Aspire 18650?
- Thread starter State O' Flux
- Start date
- th_trl_thread_readers 0
- Status
$15 a pop !? Ouch! 
Looks like we may be playing the "battery spec" game here again. Continuous or pulse?
Looks like we may be playing the "battery spec" game here again. Continuous or pulse?
The word continuous is no where to be found. They seem fond of the phrases "Super High Discharge 40A" and High Discharge Current". So... nothing for the purposes of a direct comparison.$15 a pop !? Ouch!
Looks like we may be playing the "battery spec" game here again. Continuous or pulse?
Yeah, although I believe this is a problem of the marketing department not getting together with the battery tech engineers in not giving an accurate description of the battery. This sounds like Efest all over again.Personally, I'll never buy an ICR for vaping. Each to their own though
No ICR battery is going to have more than 6 amps output. I'm pretty certain this battery is an IMR/hybrid. Still, I want to know the maximum continuous discharge rating. Just telling me "super high discharge 40A" is not specific or good enough for me. No thank you, I'll pass on this one.
One would think Aspire would get their marketing act together, as vaping consumers are getting more battery smart.
Last edited:
Funny how their test was discharging both the Samsung and LG at a rate neither manufacturer specs their batteries at too.. Of course theyre not going to last, try it at 20A like theyre meant to be. Look at the 1A test, they both killed that Aspire cell.
Cause Sony hates that we use their batteries for vaping and isnt really selling them to anyone but like laptop manufacturers and whatnot now to keep them out of our hands?
When you consider the dramatically increasing number of new vapist/consumers... the majority of which don't spend much time, if any, on "enthusiast" forums where they can develop a solid sense of skepticism for subjective performance claims... and the depth in which Aspire has entered the market (the Aspire US distributor "UVapor" is local to me)... there is definitely a buck or two to be made.
Woo... that may be the longest single sentence I've ever written.
So batteries for suckers? That cant be good. Unless aspire has a plant somewhere producing high drain cells.When you consider the dramatically increasing number of new vapist/consumers... the majority of which don't spend much time, if any, on "enthusiast" forums where they can develop a solid sense of skepticism for subjective performance claims... and the depth in which Aspire has entered the market (the Aspire US distributor "UVapor" is local to me)... there is definitely a buck or two to be made.
Woo... that may be the longest single sentence I've ever written.
Highly doubt it.. And like Efest and their new BS '35A' battery, its amazing that theyve beaten multi-billion dollar corporations that specialize in lithium ion battery chemistry like Sony, LG and Samsung to the punch. Maybe the big three just dont care to go higher, but for some reason I highly doubt it. If there was a way to squeeze out more than a 30amp continuous charge one of them wouldve done it by now even though thats not really what they intended their batteries to be used for.
That cell is only dropping from 1703mAh capacity to 1532mAh when going from 1A discharges to 40A? Never saying it's not possible but I have never seen a cell be that consistent for a 40x increase in discharge current. That plot shows a big increase in voltage under load as the Aspire cell heats up but enough to keep the capacity that high? Would love to test that cell!
Interestingly, on the Aspire web site they use the same list of warnings that Orbtronic uses for their SX30 cell. Could it be the same cell, just allowed to run hotter (with lousier cycle life) so they could up the discharge rating?
Last edited:
I think you've touched on something important.
In my opinion there's no new tech here for these high-amp cells. These cells are rated so high because there are being allowed to heat up way past what the big manufacturers would consider safe for their cells. If the big manufacturers tested, and approved for use, their cells at up to 100C they would have 30A+ rated cells too. Their customers wouldn't want a cell running that close to its failure point though....way too risky to have in a product.
The cycle life when running at the high temperatures is a lot shorter. The big manufacturers want a life expectancy of several hundred cycles so they derate their cells by lowering the CDR and max temp ratings. These 30A+ cells might only last 50-150 cycles with that kind of abuse.
These crazy high temps are just the outside cell temperatures. The internal temperature is much higher before it spreads out to the surface. For me, they are just way to close to the temperature at which thermal runaway begins. There's really no safety margin for things like high duty cycle use (no cooling), high ambient temperatures, short circuits (even quick ones), hot sled contacts, increased internal resistance as the cell ages, etc. A worrisome trend.
Last edited:
I have a question, where does Aspire make these cells at? They don't have a manufacturing plant. Think we can figure it all out from there.
Ground breaking technology doesn't come from a company that doesn't make batteries.
Ground breaking technology doesn't come from a company that doesn't make batteries.
