Nicotine safety

[kenetix]

I have been reading alot of stuff here lately and just realized how crazy we are and all this fearmongering over nicotine. Are most people aware of this:

Acetaminophen (Tylenol) overdose is one of the most common poisonings worldwide. People often think that acetaminophen, a pain-relieving medicine, is extremely safe. However, it may be deadly if taken in large doses. However, without rapid treatment, a very large overdose of acetaminophen can lead to liver failure and death in a few days.

It appears we are more overly protective of nicotine then something commonly sold at any drugstore, gas station, and supermarket. I am willing to bet that the bottle of Tylenol is more available to your dog or kid then the nicotine you have locked up in your gun safe.

I just find it kind of funny that I see people posting about being worried about handling nicotine when more then likely if someone looked in there house we would see stuff that is equally or more dangerous then nicotine being improperly handled.

The Ten Most Dangerous Household Products

Although a variety of things in and around your home can cause poisoning, including plants and foods, ten types of common poison in the household are considered to be the most hazardous. The ten most dangerous household products are:

• Antifreeze
• Bleach
• Drain cleaner
• Furniture polish
• Gasoline
• Insecticide
• Iron-containing vitamins
• Medicine
• Nail polish remover
• Windshield wiper fluid.

Each of these products is a common poison that you may use every day, not realizing the danger.

I think something to consider with nicotine would be similar to caffeine. Yes caffeine in large doses can kill you!

Caffeine overdose

Caffeine is a substance that exists naturally in certain plants. It can also be produced synthetically and used as an additive in food products. It is a central nervous system stimulant and a diuretic, which means it increases urination.

Caffeine overdose occurs when someone accidentally or intentionally takes more than the normal or recommended amount of this medication. In severe cases, death may result from convulsions or an irregular heartbeat.

Do we lock up our can of coffee so our kids can't get it?

Be safe and use good common sense! I think nicotine can be handled in a safe manner! Think about it you use equally deadly of items on a daily basis!

Have a nice day

 

[cigarbabe]

I happen to think that having your nicotine containing products
locked up is a very good thing.
C.B.

 

[Old Chemist]

I just find it kind of funny that I see people posting about being worried about handling nicotine when more then likely if someone looked in there house we would see stuff that is equally or more dangerous then nicotine being improperly handled.

Funny?
Compare the LD₅₀ (lethal dose) of nicotine to that of potassium cyanide:
Nicotine Toxicology
Safety (MSDS) data for potassium cyanide
As we can see - the lethal dose of nicotine is 3 times greater than of cyanide.

Still considering this funny?

I think something to consider with nicotine would be similar to caffeine. Yes caffeine in large doses can kill you!

Really?
Safety (MSDS) data for caffeine
Lethal dose - 200 times greater.
Similar?

[quote/]Be safe and use good common sense! I think nicotine can be handled in a safe manner! Think about it you use equally deadly of items on a daily basis![/QUOTE]
Be safe and use scientific sources. Common sense is not enough.

 

[StormFinch]

All of the things you list were put up out of my children's reach or locked up until they were old enough to be around them responsibly, and none of them that I know of could kill a person simply by being absorbed through the skin in small amounts like nic base can. Personally I'm sensitive to dermal nicotine exposure and earned a nasty nic headache from 60 mg base that had leaked slightly during shipping. It took me less than 10 seconds to get to the kitchen to wash it off. Also, IIRC in the past we had a member lose a dog because it was table surfing and bit into a bottle of mixed liquid while said member was out of the room. Why take chances?

 

[kenetix]

Everything that everyone is posting is my point! We have gotten complacent to typical household poisons. Most people will OD on Tylenol and put nicotine in a gun safe. Guess my whole point in this post was lost....

 

[Old Chemist]

Well I was only referring to this:

I just find it kind of funny that I see people posting about being worried about handling nicotine when more then likely if someone looked in there house we would see stuff that is equally or more dangerous then nicotine being improperly handled.

Nicotine is far more dangerous than any of the other chemicals mentioned.

 

[fray]

I don't think OP was trying to say nicotine was not dangerous. I believe he was saying we should give the same care to other household chemicals that we do with nic regarding storage and labeling etc.

It is certainly more dangerous than Tylenol or bleach.

 

[cookiebun]

All of the things you list were put up out of my children's reach or locked up until they were old enough to be around them responsibly, and none of them that I know of could kill a person simply by being absorbed through the skin in small amounts like nic base can. Personally I'm sensitive to dermal nicotine exposure and earned a nasty nic headache from 60 mg base that had leaked slightly during shipping. It took me less than 10 seconds to get to the kitchen to wash it off. Also, IIRC in the past we had a member lose a dog because it was table surfing and bit into a bottle of mixed liquid while said member was out of the room. Why take chances?

