Cellucotton (Rayon) VS. Japanese Cotton (Koh-Gen-Doh)

[CrazyCory564]

I decided to try using Cellucotton instead of my usual Koh-Gen-Doh pads, mainly because I want my pads to not run out as fast.

So I tried wicking my kayfun 3.1 with cellucotton, and boy was I off. I'm so used to the japanese cotton that it was very hard to figure out the right amount so that there would be enough to wick the juice whilst not blocking the channels.

It seems that I have to use a lot less cellucotton than I would normally use for wicking. My first two attempts I had it so that the part inside the coil coild slide a little bit back and forth, but only for a few mm; as it got closer to the sides, it would get tight and caught a little. When trying to vape this, i had to give a hard primer pull after each decent drag or two to get the juice to the coil.

Second attempt I used too little, so it didn't wick as it should have.

Third try, it slid back and forth through the coil with ease for the length of the cellucotton, but just about filled the coil when fluffed out. I Cut it about 1-1.5mm above the top of the bottom chimney section, and gently pushed it down the sides as usual.

Now it is wicking beautifully. I still prefer my japanese cotton, but that is for reasons that are particular to the way I vape. Mainly this is because I use heavier VG juices, and instead of being very absorbant as japanese cotton is, it acts more like a traditional wick by transferring it from point a to point b.

But I will say I am kind of impressed, especially for the price of the cellucotton.

I've heard both great and horrible things regarding using rayon fibers for wicking. What are your thoughts and experiences with it?

 

[seanol]

I found the exact same thing with cotton! I tried every way I could but it just never clicked. I could never vape it low either, the burned wick would cme out of nowhere.

I don't care about one versus the other; just what I can make work. I get a slightly nutty flavor and when I pull my RDA cap the rayon is white. Drip and move on.

I am sure wit the proper technique that cotton would work as well, I just hated the russian roulette feel of anticipating a dry wick. Does the newer stuff give you guys notice when the juice is almost gone?

I now have a TC mod so it may be a moot point. Rayon is chep and easy to find. I have read some subject matter on the safety and find it acceptable comparing what I was doing previous to vaping.

Hopefully this can be a discussion and not a thread bashing.

 

[CrazyCory564]

After using both in my RTA, my feelings are mixed,

When it comes to flavor and vapor density, I am leaning towards the KGD. It gives me great flavor even off the first and second drag, as opposed to having to break in. I take it easy anyway at first to break it in anyway, but that's more so for making sure it's wicking well; not for flavor.

Cotton seems to absorb more liquid, whilst the Rayon seems to be more of a cappilary transporter. Because the cotton absorbs so much juice, there is more juice within the area of the coil, giving me what seems to be more flavor/more dense flavor.

However, Cotton also expands when it absorbs juice. When I'm using a MAX VG juice, I start having some problems with my KGD because it expands and it's a little tougher for air to escape. I keep the juice channels open, but I still have some problems with it wicking/releasing air, but I'm thinking that's more user error as opposed to anything else. I'm going to keep working on the KGD with MAX VG to try to get a good balance of cotton amount as to have it wick properly and keep up with chain-vaping.

Because of that, I seem to be having better luck with Rayon using MAX VG. I use more of it to fill the coil, and then juice it up to make it easy to work with. I cut the tails to the end of the deck, and press it down the sidewall of to the juice chamber so it sticks to the wall and just touches the bottom. It doesn't seem as absorbent as KGD (still wicks well, just differently) but liquid travels through it pretty quickly. Since it doesn't expand when wet, air has a lot easier of a time escaping through it and the juice.

Because I have to use more to fill the coil, the first few pulls I take tend to have a slightly off flavor; It's not like the Rayon is burning, but maybe it's just a little too tightly pressed against the coil. However, after a couple pulls off of it, this goes away (pretty quickly) and I am left with the flavor I enjoy, It is not as pronounced or potent as it is with KGD, but again I think that comes down to how it absorbs the liquid, and it is still satisfying,

Overall I like the KGD a whole lot more, but I also find it a little trickier to work with, Since the liquid doesn't cause Rayon to expand, I don't even have to thin out the tails after I trim them to size; I just press it down the sidewall after it's a little juiced up, and a thin layer sits touching the bottom perfectly,

I hope to become more proficient at wicking with KGD using MAX VG liquids, because the flavor I get is unmatched by anything else I've tried.

 

[CrazyCory564]

Cory, here's a KGD method to increase the wow bro

http://youtu.be/lfOEoLumeR0

no offense, but the only tip I got was removethat outside compressed layer, which I already do. Still better to roll it in to a round shape as opposed to leaving the rectangle, whether you use that layer or not.

also, if you take that compressed layer, and spread it out so the fibers seperate, you have another piece of (albeit thinner) wick. awesome for when you want to use a real tiny coil and not too much cotton

 

[nelsonm64]

Is muji just as good as KGd? I thought about ordering some and it's a lot cheaper than KGd. Isn't all Japanese cotton the same? Does anyone know.

I personally have never tried KGD but, I've heard a few people say that have tried both that it's the same. i'm really liking the muji, much better than cellucotton. wicks awesome

 

[Scotticus93]

I personally have never tried KGD but, I've heard a few people say that have tried both that it's the same. i'm really liking the muji, much better than cellucotton. wicks awesome

Yeah I found the rayon hard to work with. I got some Japanese cotton with my subtank mini and the stuff is so easy to cut and work with so I may switch over. I'm glad I tried everything. Organic cotton balls and rayon. It's good to just try everything. I'll probably still try and use rayon. Just need to figure out how to wick it right

 

[Heavyrocker]

I was using rayon for a few weeks and i switched to Muji cotton and never looked back.I did try a rayon build just a few days ago and i pefer the cotton all the way.

