What would happen if...?

[PhreakySTS9]

Ok, so i'm just going to state now that this is a really weird question, and yes I DO often think of weird things like this. So I was checking out the list of vendors on the VaperCon site and it had the obvious, no under-18's will be allowed, yada yada. Well this made me wonder... What do you guys think the law would be on a minor that was vaping 0mg nic? Do you think it would be against the law since there is no nicotine going on, or is it the act of vaping as a whole that would be looked at, not the matter of nicotine or not.

For example, if a LEO stopped a 17 year old who was driving and vaping 0mg nic, what do you think the outcome would be. Both morally and legally. I'm trying to decide for myself, but honestly I have no idea which side of the coin I would land on, because on one side they're not using nic or anything, but the act of vaping is still similar to smoking(just by looks to a casual observer, please don't post saying RAWR NO ITS NOT!)

And I am talking ONLY about the vaping itself, not how underages vaping would present a problem to the vaping world, or anything relating to consequences of that nature, purely your thoughts on if a teenager vaping with absolutely no nicotine would be considered morally and/or legally taboo. What are your thoughts?

I told you I tend to think about a lot of weird things, hahaha...

 

[padejash]

I think they would apply the "Shoot first and ask questions later", or "If it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck, then it's a duck" attitude! They would not be able to determine if it was 0mg without testing, so a blanket "No Vaping Under 18 Years old" would probably be enforced.

As an ex 2PAD smoker and now a continuous vaper, I would prefer kids not get started at all. Perhaps by keeping vaping as an "adult" activity it may discourage a few from starting.

My two cents - 1/2 cent after taxes!

 

[erictho]

i think it's a moral issue that plays on a "loophole" in a legal issue.
pvs are mostly marketed as a harm reduction tool. the presupposition there is that one is using it to reduce harm from other methods of nicotine absorption. because of this, and because it can potentially contain an active ingredient, pvs are only sold to those of legal age. once you're an adult, you can choose to legally buy these substances.
so while it may be "harmless" because there is no nicotine, there is still an existing legal issue as it applies to minors.
remember those ecigs that were being marketed as a diet aid? i wonder if they'd be sold to minors as well. i have known some friends of mine, when they were minors, trying to buy smoking cessation aids and only a few pharmacists agreeing to sell it to them. which was kind of funny, cuz these were the same kids whose parents were buying them cigarettes regularly.

 

[Davenkay]

Kids should not vape, smoke or start to do either. Most of us are vaping because we were engaged in an unhealthy and undesirable habit. We are doing this as an alternative to smoking tobacco. With that said, a youngster hopefully has not started the unhealthy habit and should not need the crutch to break it. Not ethical or moral judgment implied...kids just don't need it.

 

[NancyR]

As an ex 2PAD smoker and now a continuous vaper, I would prefer kids not get started at all. Perhaps by keeping vaping as an "adult" activity it may discourage a few from starting.

Ok I can agree I would rather see them not do it, but really did smoking or drinking being an adult activity stop any of us? In most cases that will just make them want to do it more.

To the question at hand tho, I don't think a teen should vape, however that being said, if it where my kid and they decided they where going to either smoke or vape at 16/17, I would buy them a pv.

 

[flintlock62]

I think they would apply the "Shoot first and ask questions later", or "If it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck, then it's a duck" attitude! They would not be able to determine if it was 0mg without testing, so a blanket "No Vaping Under 18 Years old" would probably be enforced.

As an ex 2PAD smoker and now a continuous vaper, I would prefer kids not get started at all. Perhaps by keeping vaping as an "adult" activity it may discourage a few from starting.

My two cents - 1/2 cent after taxes!

So if you weigh the same as a duck..............

 

[Orobas]

My sister in law allowed her 15 year old son to smoke.

My sister in law has now purchased 3 itastes, one for herself, her husband, and the 15 year old.