It's weird. The cell is labeled ICR but the Aspire web site describes the cell as a LCO/LMN hybrid. Not a good sign.
I agree. It's not a good sign when consumers know more about battery chemistry than the marketing department.
Some info on the Aspire 18650 from the manufacturer's safety test reports. Interesting stuff, some of it...
http://www.aspirecig.com/uploads/pdf/RZUN2015-1095.pdf
http://www.aspirecig.com/uploads/pdf/EN62133TestReport15PNS0409201001.pdf
- Tests performed April 28th - May 13th, 2015
- Shenzhen Yongdeli New Energy Company, Ltd.
- Model number = 18650D
- Recommended charging = 360mA to 4.20V
- Max recommended charging voltage = 4.25V to 90mA taper current
- Max recommended charging current = 3.6A
- Charging temperature limits = 0C-45C
- Minimum voltage for all tests = 3.0V
- Lithium-colbalt (LiCoO2) cathode
- Aspire talks about this being a hybrid cell but it just seems to be an ICR cell...same as LiPo's. It's marked "ICR".
- Short circuit through approx. 70mOhm load = 125C case temperature at 23C ambient.
- Short circuit through approx. 70mOhm load = 115C case temperature at 55C ambient.
- UN38.3 safety tests show no disassembly, rupturing, or fire for 10 cells short circuited through <100mOhm load and case temp never exceeded 170C. This means leaking or venting may have occurred.
- UN38.3 safety tests for complete discharges at 40A did not result in disassembly or fire. That means leaking, venting, and bursting could have occurred.
http://www.aspirecig.com/uploads/pdf/RZUN2015-1095.pdf
http://www.aspirecig.com/uploads/pdf/EN62133TestReport15PNS0409201001.pdf
- Tests performed April 28th - May 13th, 2015
- Shenzhen Yongdeli New Energy Company, Ltd.
- Model number = 18650D
- Recommended charging = 360mA to 4.20V
- Max recommended charging voltage = 4.25V to 90mA taper current
- Max recommended charging current = 3.6A
- Charging temperature limits = 0C-45C
- Minimum voltage for all tests = 3.0V
- Lithium-colbalt (LiCoO2) cathode
- Aspire talks about this being a hybrid cell but it just seems to be an ICR cell...same as LiPo's. It's marked "ICR".
- Short circuit through approx. 70mOhm load = 125C case temperature at 23C ambient.
- Short circuit through approx. 70mOhm load = 115C case temperature at 55C ambient.
- UN38.3 safety tests show no disassembly, rupturing, or fire for 10 cells short circuited through <100mOhm load and case temp never exceeded 170C. This means leaking or venting may have occurred.
- UN38.3 safety tests for complete discharges at 40A did not result in disassembly or fire. That means leaking, venting, and bursting could have occurred.
Last edited:
Bought an Aspire '40Amp' (which we should know is an utter impossibility)
Beats the living turd out of anything else I have laying around on a mech, by far.
Running a velocity quad coil 24G k @ ~.08 proved too much, it went thermally terminal. Yet did this safely.
Yes I know don't bother explaining the dangers at those near dead short levels. I push everything, always.
Within the course of 20 minutes the heat generated simply melted the cover, I knew at that point what I had done. I half expected some sort of result of the likes. Removed the battery from the Apollo to the concrete to cool, which it did after some time, maybe a couple hours. After a couple days it started to vent or leak.
So all in all I'll give the Aspire a thumbs up, just don't get outright stupid with it as I did. Would I grab another, yup and plan on it. Would I push it beyond reasonable limits again? Nope. Been there seen that.
Beats the living turd out of anything else I have laying around on a mech, by far.
Running a velocity quad coil 24G k @ ~.08 proved too much, it went thermally terminal. Yet did this safely.
Yes I know don't bother explaining the dangers at those near dead short levels. I push everything, always.
Within the course of 20 minutes the heat generated simply melted the cover, I knew at that point what I had done. I half expected some sort of result of the likes. Removed the battery from the Apollo to the concrete to cool, which it did after some time, maybe a couple hours. After a couple days it started to vent or leak.
So all in all I'll give the Aspire a thumbs up, just don't get outright stupid with it as I did. Would I grab another, yup and plan on it. Would I push it beyond reasonable limits again? Nope. Been there seen that.
Last edited:
Good advice
The short-circuit testing for the Aspire was done at about 0.07 ohms.
When I did the retest of that battery it did very well. As long as it's not operated beyond 30A it doesn't seem to get badly damaged. Just wish it wasn't an ICR chemistry battery.
- Status
Similar threads
