Member ECF Veteran

    Mar 28, 2011
    They can no longer deny or chargre more from people for 'pre existing conditions' (like hypochondria...don't we all know at least one perfectly healthy person, on medicaid, who pretty much LIVES at hospitals and clinics?), higher risk life-style, etc...
    UNLESS it is tobacco (which IS FDA APPROVED).

    Blatant discrimination against nicitine users.

    I think I'll give up vaping and take up several extreme sports. I don't need an affidavit for that!
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