A enjoyable build, within my batteries CDR, dual coil?

[conanthewarrior]

Hi everyone.

I generally use regulated mods, and have enough that I now deem my collection finished, and in the past few months, have been enjoying unregulated mods, and have received two 18650 tube mods I really like, one Copper Victoria Bamboo clone, and a SMPL.

I do enjoy the odd higher power vape session for fun, but this is less often now days.

My main question is this`: What is a suggested, fast heating build for use with a 25R?

I have been having good results with a single 26G coil at around 0.5-6, but would like to experiment with dual coils.

I have tried 24G at around 0.22, and find this does offer plenty of power, and is right near my batteries CDR-I feel slightly more comfortable with builds that don't pull the maximum continuous current from my cells, although this is just me, I understand many do this all the time, and I would be OK as it is not exceeding the batteries CDR.

I have many gauges of wire, so was thinking of a thinner gauge, the problem here is resistance with thinner gauge wire.

Any suggestions for something that performs well, at say 0.4, would be fantastic. I don't want humungous clouds, just something that gets the coils going almost immediately on my mechanical devices.

If this is possible on my mechs, that would be great, if not I can continue with single coils at 0.5.

Thank you all, Conan.

 

[conanthewarrior]

I have tried a .38, dual parallel build, and this seems to fit the criteria of what I want. Slightly lower than I wanted to go, but still well within my batteries CDR.

However, I quite enjoy building, and have many RDA's, so any suggestions for other builds would be fantastic.

 

[puffon]

I like dual coil 26g 7 or 8 wrap on 2.5mm, comes out about .4-.5ohm
Also like to keep the amp draw within about 50% amp headroom.
CDR amp limit does drop, as the battery ages.

 

[conanthewarrior]

I like dual coil 26g 7 or 8 wrap on 2.5mm, comes out about .4-.5ohm
Also like to keep the amp draw within about 50% amp headroom.
CDR amp limit does drop, as the battery ages.

Thank you for the suggestion, I will give this a try shortly.

You have bought up a good point, one that I have not got a clear answer on myself. How do you know when a battery is 'past it'? My oldest cells have all been replaced due to the noticeable difference in capacity, but as you say I also understand the CDR falls as a battery ages.

Say a cell that is charged once daily, how long would you say this is useable, in the safest fashion? I only use my newest cells in my Mechanical mods, but it will be handy to know for my regulated devices too.

I don't often vape at very high power (70-80W being very high power for me, and always on a dual 18650 regulated device, most of my vaping is 40W and under)-just when it is time to recycle will be good to know.

 

[DingerCPA]

Not sure if you've visited Steam-engine.org. That is a great resource for different wire types and builds. I'm like puffon - I prefer to keep my builds so that I don't draw much more than 1/2 the battery's CDR. Although, I don't do a lot with dual-coil builds - perhaps I'm just too impatient

Check the Coil Builds section of the forums - some pretty amazing info there as well: Coil Builds

Cheers!

 

[DingerCPA]

Sorry - you posted whilst I was finishing my post....

Rough estimate is 300 charge cycles on a battery. So, about 10 months of continuous charging/discharging. I have about a dozen batteries through which I rotate - I probably charge 4-6 about once a week. I am finding that I'm charging a bit more often these days. Most of my batteries are less than 18 months old, and through the cycle, are only getting charged about two to three times a month.

 

[IMFire3605]

Thank you for the suggestion, I will give this a try shortly.

You have bought up a good point, one that I have not got a clear answer on myself. How do you know when a battery is 'past it'? My oldest cells have all been replaced due to the noticeable difference in capacity, but as you say I also understand the CDR falls as a battery ages.

Say a cell that is charged once daily, how long would you say this is useable, in the safest fashion? I only use my newest cells in my Mechanical mods, but it will be handy to know for my regulated devices too.

I don't often vape at very high power (70-80W being very high power for me, and always on a dual 18650 regulated device, most of my vaping is 40W and under)-just when it is time to recycle will be good to know.

A battery's CDR is based off its "C" Rating and its Mah. It is rare to see the C rating labelled on batteries anymore, so have to get that info from the manufacturer's spec sheet on the specific battery model. So being Mah rating affects what the CDR is of a battery, every charge and discharge of a battery the mah takes a hit downward, so as the mah rating over time decreases, so does the CDR decrease gradually as well. As you stated, any battery that does not hold its charge as long as it used to when new, this is a sign of the decrease in its mah.