Something I'd been meaning to start a thread on.
Does anyone else think the packaging for high strength nic is totally inadequate?
1 bottle I got came in one of those travel bottles you use for shampoo. Another looked exactly like the bottle of PG that came with it. I think they should have childproof caps, be covered with skulls and crossbones and have heavy duty shrink wrap. Bad packaging is going to get nicotine sales over the internet banned.

 

[fray]

Mine comes in medicine type bottles with childproof caps and full msds triangle as well as skull and crossbones symbol for poison and written warnings.

IMO nic suppliers need these warnings and packaging features as a self regulating measure. Flip top caps with a little label that says "50mg nic" is insufficient.

 

[cookiebun]

Mine comes in medicine type bottles with childproof caps and full msds triangle as well as skull and crossbones symbol for poison and written warnings.

IMO nic suppliers need these warnings and packaging features as a self regulating measure. Flip top caps with a little label that says "50mg nic" is insufficient.

Where did you get your nic from?

 

[fray]

box elder and crystal clear vaping.

Crystal clear vaping does not have the skull and crossbones, but does have a warning in big bold red letters.

 

[Diagasa]

I've had nicotine poisoning twice.... its survivable. Headache nausea cold sweats vomiting... It's basically like the worst flue bug ever. My first time happened with a bad 510 cart that leaked. it dumped nearly a whole cart of liquid into my mouth at once an I swallowed and puke violently there after. The second time came when I got my Silver Bullet... I vaped on it straight for about two and a half hours with 24mg juice while writing a school paper. I went to bed and woke up feeling like complete turds not twenty minutes later. You have to be extra careful with vaping high mg juices. I now only vape 8mg juices and put my pv down after two or three tokes when the cravings get to me.

 

[brittanyNI]

Hmmm. Nicotine is certainly poisonous. So is the saffron in my kitchen that I use on fish. (Saffron contains colchicine -- check out the LD50 on that stuff -- whoa!) I use colchicine for inducing ploidy in plant breeding experiments.

Though I admit it is a bit unusual these days, I have a laboratory at home that I mostly use for bacteria research, but I have a lot of chemicals there too. I'd say most of those chemicals are dangerous to some degree.

In fact, I have big 4-liter jugs of concentrated sulfuric and nitric acids among other intensely dangerous things.

And you know what? They are not equipped with child-proof caps. You know why? Because I am not a child. I'm an adult. I'm not about to pop the top on a bottle of acid and chug it down. I know just by the name on the label "acid" that it is dangerous stuff; and I therefore handle it with appropriate precautions. If I did not know it was dangerous, I'd have no business with it in my possession.

Yep, nicotine is certainly dangerous. And for an adult with a clue, I believe it is labeled appropriately: it is labeled with the substance (nicotine), concentration (50mg/ml) and the carrier (propylene glycol). It doesn't need a child-proof cap, a skull and crossbones or anything of the sort for a mature adult to know better than to take a swig. (Though an enterprising person could use it to make niacin -- a vitamin -- lol.)

My nicotine is in the lab, because the lab has a locking door. I have kids and the kids have always been taught they are not allowed in the lab without being directly accompanied by me or my husband to assure their safety. (Plus, as mentioned, the door locks.) It is not a play-place.

As far as I know, these sorts of materials are not made available to children. Adults need to exercise basic responsibility and care. That's all. No special warnings, impossible-to-remove-caps and so forth are needed. In some cases, these things actually compromise rather than enhance safety anyway by encouraging splashes.

 

[cookiebun]

I don't have kids and really can't stand childproof caps. I refuse to have them when I get a prescription.

I'm concerned about all the people that might come into contact with my high strength nic while it's in transit to me.
What about the safety of the mail carriers, UPS drivers? I've seen pictures on ECF of juice packages that were crushed and dripping with liquid when they arrived at their destination. I happen to like my mail man and UPS guy. I'd feel bad if a package for me caused them harm.

The FDA, BP and BT would love to shut down our little hobby and are just looking for an opening. An innocent mail carrier, package courier sickened or killed by nicotine because some vendor was too cheap or irresponsible to package it adequately would give them the perfect excuse.
To prevent that from happening I'm willing to put up with the most obnoxious clamshell packaging the engineers can come up with.

 

[brittanyNI]

...I happen to like my mail man and UPS guy. I'd feel bad if a package for me caused them harm. ... The FDA, BP and BT would love to shut down our little hobby and are just looking for an opening. An innocent mail carrier, package courier sickened or killed by nicotine because some vendor was too cheap or irresponsible to package it adequately would give them the perfect excuse. ... To prevent that from happening I'm willing to put up with the most obnoxious clamshell packaging the engineers can come up with.

I can't disagree even a little. Hazardous materials should be shipped in a fashion that protects those carrying them.

My husband reloads and orders gunpowder. They won't ship it in the mail but they will via UPS. And let me tell you, when that stuff arrives it arrives well-packaged so nobody gets hurt in transit!

