California eCig Propaganda War

[blacksmithpro]

So the full on propaganda war against vaping through outright lies and fiction for an entire state is now completely under way. The time to stand up and to counter, hound and make those who spread lies pay a price for doing so is NOW!

We are under attack and this is very real.


If you don’t know that California is a trend setting state then you don’t know your history. New York and California were the first states in America to push for and pass the most draconian anti tobacco laws in the US if not the world and everything spread out from those two states. We MUST counter the lies and do so whenever they are spoken or written.


What is at stake here is not just ecig use in California, it is ecig use everywhere in the world. The lies being told are part of a very well thought out plan and being used by a very well oiled and practiced machine. It’s been used to spread continuous and every increasing lies about combustable tobacco smoke and is now being used to lie about ecigs. These lies will spread like whispers and are already doing so and having the desired effect in that the general perception of ecigs being obviously safer than combustable tobacco cigarettes is falling and doing so fast. The well oiled machine


“The bigger the lie, the more people will believe it” This saying is a universal truth when practiced by mass dissemination of information throughout human history. We live in an age where the ability to spread truth could not be easier. The ability to communicate with other people and to make those who lie pay a price for doing so and those who follow them to see an alternate perspective could not be easier thanks to technology.


Make your voice heard! If you see a lie, counter it with truth, take 5 minutes out of your day to look at the lies being spread on social media and do something about it, the very act of doing so will inspire others to do likewise.


Some background to this so you know what we are up against and who to harass with the truth.


This all started in San Francisco early last month with San Francisco Tobacco Free, an anti tobacco organisation there which started a campaign against the facts of vaping, plastering pictorial banners all over public transportation there. This exposure to lies is a constant bombardment that is unavoidable the general public, to think it has no effect is naivety. San Francisco has 5 known businesses in it selling ecigs and perhaps a 6th that is online only. The reactionary propaganda war that started there is beyond the pale of what is reasonable in reaction to the reality of the market and ecig use in the area.


No coincidence then that the Senator Mark Leno is a representative from San Francisco and is now all over social media and the news proposing a bill to further limit ecig use in the state, spouting lies everywhere he can.


SF Tobacco Free’s Campaign material Ow.ly - profile of @sftobaccofree
@sftobaccofree on twitter https://www.facebook.com/sftobaccofree on FB San Francisco Tobacco-Free their site


Sen. Mark Leno’s words on ecig use to champion his Bill can be seen and heard through links below
E-cigarettes would be banned in public places under California bill | Reuters Proposed California Law Would Regulate E-Cigarettes as Tobacco: Forum | KQED Public Media for Northern CA E-Cig Stigma: California Declares Vaping a Public Health Risk - NBC News Citing public health, Leno seeks more limits on e-cigarettes - SFGate
@MarkLeno on twitter https://www.facebook.com/Mark.Leno.CA facebook Contact Me | Senator Mark Leno website


These lies are also being bolstered by California Department Of Public Health with this http://goo.gl/7J1PJX and this http://goo.gl/4t30ne
@capublichealth on twitter https://www.facebook.com/CAPublicHealth on FB California Department of Public Health website
From that department, an officious liar named Dr Ron Chapman who is quoted all over the negative articles in the links above. Only contact details found for hi are (707) 784-8600 (Office)
(707) 421-6618 (Fax) to his practice, feel free to send him faxes of ecig studies to run his paper out.

No surprise that Ron Chapman resigned from his position a week after his comments in the press though sadly it was not due to his making them but another fiasco he was at the heart of yet somehow, California residents are meant to take this man's word on anything regarding their health? Sad state of affairs when we cannot rely on our media to check the validity of the individual let alone the words coming out of their mouth before putting them out there for the general public to read/hear.


California - Ballotpedia is to a list of all elected representatives for California. Please hound these people with the truth, do not let Mark Leno or the CA Department of Health continue to spread lies and misinformation in order to push the agenda of not just the propose Bill but to help spread the cancer of lies across the world and more and more media publications help spread it across the globe. Hound those media outlets above and where you see them spread the lies, hound the writers of the articles with the truth, make them practice journalism, make them remember who Edward R Murrow is and how they’re desecrating the man’s legacy by not doing research before writing or presenting both sides of an argument so that people can make their own choices based on all perspectives.


More to be added in time and Thank You, please spread the word!


BSP

 

[sofarsogood]

Aren't we anticipating the FDA might propose some rules in June? The increasing volume of propaganda seems like a build up to that, which may or may not influcence the FDA. They are also pusing state and local legislation.

Here is a short report of a state legislative hearing where you will see some of the give and take there might be in lots of state legislatures. We do have more allies than we think. Nevada lawmakers debate whether e-cigs should be taxed like cigars, chew | Las Vegas Review-Journal

 

[skoony]

Aren't we anticipating the FDA might propose some rules in June? The increasing volume of propaganda seems like a build up to that, which may or may not influcence the FDA. They are also pusing state and local legislation.