Many like @DingerCPA posted, including myself, most times build on a mech so the amp load is not over 50% total max CDR of a battery due to the decrease is mah and CDR over time. Your 25R's for example, 20amp CDR, you would do a 10amp CDR build, which is about .42ohms (4.2v fresh charge/0.42ohms=10amps), this I estimate is medium abuse of the battery, low abuse would be about a 1ohm load (4.2amps), heavy abuse 0.21 (20amps). Full charge cycle would be charging from 2.5 to 3.0v, half charge cycle 3.5 to 3.8v, most batteries on average can recharged fully about 150 to 200 times, half charges you can get more, thus I shoot for about a 3.7v cutoff, should potentially give you 300 to 400 charge cycles. Light abuse, mostly half charged, the battery should potentially down the road should reach 50% usefulness 10 to 12months down the line, heavy abuse, mostly full charges, 50% usefulness can range from 1 month to 3 months, so higher discharge and faster recharge build up internal heat in a battery, this heat crystalizes and damages the electrolites causing more internal resistance which decreases the mah, CDR, and C Rating.

Many in person ask why I like 26 and 28AWG wire the best, it is due to for my drippers 26awg is resilient enough, has a decent resistance, and gives me plenty of surface area to get a decent build at a higher resistance, I use 28awg in my RTAs, again thinner with higher resistance, and resilient enough in that application, I like .4 to .6 on my drippers, sub-ohm RTAs about .5 to .6, my normal Kayfuns and such 1.4 to 1.8ohm. Not to say I do not like occasionally a hot mech/dripper combo, this instance I use 24awg shooting for .25ohms lowest (16.8amps), but I also use Sony VTC3's (30amp CDR)/VTC4's (20amp but flexible up to about 28amps) and LG HB6's (30amp CDR) for these specific only builds. It's all about balance, finding that balance of good flavor/vapor/safety/battery run time/battery longevity. Just have to experiment, safely, to find your own balance.

 

[conanthewarrior]

Not sure if you've visited Steam-engine.org. That is a great resource for different wire types and builds. I'm like puffon - I prefer to keep my builds so that I don't draw much more than 1/2 the battery's CDR. Although, I don't do a lot with dual-coil builds - perhaps I'm just too impatient

Check the Coil Builds section of the forums - some pretty amazing info there as well: Coil Builds

Cheers!

I have used steam engine from the beginning of my vaping journey, well over a year ago-it is a invaluable tool that I use often, and always recommend it to people for their calculations.

IMfire36505 gave me a great explanation regarding batteries, and how long they are likely to be useful for my needs, and I can see why the half CDR rule is used by many people.

It really depends on my mood-sometimes I can build coils for ages, and even find it quite relaxing, other times I guess I am also impatient and stick to singles myself .

 

[DingerCPA]

Hope I didn't offend - lots of folks build coils, but have not found (or used) steam-engine..... Always like to throw that out.

And yes - GREAT explanation by IMFire. I know enough to be "dangerous"

 

[conanthewarrior]

Hope I didn't offend - lots of folks build coils, but have not found (or used) steam-engine..... Always like to throw that out.

And yes - GREAT explanation by IMFire. I know enough to be "dangerous"

No, of course you did not offend me, I would much rather be told something that I already know or use than the opposite, it's a great resource to use that I still use to this day .

 

[Layzee Vaper]

@conathewarrior
Do you use the heat flux and heat capacity values on steam engine?

 

[conanthewarrior]

@conathewarrior
Do you use the heat flux and heat capacity values on steam engine?

Yes I do, although I will admit I only understand that a higher heat flux, orange or red, is going to be a lot hotter than a lower heat flux in the green area, for my given wattage.

I try to keep it dark green or approaching orange, a higher heat flux results in immediate burnt hits, and below in light green or blue results in too cool of a vape for me to enjoy.

 

[Rule62]

IMO, The Heat Flux function is one of the most important and telling features of Steam Engine. When you fool around with HF, you quickly learn that there's more involved in just ohms, for achieving your personal optimum vape, especially when using mech mods.