Quick battery charging question

[dom qp]

I couldn't find an answer under battery basics for mods, maybe @Baditude can help?

I just got my Sigelei 150W in the mail this morning and the battery life is great (used 5% in 1 hour of chain vaping).

Am I OK to throw in these nearly full batteries in the charger or will it significantly harm/reduce battery life? I could wait until it's full empty and use a backup, but i'd like to charge it when it's convenient rather than waiting for the bell to toll.

If it matters: I'm using eFest IMR 2500MAH 20A continuous batteries, rewrapped LG HE2s.

 

[Hans Wermhat]

Good question. I'd like to know the answer as well. I occasionally stick mine on a charger when they are only half dead if I know I'm going to be out and about for a while.

 

[Topwater Elvis]

The batteries we use have no memory, it is fine to charge them when convenient, it will do no harm.

Throwing batteries is never a good idea

 

[dom qp]

The batteries we use have no memory, it is fine to charge them when convenient, it will do no harm.

 

[PaulyWally]

@Topwater Elvis, that is what I have always understood but what I have been reading lately is that it shortens the cycle life (how many times the battery can be discharged and charged). I understand that you don't want run your batteries down to 3 volts but on the same token charging batteries that are at 3.9 volts to top them off, does this negatively impact charge cycle life?

What are your thoughts and others on this?!

 

[nyiddle]

It's actually better to charge your batteries at higher voltages if you can. Ideally, don't let your batteries drop below about 3.6V. This supposedly, long-term, will extend the life-span of your batteries. Do not let your batteries drop super-low, as this can damage the cells.

Not only that, be wary of the Sig150's battery indicator. It'll drain your batteries RIDICULOUSLY low if you let it get to the point where it stops firing (around 8% I've found). At about 50% the batteries will be around 3.5V, at 20% they're down to about 3.3V. This is too low. I recommend trying to charge 'em around 50%, which (for me) is a solid days worth of vaping.

 

[dom qp]

It's actually better to charge your batteries at higher voltages if you can. Ideally, don't let your batteries drop below about 3.6V. This supposedly, long-term, will extend the life-span of your batteries. Do not let your batteries drop super-low, as this can damage the cells.

Not only that, be wary of the Sig150's battery indicator. It'll drain your batteries RIDICULOUSLY low if you let it get to the point where it stops firing (around 8% I've found). At about 50% the batteries will be around 3.5V, at 20% they're down to about 3.3V. This is too low. I recommend trying to charge 'em around 50%, which (for me) is a solid days worth of vaping.

To air on the safer side i'll do the same. I think i'll throw them on the charger at night. Thanks for the help @nyiddle diddles!

 

[SleeZy]

To air on the safer side i'll do the same. I think i'll throw them on the charger at night. Thanks for the help @nyiddle diddles!

Don't charge them overnight, even the best chargers can fail. If you decide to still do it, make sure you're charging at a fireproof place. Such as kitchen sink or something.

And for the battery question i usualy charge mine at 3.6-3.7 and sometimes even 3.8 due i'm using them in a mech mod. They're still working great 1 year later.

 

[Topwater Elvis]

IMR /hybrid chemistry batteries full voltage range is between 2.5 - 2.8 volts (depending on manufacturer) and 4.2 volts, both ends of the voltage spectrum have a + / - .05v variance.
Cell specific information can be found on manufacturer spec / data sheets for each battery.

Most if not all manufacturers rate their recharge cycles / life span estimates based on the full voltage range.
We rarely if ever discharge batteries below 3.2v that alone adds useful life to the recharge cycle estimate.

 

[nyiddle]

Don't charge them overnight, even the best chargers can fail. If you decide to still do it, make sure you're charging at a fireproof place. Such as kitchen sink or something.

And for the battery question i usualy charge mine at 3.6-3.7 and sometimes even 3.8 due i'm using them in a mech mod. They're still working great 1 year later.

While I do agree to an extent (I leave my charger on my hopefully non-flammable desk), I've never once heard of a battery discharging, exploding, venting, etc., while on the charger. I could be mistaken.

I charge my batteries overnight often, and I often leave fully charged batteries in my charger. Mind you, it's not a cheap charger (I wouldn't trust a cheap charger to keep me safe).

I suppose we all take our own measures to try and keep ourselves safe.

 

[SleeZy]

While I do agree to an extent (I leave my charger on my hopefully non-flammable desk), I've never once heard of a battery discharging, exploding, venting, etc., while on the charger. I could be mistaken.

I charge my batteries overnight often, and I often leave fully charged batteries in my charger. Mind you, it's not a cheap charger (I wouldn't trust a cheap charger to keep me safe).

I suppose we all take our own measures to try and keep ourselves safe.

Ye better safe than sorry.
I don't use cheap charger either but i personally don't feel comfortable doing it (Granted i've accidently forgot i was charging and then went to bed, but still.)
And most people tend to recommend not charging overnight, i guess if baditude or one of the other experts chime in later they could answer this question better.

 

[dom qp]

Ay,

I meant charging it as I browse youtube or do things like that. Using an I2 here though, did charge overnight the day I got it and my batteries.

 

[Topwater Elvis]

When charging batteries, safe is always better than sorry.
It is best to not charge them unattended or over night just in case.