Here is a short report of a state legislative hearing where you will see some of the give and take there might be in lots of state legislatures. We do have more allies than we think. Nevada lawmakers debate whether e-cigs should be taxed like cigars, chew | Las Vegas Review-Journal

your right. there does seem to be some sort of build up.
the up coming FDA regs are still an unknown and with
the ever increasing spread of vaping coupled with the
newest studies on nicotine showing that its not the
terrible substance its been made out to be there seems
to be a rush to ram through legislation before all the cats
are out of the bag.
regards
mike

 

[sofarsogood]

your right. there does seem to be some sort of build up.
the up coming FDA regs are still an unknown and with
the ever increasing spread of vaping coupled with the
newest studies on nicotine showing that its not the
terrible substance its been made out to be there seems
to be a rush to ram through legislation before all the cats
are out of the bag.
regards
mike

Nicotine has been studied for a long time, so long that I would e surprised if there are new studies but do you know about some may be I don't. Here is a very matter of fact an authoratative news story that touches on the issues about whether nic is habit forming. Study finds nicotine safe, helps in Alzheimer's, Parkinson's | Tampa Bay Times

 

[Endor]

Here is a short report of a state legislative hearing where you will see some of the give and take there might be in lots of state legislatures. We do have more allies than we think. Nevada lawmakers debate whether e-cigs should be taxed like cigars, chew | Las Vegas Review-Journal

Unfortunately, that is Nevada, where rational thinking legislators are probably more likely....

...and it's not the Land of Glantz.

 

[defdock]

if my ecig is going to kill me, with its 3 simple ingredients, then ban robitusin and liquid tylenol and rest of that jazz, since that has the same 3 chemicals +some and i would be drinking "huge quantities" of it compared to the less then 5mls injested by vaping.


if the general public cant teach themselves to read, why should i be obligated to defend them? - as many "truth" articles i can post to combat the "lies", how many people do you think will choose to read the "truth"? let alone believe it since the "lies" out number the "truths"

 

[skoony]

Nicotine has been studied for a long time, so long that I would e surprised if there are new studies but do you know about some may be I don't. Here is a very matter of fact an authoratative news story that touches on the issues about whether nic is habit forming. Study finds nicotine safe, helps in Alzheimer's, Parkinson's | Tampa Bay Times

here's one of interest.
The Great Nicotine Myth

regards
mike

 

[Endor]

To add my ....

It is no surprise that San Francisco is leading the charge on this, with Glantz sitting pretty flinging his FUD at UC San Francisco. Plus, San Francisco (along with Berkeley) are consistently proposing and often passing legislation to control people's behavior. The Soda Tax is a perfect example of this; it passed in Berkeley, but only failed in San Francisco because it didn't meet the 2/3rd vote requirement (55% of the people actually voted yes on this, which is technically a majority).

Unfortunately for California, the northern California/Bay Area tends to dictate the political agenda for the entire state.

Sorry, but I'm starting to feel that grass roots campaigning is not going to ultimately win this. We can continue to beat the drum on personal stories ("It helped me quit smoking"), but in reality, these people do not care one bit about that. Long ago the anti-tobacco movement migrated towards anti-nicotine zealousness, with California at the epicenter. As long as nicotine is present, in any amount and in any liquid, they will be against it. As long as it looks like smoking, they are against it. Period.

I believe that California has more vapor shops and vendors than any other state. Their businesses and livelihood are on the line. Where are they? Why are they not pooling money and funding a professional lobbyist/PR organization to fight for this in Sacramento? They should be stepping up and helping in the fight, yet many are not....

P.S. That San Francisco Tobacco-Free website is the most annoying thing I've seen in a while. So artsy and cute... <gag>.

 

[sofarsogood]

Experienced legislators know that new laws may have intended consequences and unintended consequences. They usually would rather not make laws that cause a lot of problems unless the stakes are very high. As they mull over new laws they will hear more about unintended consequences that are credible. E-cigs are more difficult to control than tobacco. There won't be much respect for harsh restrictions. There are parents who will prefer that their children use e-cigs if that is what it takes to keep them away from tobacco. There will be stockpiling, more use of unsafe devices, black markets, smuggling, and lots of lawsuits nitpicking the new laws. E-cigs are also a very significant business opportunity. States that don't put out the welcome mat won't be getting that investment and the jobs. Another interesting concern I've heard is that cops will use ecig posession laws to profile black kids, credible in my opinion. All this to resist a disruptive technology that makes cigarettes obsolete and will prevail in the end.

I am so grateful for what vaping has done for me (and a brother I got started at Christmas). I have some time and energy to push back.

P.S. I have read that California has 37,000 licensed tobacco retailers. That would include gas stations, party stores, grocery stores and pharmacies.