 

[Efektt]

I try and stuff as much rayon in the coil as I can, without distorting the coil... then I cut the tails at an angle. You need to use more rayon then cotton... alot more. When you get the wick in, it should squeak when you slide it back and forth in the coil.

 

[twgbonehead]

I love the rayon, but must admit I never tried the KGD (which was pretty hard to get when I got into the Rayon).
One important aspect is that while you want the coil to be full, you want everything outside the coil to be much thinner. It's very effective at transporting, so thin tails can feed a fat coil very effectively. If the tails are too thick it really doesn't transport as well (not really sure why, but I've found it to be true). Perhaps it adds a "directionality" to the wick?

 

[jaxgator]

What are your thoughts and experiences with it?

My thoughts as well as many others' can be found here: http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...ck-better-flow-flavor-saturation-nic-hit.html

 

[JeremyR]

There are two densities that need adjusting for proper use. The density in the coil and density in the tails. You absolutely need enough density in the coil to remain in contact after the initial 4ml.

Reducing the coil density because the tails are too big will lead to very poor results. And complaints.

You look at the tails and thing omg this is gigantic.. Well what you do is thin the tails down. I thin the tails in my dripper by 80%

1.4 ohm 28g at 6v

 

[Sunburst]

Thanks for that sequence of pictures, Jeremy. That actually answers a bunch of questions I had. Time to rewick all the things.

 

[JeremyR]

I personally like to spread the fiber a bit then roll back into a wick.. You can see how huge the shoulders are... Actually that on is a little to dense in the coil. I forced a lot through.. Which produces the nutty/ woody rayon taste for a while.

If you haven't wicked to the point to taste that you haven't taken it dense enough. Once you get enough density to taste it you know you can go a little less... One easy way is to start pulling strands out till the taste goes away then you right on the money and the wick and coil will last a very very long time. My last one went 180ml on VG..

If you have a burnt taste or to be more specific a coil dry burning, you don't have enough and lost contact.

It is essential to check wick to coil contact at the ends of the coil after 3-4 ml or if you have any problem what so ever.

 

[Sunburst]

I personally like to spread the fiber a bit then roll back into a wick.. You can see how huge the shoulders are... Actually that on is a little to dense in the coil. I forced a lot through.. Which produces the nutty/ woody rayon taste for a while.

If you haven't wicked to the point to taste that you haven't taken it dense enough. Once you get enough density to taste it you know you can go a little less... One easy way is to start pulling strands out till the taste goes away then you right on the money and the wick and coil will last a very very long time. My last one went 180ml on VG..

If you have a burnt taste or to be more specific a coil dry burning, you don't have enough and lost contact.

It is essential to check wick to coil contact at the ends of the coil after 3-4 ml or if you have any problem what so ever.

That answers the rest of the questions, lol. Are you related to Carnack? Thanks. Thank goodness I haven't started yet. I'll have to re-watch your videos too. I have been thinning out the tails quite a bit. That has helped. But I haven't gotten the nutty taste yet and the most dense wick I've made was a pain to get through the coil. I guess I need to twist tighter on the feed side. I've been afraid of breaking the strands so far. Is that a valid concern or doesn't it matter?

Cheers, bud.

 

[JeremyR]

No breaking actually if you grab it close enough its impossible to break. Grabbing it close and pulling both sides will sinch it up and enable you to pull it through easier.. There's a certain finesse in getting enough through.. You'll hear the coil start to speak then pull that all the way through by stretching with a close grip. A far grip will reduce the density if you have too much to pull in with a close pull.

This is a good density after break in for over 100ml potential

You want a shoulder left after the wick settles in. The wick pictured above was fresh and the puffy shoulders have settled in considerably after a day.

 

[Efektt]

JermeyR... you are the ambassador to rayon.

 

[twgbonehead]

JermeyR... you are the ambassador to rayon.

Ummm, Yeah, he is!


Thanks for everything, Jeremy!!!! Rayon rocks!

 

[Rat2chat2]

Sounds like the Three Little Bears story of vaping.

I like the rayon and will try to use what I have but I actually give a slight edge to the Koh Gen Do because it is much easier to wick for me. Both have exceptional saturation. A friend told me about this and said it was just as good as KGD. Just thought I'd pass it along to you.

Amazon.com: Cotton Labo ORGANIC Cotton Puff Size M (200pc): Health & Personal Care

Next coil build I have readyxwick to try and I am so excited.

 

[Debadoo]

Sounds like the Three Little Bears story of vaping.

I like the rayon and will try to use what I have but I actually give a slight edge to the Koh Gen Do because it is much easier to wick for me. Both have exceptional saturation. A friend told me about this and said it was just as good as KGD. Just thought I'd pass it along to you.

Amazon.com: Cotton Labo ORGANIC Cotton Puff Size M (200pc): Health & Personal Care

Next coil build I have readyxwick to try and I am so excited.

I've wondered about this one I know that it's probably safe, but just can't bring myself to wick with rayon. It just sounds awful. lol I know that's silly, but it is what it is hehehe

 

[zer0zer01n]

Interested to read what your experiences with rxw are

Sent from my using my