I don't know how I feel about it, to be perfectly honest. I don't believe she should have complacently allowed him to smoke, in front of her, even; though I can relate from first hand experience that a parent with a cigarette in one hand shaking the opposite finger at you isn't likely to be taken seriously. Nicotine dependency can be just as difficult at age 15 as it is at any other age, and I still hold this to be true while I'm pushing 30 while the majority of other adults roll their eyes and, as usual, regard a teenager's difficulties with apathy.

I don't think it was right for her to encourage or enable him to smoke, but I do appreciate that she is providing the same steps for tobacco harm reduction she herself is willing to try.

 

[Davenkay]

Ok I can agree I would rather see them not do it, but really did smoking or drinking being an adult activity stop any of us?

Why is it that adults can never have any fun reserved only for the adults!!!!

 

[flintlock62]

My sister in law allowed her 15 year old son to smoke.

My sister in law has now purchased 3 itastes, one for herself, her husband, and the 15 year old.

I don't know how I feel about it, to be perfectly honest. I don't believe she should have complacently allowed him to smoke, in front of her, even; though I can relate from first hand experience that a parent with a cigarette in one hand shaking the opposite finger at you isn't likely to be taken seriously. Nicotine dependency can be just as difficult at age 15 as it is at any other age, and I still hold this to be true while I'm pushing 30 while the majority of other adults roll their eyes and, as usual, regard a teenager's difficulties with apathy.

I don't think it was right for her to encourage or enable him to smoke, but I do appreciate that she is providing the same steps for tobacco harm reduction she herself is willing to try.

I started smoking when I was 16 because my dad smoked. He didn't start me on smoking, I was just mimicking him and want to be like him.

 

[PhreakySTS9]

Please keep in mind, that although I was curious on your moral standpoints, i'm also curious as to your opinion on if they would be breaking any laws. I know it's pretty much impossible for the officer to determine it's 0mg, I really meant say you know for certain they're vaping 0mg from a legal standpoint do you think this would be breaking the law. Again, this part of the question is meant to not have any bearing on ow this makes the vape community, or any other moral standpoints, it is a two point question, and I am interested to hear your thoughts on both.

I am more interested in hearing your thoughts on this very specific question of minor, 0mg vaping and it's legality, so please lmk, what do you think?

 

[NancyR]

Why is it that adults can never have any fun reserved only for the adults!!!!

To me that is sorta like saying I raised my kid to be a strong independent person, and then get upset when at 17 they are doing their own thing.

I started smoking when I was 14, I did it behind my folks back, they didn't find out til I was 16, and by then I was no less addicted to cigs as they where. And I am not the only one in the forum who started well before the age of 18, from what I have read most of us did, so why do we expect the next generation to not do some of the same stupid stuff we did.

Legality, I don't see the 0 nic being any different than the 24 or 36 mg nic, vaping is vaping as far as that goes. Also while we know it is safer than smoking we can't say it is 100% safe

 

[flintlock62]

Please keep in mind, that although I was curious on your moral standpoints, i'm also curious as to your opinion on if they would be breaking any laws. I know it's pretty much impossible for the officer to determine it's 0mg, I really meant say you know for certain they're vaping 0mg from a legal standpoint do you think this would be breaking the law. Again, this part of the question is meant to not have any bearing on ow this makes the vape community, or any other moral standpoints, it is a two point question, and I am interested to hear your thoughts on both.

I am more interested in hearing your thoughts on this very specific question of minor, 0mg vaping and it's legality, so please lmk, what do you think?

If there is no nicotine involved, there is no law broken. Look at it this way, vaping comes in more than one form. There are one's that send vapors into a room, delivering simple humidity, or they can have a medication in them like Vick's Vaporub, or some similar concoction. Those are totally legal, they just aren't stuck to one's mouth.

 

[PhreakySTS9]

Thank you, exactly the kind of answer i'm looking for! Keep em coming guys!

 

[YKruss]

What do you guys think the law would be on a minor that was vaping 0mg nic? Do you think it would be against the law since there is no nicotine going on, or is it the act of vaping as a whole that would be looked at, not the matter of nicotine or not.

Can we compare these two acts:
1. Minor drinking O'Doul's
2. Minor vaping on 0 mg nic

Would it be not against the law in both cases or just the first one?