 

[blacksmithpro]

What may or may not happen with the FDA actually doesn't matter. Their end of things is merely product registration but at a price that removes 90+% of the products from the market because heaven forbid they actually work for a living and have to process product applications from more than a handful of companies for a handful of products. No matter what FDA does, which is not a lot, nothing to do with Tax, for the first couple of years, nothing to do with quality control, ingredients list or anything else, individual states and municipalities will go further. That is where the fight is and the reason for that is the overwhelming majority of US states already spent the projected MSA money coming in annually from cigarette sales by the tobacco companies who were part of the master settlement agreement. Said projected sales and the debts from the loans taken out against them stretch not merely to 2025 but to 2047! This depends upon what share of projected income was sold out to wall street firms for a loan and whether refinancing of those loans was also taken out. The state/municipality budget juggling is insane and the politicians are merely trying to stay afloat and not be the one that defaulted on the loans while in office. If you think I'm kidding on this one How Wall Street Tobacco Deals Left States With Billions in Toxic Debt - ProPublica
Here's the kicker though. The loans can only be paid back with that MSA income. States cannot repay with tax or income from any other source. Here is the state's reasons for not curbing tobacco sales and being terrified by not just ecigs but particularly the growth rate of them. It's not just about tobacco tax, between tax and MSA income from annual sales, States make more money off a packet of cigarettes than the companies making them do! States with MSA loans out simply cannot afford for people to stop smoking and the rate of uptake of ecigs threatens to have them default on these loans faster. There is no way they can ever repay the loans, the default will happen. It is merely a question of when (to quote the article).
It's not just the trifecta relationship, the holy trinity of Government, Tobacco and Pharma interests. They know what they recommend doesn't work for cessation from smoking, they know that the number of people smoking today is about the same as those who were smoking back in the 60s when the surgeon general first announced that cigarette smoking could cause lung cancer, only the percentage has changed because people have been breeding like rabbits. The actual number of smokers has remained about the same while the population number grew. It's not the greedy little self serving anti tobacco organisations scrambling for financial crumbs dropped by that Trinity alliance so they can pointlessly petition against tobacco use while achieving nothing but their continued employ. It's all of it together. It's protecting the sales to prevent from going under, it's protecting the relationships and cycle of conditioned behaviour and control that the metholdology has upon the populace. That includes keeping them ignorant not just of the facts (they did it with Snus and Secondhand Smoke too before ecigs) but to actually make the general public hate these things so there is no objection to the over reaching regulation of them.
The propaganda war isn't building to anything other than the systematic destruction of the industry and general availability of options for ecigs on the open market because of what they threaten. The last 5yrs have been about sewing the seeds of doubt, implanting the notion that these "might" not be as safe as we think they are. Now the gloves are off and they're dropping the "might" "could" "possibly" from their language. Now it is all out "can" "will" so that no one objects to what they're doing.
Look to Washington state for demonstration of this. Up there right now they are proposing a Bill that will decimate and destroy the entire industry in one action, leaving only tobacco company ecig options in gas stations and the like. They're proposing 95% Tax, removal of all flavors other than Mint/Menthol/Wintergreen (tobacco isn't allowed because the person drafting the bill assumes that nicotine comes with tobacco flavor inherently), internet sales and more. This will close every store in the state over night. Provape and any other vendor/manufacturer that could afford to, would move out of state. The rest will close their doors immediately and go out of business. The language of this Bill could also be interpreted to make possession of over 10mg liquid a crime and DIY likewise.
Everyone needs to stop waiting for anything to happen with FDA. The federal sadly means not a whole lot, States and Municipalities are coming at us in a BIG BAD WAY and will continue to do so to protect their interests regardless of Federal age restriction and ingredients labelling with anything and everything at their disposal. The propaganda war to justify their actions has already started and we need to push back, to counter the lies and reach out to the general public in doing so. Ecigs and the issue of nicotine, what can be done with it to the benefit of public health and many conditions, can expose and shine a light on some of the worst things in this world and change it forever for the better of everyone. In this, I very much agree with Rolygate that it's no longer about science, we have enough. Vendors/manufacturers are responsible for ensuring that what they make and sell adheres to the science we have. It's about the public image of ecigs and how they can make them look so they can justify the destruction of all but tobacco company cigalikes because they know that vanilla style with zero options is not too much more effective than NRT, as such, they protect their cycle of income, death & disease and control over the population.

BSP

 

[sofarsogood]

What I've been doing is supporting coworkers interested in quitting, supporting a local vape shop with hardware purchases, writing to a few Michigan State legislators and commenting on lots of news stories where comments are allowed. I might attend some hearings in Michigan though I'm sure I can submit testimony in writing too.

I argue that posession of e-cigs by minor children, off school property, should be decided by parents, not by legal prohibitions. This is practical because nicotine alone is NOT addictive to never smokers and because e-cig flavors make tobacco taste awful. Unless you are trying to avoid relapse or social pressure or trying to quit smoking e-cigs are a waste of time as. I believe most parents would rather have their kids vaping than smoking.