The Milkman Mango Milk & DA/AP?

[PNW-Vape]

Just purchased a bottle of their Mango Milk and I happened to read the following on their website:


"The products on this website may contain the ingredients known as diacetyl (“DA”) and acetyl propionyl (“AP,” also known as 2,3-pentanedione). The National Institute for Occupational Safety and Health, as well as the Occupational Safety & Health Administration, have reported studies showing a link between inhalation exposure to DA and AP, and abnormal lung function and damage to airways, including serious lung diseases. The Electronic Cigarette Trade Association of Canada has prohibited the sale of products by its members that contain more than 100 ug/ml (ppm) of DA, or more than 100 ug/ml (ppm) of AP. However, these chemicals have not been adequately tested for safety when used in electronic cigarettes or vaping in any concentration or amount."

 

[Izan]

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Just purchased a bottle of their Mango Milk and I happened to read the following on their website:


"The products on this website may contain the ingredients known as diacetyl (“DA”) and acetyl propionyl (“AP,” also known as 2,3-pentanedione). The National Institute for Occupational Safety and Health, as well as the Occupational Safety & Health Administration, have reported studies showing a link between inhalation exposure to DA and AP, and abnormal lung function and damage to airways, including serious lung diseases. The Electronic Cigarette Trade Association of Canada has prohibited the sale of products by its members that contain more than 100 ug/ml (ppm) of DA, or more than 100 ug/ml (ppm) of AP. However, these chemicals have not been adequately tested for safety when used in electronic cigarettes or vaping in any concentration or amount."

Hi and welcome,
As smokers, we inhaled those and other chemicals at ten times (usually more) the levels detected in even the worst offending e liquids.
Vaping is a less harmful alternative to smoking (approx 95% less harmful) but it is not an encouraged activity for those that have never smoked.
As an adult ex smoker, I'll take my chances with potentially harmful e cigarettes/e liquids versus confirmed deadly cigarettes.

Did you have a question?
HTH
I

 

[PNW-Vape]

Did you have a question?

Yes, my question was if the juice contains AP/DA.

But since you mentioned it is already present in cigarettes at much higher doses compared to vapes, it sort of
calmed my nerves a bit regarding the possibility of it being in my juice.

Thanks!

 

[Izan]

Yes, my question was if the juice contains AP/DA.

But since you mentioned it is already present in cigarettes at much higher doses compared to vapes, it sort of
calmed my nerves a bit regarding the possibility of it being in my juice.

Thanks!

IMO, they are trying to cover their butts.
If they provide a GC-MS analysis of each juice blend they sell, you may be able to locate the liquids to which they refer. ("may contain...")

IMO, most milk/cream/custard/butter flavors would likley contain those chemicals listed as they are integral to the recreation of the flavor profile.

Popcorn lung has never been diagnosed in a cigarette smoker inhaling those same chemicals (plus thousands more) for decades at exponentially higher levels. I do not believe popcorn lung to be a probable consequence of vaping.

Hope that helps
I

 

[Mazinny]

Popcorn lung has never been diagnosed in a cigarette smoker inhaling those same chemicals (plus thousands more) for decades at exponentially higher levels. I do not believe popcorn lung to be a probable consequence of vaping.

Hope that helps
I

I don't disagree with the gist of what you're saying, except that the bolded part is not necessarily correct. Back in 2014/2015 when Vaporshark published the DA/AP content of the liquids they sold, some liquids had a higher concentration of diacetyl and acetyl propyniol than cigarettes.

 

[Izan]

I don't disagree with the gist of what you're saying, except that the bolded part is not necessarily correct. Back in 2014/2015 when Vaporshark published the DA/AP content of the liquids they sold, some liquids had a higher concentration of diacetyl and acetyl propyniol than cigarettes.

Noted. I should not have made such a blanket statement...I'll remember to be more general in future.

Nevertheless, we still have not had one smoker or vaper diagnosed with any issues directly related to smoking or vaping those chemicals.
IMO, We simply are not exposed to those toxins at levels where we should reasonably be concerned.

Cheers
I

 

[gpjoe]

I look at it this way:

It's called "popcorn lung" for a reason. The folks that were first diagnosed with it were exposed to extreme levels of butter flavoring in a facility manufacturing microwave popcorn. Outside of that, there was ONE publicized case in which a consumer of microwave popcorn claimed to have developed the condition by inhaling the fumes while preparing microwave popcorn at home. It was reported that he ate two bags per day over 10 years.The plaintiff's attorneys convinced the jury that the absence of any other cause was proof that it must have been the popcorn - as evidenced by the factory workers having been stricken - and they awarded him a $7 million retirement check. Other than that one guy, I am not aware of any reported cases outside of the workers (caused by flavoring), so one could argue that his case was an anomaly and he cashed in on the popcorn lung scare even though his condition MAY have been the result of another environmental factor.

Bottom line - Unless it is scientifically proven as a side-effect of vaping, I'm not losing any sleep over it.

 

[Rossum]

It was reported that he ate two bags per day over 10 years.

He didn't just eat them, he also huffed the vapors each time he pulled a bag out of the microwave.

Bottom line - Unless it is scientifically proven as a side-effect of vaping, I'm not losing any sleep over it.

I still think it makes sense to avoid flavors / flavorings that contain large amounts of this stuff. Thankfully, I was never a fan of any of the flavor profiles that did, but some people love them.

 

[gpjoe]

He didn't just eat them, he also huffed the vapors each time he pulled a bag out of the microwave.


I still think it makes sense to avoid flavors / flavorings that contain large amounts of this stuff. Thankfully, I was never a fan of any of the flavor profiles that did, but some people love them.

I tend to agree that there is some question regarding the safety of vaping these compounds. We just don't know the long term effects with any certainty, and each person needs to decide their own comfort level and risk tolerance.

 

[Rossum]

I tend to agree that there is some question regarding the safety of vaping these compounds. We just don't know the long term effects with any certainty, and each person needs to decide their own comfort level and risk tolerance.

Which of course takes us back to the hot question of four to five years ago: How can one make an informed decision if the vendor won't test for or disclose the presence of this stuff in their juice?

 

[Mazinny]

Which of course takes us back to the hot question of four to five years ago: How can one make an informed decision if the vendor won't test for or disclose the presence of this stuff in their juice?

What's ironic is that some vendors who had done the testing, actually removed the results from their webpage after the deemings came out, over a fear that they would be deemed to have made a medical claim of some sort.