P.S.: possession of vaping paraphernalia is not yet prohibited to minors.

 

[cwolfman13]

As it stands currently, an e-cig is considered a "tobacco product"...this is true regardless of whether the juice has nicotine or not. Tobacco products can not be sold to minors; therefore, I would conclude that it is "breaking the law."

That said, I've never seen a LEO bust anyone for smoking, minor or not...I've only seen them go after the establishment that sells to minor.

 

[Chronic Dripper]

YOU PEOPLE ARE ALL MISSING THE KEY POINT, IT IS NOT ILLEGAL FOR UNDER 18 TO VAPE, OR SMOKE, WHERE THE LEGALITIES LIE IS IN THE SELLING OF PRODUCTS TO MINORS. iF A STORE SELLS OR AN ADULT BUYS CIGARETTES FOR A MINOR THE STORE OR THE ADULT FACES CHARGES, NOT THE MINOR FOR SMOKING. CAN'T BELIEVE THIS GOT BY ALL YOU PEOPLE, I THOUGHT VAPING MADE YOU SMARTER....LOL, AND TO ERICTHO READ THE LAW BEFORE YOU START YOUR MIND WANDERING. OTHERWISE THE COPS OR BYLAW OFFICERS WOULD RUN OUT OF TICKET PADS CAUSE THAT'S ALL THEY'D BE DOING ALL DAY.

 

[PhreakySTS9]

Can we compare these two acts:
1. Minor drinking O'Doul's
2. Minor vaping on 0 mg nic

Would it be not against the law in both cases or just the first one?

P.S.: possession of vaping paraphernalia is not yet prohibited to minors.

Ahhh a very interesting comparison. I do believe that O'Douls is still prohibited to minors, due to the microscopic traces of alcohol that is in it, and for other reasons. I hadn't even thought of this aspect.

 

[PhreakySTS9]

YOU PEOPLE ARE ALL MISSING THE KEY POINT, IT IS NOT ILLEGAL FOR UNDER 18 TO VAPE, OR SMOKE, WHERE THE LEGALITIES LIE IS IN THE SELLING OF PRODUCTS TO MINORS. iF A STORE SELLS OR AN ADULT BUYS CIGARETTES FOR A MINOR THE STORE OR THE ADULT FACES CHARGES, NOT THE MINOR FOR SMOKING. CAN'T BELIEVE THIS GOT BY ALL YOU PEOPLE, I THOUGHT VAPING MADE YOU SMARTER....LOL, AND TO ERICTHO READ THE LAW BEFORE YOU START YOUR MIND WANDERING. OTHERWISE THE COPS OR BYLAW OFFICERS WOULD RUN OUT OF TICKET PADS CAUSE THAT'S ALL THEY'D BE DOING ALL DAY.

Yes, in many places you are correct in that it is not illegal for a minor to smoke(although in many it is), but it is illegal for a minor to buy tobacco, or for somebody else to buy it, or obviously for them to steal it. It is basically a loophole that still amounts to an illegal action somewhere along the line, which is why I specifically left this point out of the equation. I was waiting for somebody to bring this up, I should have just mentioned it off the bat.

 

[flintlock62]

As it stands currently, an e-cig is considered a "tobacco product"...this is true regardless of whether the juice has nicotine or not. Tobacco products can not be sold to minors; therefore, I would conclude that it is "breaking the law."

That said, I've never seen a LEO bust anyone for smoking, minor or not...I've only seen them go after the establishment that sells to minor.

Based on that theory, all vaporizers should be an illegal sale to a minor, regardless of delivery method.

 

[erictho]

holy caps batman. where i live, it is illegal for a minor to purchase and smoke tobaco. so yes, they will get fined.
calm your pants. and no. vaping cannot actually enhance cognitive function, so unfortunately i don't think it's making any of us smarter. i would also remind you it's very rude to make statements about your perceived abilities of other to function cognitively. my reply was structured, and discussed the two facets (moral, legal) of the original topic.