I see no reason why deadly poisons that can be absorbed through the skin shouldn't also be shipped in a fashion that protects the public. We shouldn't even need a law -- it should just be common sense.

As an aside, I have ordered insecticides through the mail that are also contact poisons, and I wish I were kidding but those boxes have arrived with no greater precautions having been taken than a piece of tape having been put over the closure.

So this lack of common sense (or caring or whatever) is not limited to shipments of high strength nicotine.

 

[Old Chemist]

Brittany is right - we have to use common sense and know where to put our stuff. It's not chemicals that are dangerous - it's people that mishandle them.

 

[fray]

Hmmm. Nicotine is certainly poisonous. So is the saffron in my kitchen that I use on fish. (Saffron contains colchicine -- check out the LD50 on that stuff -- whoa!) I use colchicine for inducing ploidy in plant breeding experiments.

Though I admit it is a bit unusual these days, I have a laboratory at home that I mostly use for bacteria research, but I have a lot of chemicals there too. I'd say most of those chemicals are dangerous to some degree.

In fact, I have big 4-liter jugs of concentrated sulfuric and nitric acids among other intensely dangerous things.

And you know what? They are not equipped with child-proof caps. You know why? Because I am not a child. I'm an adult. I'm not about to pop the top on a bottle of acid and chug it down. I know just by the name on the label "acid" that it is dangerous stuff; and I therefore handle it with appropriate precautions. If I did not know it was dangerous, I'd have no business with it in my possession.

Yep, nicotine is certainly dangerous. And for an adult with a clue, I believe it is labeled appropriately: it is labeled with the substance (nicotine), concentration (50mg/ml) and the carrier (propylene glycol). It doesn't need a child-proof cap, a skull and crossbones or anything of the sort for a mature adult to know better than to take a swig. (Though an enterprising person could use it to make niacin -- a vitamin -- lol.)

My nicotine is in the lab, because the lab has a locking door. I have kids and the kids have always been taught they are not allowed in the lab without being directly accompanied by me or my husband to assure their safety. (Plus, as mentioned, the door locks.) It is not a play-place.

As far as I know, these sorts of materials are not made available to children. Adults need to exercise basic responsibility and care. That's all. No special warnings, impossible-to-remove-caps and so forth are needed. In some cases, these things actually compromise rather than enhance safety anyway by encouraging splashes.

I agree with you on your points, but common sense is often lost on some people. A childproof cap may be what prevents a nationwide media campaign against nicotine liquid because some dumby left the bottle down where their kid could get a hold of it.

If you don't like childproof caps you are well within your rights to change the lid when you get it in the mail.

I would rather us self regulate the stuff before it is mandated by law.

 

[Gristle]

Hmmm. Nicotine is certainly poisonous. So is the saffron in my kitchen that I use on fish. (Saffron contains colchicine -- check out the LD50 on that stuff -- whoa!) I use colchicine for inducing ploidy in plant breeding experiments....

I take presription Colchicine to treat gout attacks. Basically you take a pill every hour until it makes you sick. You then have to deal with nausea and ........ for a day.

 

[fray]

I take presription Colchicine to treat gout attacks. Basically you take a pill every hour until it makes you sick. You then have to deal with nausea and ........ for a day.

Ah the miracles of modern medicine. Lol

 

[Kurt]

I totally envy your home lab, Brittany. And I completely agree with you, and OC, its all about common sense and good safety habits. I do hope you let your kids do supervised experiments sometimes...my daughter started helping me do little things in the lab when she was 5. Nothing dangerous, mostly silly and fun, but the environment and experience made a huge impact on her. Now she adores chemistry!

By the way, my MFS and BE nic both came in very safe shipping, and both were labeled such as if I bought them from Sigma, save for the scull and cross bones sticker. Ideally they should have come in bottles in vermiculite in a sealed can, but BE was in plastic and both were copiously bubble-wrapped and styrofoamed. I don't know what the requirements are for shipping nicotine per se, but it would have taken quite a smashing to have a liquid breach. Others are a bit less chemically rigorous in their labeling and shipping.

But I am really hoping the OP is not laughing at clearly important concerns people have about the danger of nicotine. It is far and away the most dangerous substance in my house, at 100 mg strength, and probably my entire row-house block, unless someone has a .... lab. Spill a few 100 mL of that nic on you and you probably will not make it to the shower, which would increase the skin absorption anyway. So now what do you do? Got atropine? And forget about living in your home after that. Would take a hazmat crew in kevlar suits and respirators to even begin to clean it up...and I got that from a hazmat technician who is on ECF.

Besides, this is not a drano forum, or a tylenol forum, or even a trip-and-fall-down-the-stairs forum. Its a nicotine forum. So, gosh, we focus on nicotine! Funny that.