If you're prone to worry, pick up a pyrex baking dish from the dollar store or yard sale, or a couple pieces of tile from a home improvement store or job site left overs.
Place your charger in / on some kind of non flammable material.

 

[Ou2mame]

It's always a good idea to check the voltage with a volt meter to know how your regulated mod battery meter works. Some of them show empty at 3.5 volts others at 3.3 or even lower than 3 which is really bad for the battery.

 

[Mooch]

I couldn't find an answer under battery basics for mods, maybe @Baditude can help?

I just got my Sigelei 150W in the mail this morning and the battery life is great (used 5% in 1 hour of chain vaping).

Am I OK to throw in these nearly full batteries in the charger or will it significantly harm/reduce battery life? I could wait until it's full empty and use a backup, but i'd like to charge it when it's convenient rather than waiting for the bell to toll.

If it matters: I'm using eFest IMR 2500MAH 20A continuous batteries, rewrapped LG HE2s.

The longer the time a battery spends at the higher end of its voltage range, the faster its aging will occur. This is due to the increased electrochemical activity at the higher voltages, which causes self-degradation. It's recommended to not leave a battery fully charged for long periods if you want the longest cell life. It's one of the reasons why manufacturers ship cells at half charge. But, as you mentioned, it's a lot more convenient to just top off the battery when you can. That's OK.

While always topping off will slightly affect the life of the battery, it's not worth the trouble to do otherwise. The real enemy is heat and charging to much over 4.2V. Discharging down to 3.0V or lower won't fry your cell immediately (the slight damage is cumulative, you need to do it a lot) but if it happens it's best to charge it up, even halfway, as soon as possible.

 

[Baditude]

As others have said, there is no "memory" with lithium batteries. "Topping off" the battery frequently (as opposed to draining it all the way to 3.4 volts all the time) will prolong longevity. Battery cycle life comes most into play with the later course.

Keeping a bunch of batteries in rotation also prolongs battery life. Batteries will benefit from a period of "rest" after charging instead of pulling/using them right from the charger. I have some AW IMR 18650 batteries which I bought nearly 3 years ago which still work well enough to keep them in my rotation. I use 5-6 18650's in rotation for my Provari's. (You can never have too many batteries)

Not recommended to charge overnight or when not at home to monitor charging batteries. If you choose to do so, charge on a fire resistant surface: Kitchen stove top, marble countertop, metal baking pan, pyrex glass dish. Statistically, most reported battery incidents occur while charging.

A good information resource is Battery University.

Deeper Understanding of Mod Batteries & Rechargeable Batteries

 

[Mooch]

Great point about rotation!

 

[PaulyWally]

Lots of good info here. Whenever I buy a mod I always buy new batteries for it (or vice versa ). That coupled with buying batteries whenever I find a decent price on them (Illumn has some VTC4 @ $6ea) keeps me with enough batteries to be able to have quite a rotation. I will head the advice about not keeping the cells fully charged until they are about to come up for a rotation.

 

[speedy_r6]

I wont lie. I charge mine overnight, but I have a spare 50 cal ammo can i use for it. It is in the ammo can on a concrete floor with nothing around it. I do the same with my r/c car batteries. I put the charger and batteries in there, just lower the lid(note: I just lower the lid, not shut it and seal it), and leave it be. If one of them vents, it will all be contained in the can. Any pressure buildup will just cause the lid to open enough to release the pressure. I wouldn't suggest charging them in your room overnight just in case it vents. Only way I would suggest doing it unattended is if you have some way to contain the mess should it have a problem and still have it away from anything that could burn.

 

[dom qp]

Thanks @Topwater Elvis @Ou2mame @Mooch @Baditude @speedy_r6 et al.

I've included a summary of what I took away from everyone's replies. Hopefully this will help someone googling the same questions I had.

Thank you again everyone!


Battery Charging for those new to Batteries

Q. Should I drain my batteries dead before charging?
A. No, this will degrade the battery.


Battery Aging & Degradation

The longer the time a battery spends at the higher end of its voltage range, the faster its aging will occur. This is due to the increased electrochemical activity at the higher voltages, which causes self-degradation. It's recommended to not leave a battery fully charged for long periods if you want the longest cell life. It's one of the reasons why manufacturers ship cells at half charge.

The real enemy is heat and charging to much over 4.2V. Discharging down to 3.0V or lower won't fry your cell immediately (the slight damage is cumulative, you need to do it a lot) but if it happens it's best to charge it up, even halfway, as soon as possible.


Charging Tips

• Use a quality charger and quality batteries.
• It's always a good idea to check the voltage with a volt meter to know how your regulated mod battery meter works.
• When charging batteries, safe is always better than sorry. It is best to not charge them unattended or over night just in case.
• If you do charge them unattended or overnight, it's best to place them on a non-flammable surface or in a non-flammable container: pyrex dish, baking sheet, marble counter top, stove top, or ammo box.
• Keeping a bunch of batteries in rotation also prolongs battery life. Batteries will benefit from a period of "rest" after charging instead of pulling/using them right from the charger.

Additional Resources

Battery University
Deeper Understanding of Mod Batteries
Rechargeable Batteries